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Thread: Prisoner in van said Freddie Gray was ‘trying to injure himself,’ document [W:384]

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    re: Prisoner in van said Freddie Gray was ‘trying to injure himself,’ document [W:384]

    Quote Originally Posted by DaveFagan View Post
    He didn't walk into the van. Remember the lady commented that she thought his
    leg looked broken as they dragged him to the van. They must have dragged him by
    his neck, eh?
    You must have missed the part where he stood on the back on his own and ducked to get into the van.
    I can also understand why you may not have seen it as it has been edited out of many of the videos, almost as if in an attempt to cast a false narrative.





    Quote Originally Posted by Montecresto View Post
    Wtf are you talking about dude, "my side"?? Your side apologises for all police abuse. That side is an obstruction to justice, something the fringe right, hanging from the edge by their fingernails, is keen to cling to.
    Typical nonsense from you.
    I do not apologize for anyone.

    Clearly you have a problem distinguishing between reality and your made up bs.
    Heck, you are even using the term wrongly here.
    Last edited by Excon; 04-30-15 at 09:26 AM.
    “The law is reason, free from passion.”
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    re: Prisoner in van said Freddie Gray was ‘trying to injure himself,’ document [W:384]

    Quote Originally Posted by Excon View Post
    Maybe folks were to quick to blame police.
    I doubt it given the sheer numbers of people your police forces kill either during capture or in custody

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kUpMXYiCI6w

    Your violent law enforcement is basically out of control and being allowed to get away with

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    re: Prisoner in van said Freddie Gray was ‘trying to injure himself,’ document [W:384]

    Quote Originally Posted by flogger View Post
    I doubt it given the sheer numbers of people your police forces kill either during capture or in custody

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kUpMXYiCI6w

    Your violent law enforcement is basically out of control and being allowed to get away with

    You are speaking biased bs.
    Our laws are different and allow such force to be used.
    And as the RT (d'oh!) reporter stated that does not indicate whether or not these deaths were justified or not.
    “The law is reason, free from passion.”
    Aristotle

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    re: Prisoner in van said Freddie Gray was ‘trying to injure himself,’ document [W:384]

    Quote Originally Posted by Excon View Post
    And there may have been reasons for that.
    But it does not automatically make them a contributor.



    Do you think that if it is believed the arrestee is making fake claims they are going to provided medical care?
    That is like a person yelling they can't breath, when yelling that is an indication that they can breath.

    Here his legs appeared limp, but his neck was not. Then he clearly stood on his own and ducked to get into the van.
    An indication he is faking injury.

    Saying they should have based on discovered after the fact injuries does not mean they should have under the known circumstances at the time.
    When found in the condition he later was in, medical response was provided quickly.
    The police admit that they did not restrain him properly, which means even if Gray himself was thrashing about under his own decisions, they contributed to that by not following protocol and not restraining him properly. They also admit that they didn't seek medical attention quickly enough.



    Quote Originally Posted by Excon View Post
    We already know his legs were restrained but he was not seatbelted.
    As for the conditions of the ride?
    As already provided.


    From the 24th.
    Batts said another man who was in the van during the tail end of Gray's ride told investigators that Gray was "was still moving around, that he was kicking and making noises" up until the van arrived at the station. Batts said the man also said the driver did not speed, make sudden stops of "drive erratically."
    Freddie Gray death: Baltimore police prisoner transport under scrutiny - World - CBC News
    And if there is GPS, then we should be able to know for sure.

    Had they followed protocol and restrained him properly, there would be no question as to what happened in the van. But they didn't. So here we are. His neck didn't just spontaneously break. And if he was still screaming and kicking all the way until the van made it to the station...what happened to make him dead? That would suggest that even if he were banging into things intentionally, he didn't sever his own spine at that point. So if the other prisoner is telling the truth, then something happened AFTER the van got to where it was going to end Gray's life.

    So, we're still sorta in the thick of it here, nothing can exonerate the actions of the police.
    You know the time is right to take control, we gotta take offense against the status quo

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    "I should have loved freedom, I believe, at all times, but in the time in which we live I am ready to worship it."

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    re: Prisoner in van said Freddie Gray was ‘trying to injure himself,’ document [W:384]

    Quote Originally Posted by Excon View Post

    You are speaking biased bs.
    The numbers speak for themselves they need no bias in their interpretation

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    re: Prisoner in van said Freddie Gray was ‘trying to injure himself,’ document [W:384]

    Quote Originally Posted by Summerwind View Post
    Please clarify. Are you recognizing that the affidavit is and affidavit of a cop relaying what he claims he was told? Or do you think the affidavit is by the prisoner the cop claims told him that Gray threw himself around in the van?
    I've personally conducted research involving secondary confessions. I've written and presented research on secondary and false confessions. I've read hundreds of articles from academic, news, and government sources. I've assisted with the review of police reports evaluating eyewitness and secondary confession evidence for expert testimony presented at trial. I believe I am qualified to differentiate between a witness statement and the statement of a secondary informant (e.g., a snitch).

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    re: Prisoner in van said Freddie Gray was ‘trying to injure himself,’ document [W:384]

    Quote Originally Posted by flogger View Post
    The numbers speak for themselves they need no bias in their interpretation
    No. You are again speaking biased bs.
    The numbers do not indicate any wrong doing.
    “The law is reason, free from passion.”
    Aristotle

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    re: Prisoner in van said Freddie Gray was ‘trying to injure himself,’ document [W:384]

    Quote Originally Posted by Excon View Post
    No. You are again speaking biased bs.
    The numbers do not indicate any wrong doing.
    The police in the US kill around a hundred times more people per capita than in any other developed nation on Earth

    U.S. Cops Kill at 100 Times the Rate of Other Capitalist Countries | Global Research - Centre for Research on Globalization

    They are not averse to fiddling those appalling figures either

    Police killed more than twice as many people as reported by US government | US news | The Guardian

    I'd call that 'wrong doing'

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    re: Prisoner in van said Freddie Gray was ‘trying to injure himself,’ document [W:384]

    Quote Originally Posted by Excon View Post

    You are speaking biased bs.
    Our laws are different and allow such force to be used.
    And as the RT (d'oh!) reporter stated that does not indicate whether or not these deaths were justified or not.
    Well gawd damn, and Ex sure does love that licence, the rest (that would be rational Americans) want to see reform to the STUPID law then. One way or another, we will prevail, and the police will be held accountable to their departments code of conduct. It's obvious that you condone police abuse. And every time it comes up, you're the out front apologist, excusing, denying, lying, twisting, ignoring, dismissing and blowing smoke!
    Killing one person is murder, killing 100,000 is foreign policy

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    re: Prisoner in van said Freddie Gray was ‘trying to injure himself,’ document [W:384]

    Quote Originally Posted by Ikari View Post
    The police admit that they did not restrain him properly, which means even if Gray himself was thrashing about under his own decisions, they contributed to that by not following protocol and not restraining him properly. They also admit that they didn't seek medical attention quickly enough.
    No.
    You haven't refuted anything.
    Again there may be a justifiable reason for not seat belting him
    And not doing so does not automatically mean they are responsible for his injuries.
    And they did get him medical attention fast enough once they knew he was actually injured.


    Quote Originally Posted by Ikari View Post
    And if there is GPS, then we should be able to know for sure.
    No. GPS is not going to tell you if they were swerving or not or hitting every bump and pot-hole.
    The only thing you are going to get from GPS is position which may allow them to calculate speed.
    But that time line is already online. Link
    So we have a witness who says the driver did not speed, make sudden stops of "drive erratically".
    So unless there is something else that is what we go with.


    Quote Originally Posted by Ikari View Post
    Had they followed protocol and restrained him properly, there would be no question as to what happened in the van.
    Your analysis is after the fact.
    Again, they may have had a reason for not following protocol.


    Quote Originally Posted by Ikari View Post
    So if the other prisoner is telling the truth, then something happened AFTER the van got to where it was going to end Gray's life.
    No. Because it is reported that he went silent when they arrived. So it would have happened on his last thrash.


    Quote Originally Posted by Ikari View Post
    nothing can exonerate the actions of the police.
    That is an assumption.
    “The law is reason, free from passion.”
    Aristotle

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