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Thread: Prisoner in van said Freddie Gray was ‘trying to injure himself,’ document [W:384]

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    re: Prisoner in van said Freddie Gray was ‘trying to injure himself,’ document [W:384]

    Quote Originally Posted by j-mac View Post
    Morning Maggie

    How did you come to these "conclusions"? As far as I know, we haven't seen the autopsy, or the any of the police investigation, so the only way anyone can come to any conclusion is through their own speculation about what they think happened....Remember Ferguson? The instant 'conclusion' was that Wilson shot Brown when his hands were in the air...Which led to the totally false "hands up, don't shoot'' meme, that was proven false....

    If Freddie Grey's injuries were caused by police in the apprehension after his running, and resisting arrest, then yes the evidence will show that, and they are accountable, but if they happened in the van on the way to jail, then we must look at the transport driver, as he is the only one responsible for the custody of Grey at that point...

    Criminalizing policing only serves to ensure that police will not do their jobs. Do we have "bad cops" in the system? Yes, and they should be weeded out, but to use such blanket accusation in demonizing police in general I don't think is correct. We need police doing their jobs in our communities, the alternative we saw last Monday night. Those weren't images that I think make most people feel safe.

    BTW, Now that leaks from the report turned over yesterday to the States atty, seem to say that Grey died from head injuries sustained in the back of the van, and NOT from the arrest, and that is consistent with the report from the other prisoner being transported, that Grey sounded like he was trying to injure himself....I personally don't know, but I haven't made any conclusions yet either.
    Hi, J-Mac. Good to see you!

    If we all here on DP waited for "just the facts, ma'am," it wouldn't be half as fun. Ha! With the information I have right now, I'm jumping to conclusions, true enough. But something happened to this guy, and I don't believe for one NY minute that he did it to himself in an over-zealous attempt to show police brutality. What we do know is that he wasn't properly restrained in the van and that at least one unauthorized stop was made. At least two cops put him in the van, unrestrained. I doubt the driver of the van was the lone LEO in the transport. Could have been, I suppose.

    This was a horrendous incident. Society needs to make sure there's no white-washing and that at the very least! LEO mistakes made here, if any, cost jobs. And if criminal intent is found? Prosecution. We simply can't give coppers carte blanche. We talk about paying the consequences for one's behavior all the time. They must be held accountable. If big IF it's appropriate.


    Thank you, Quazi!

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    re: Prisoner in van said Freddie Gray was ‘trying to injure himself,’ document [W:384]

    Quote Originally Posted by kjwins View Post
    Black communities are being destroyed, & it has nothing to do with " Hands up dont shoot " Police brutality is not a false narrative & how would you know anyway. Do you live there, are you black, have you gone into the heart of the matter. They are ignored by both parties, being forced out of their homes, so their land can be bought for pennies on the dollar. Police use their neighborhood like an ATM, & act like an occupying force.



    Right Wing rhetoric double speak that ignores facts & what is really going on.
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    Shall I continue.
    Hmm, that's still not working, is it? Are you really quoting yourself? How are you going about creating these replies? Just trying to help you post intelligibly. At the moment I can't tell what's a quote, from whom and what is your original content.
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    re: Prisoner in van said Freddie Gray was ‘trying to injure himself,’ document [W:384]

    Quote Originally Posted by Excon View Post

    That is not a confession.
    That is a statement that may or may not bear out.

    No that would be you focusing on this as I never denied it what the Commissioner said.
    But way not to recognize that in your convoluted and extremely biased attempt to cast aspersions.
    It's very much akin to confession. Would you prefer I had said admitted, acknowledged, conceded, affirmed, concluded, accepted. The police chief would know this, you buddy, not so much. Why would the police chief say that upon review, officers violated the departments code of ethics, if in fact they hadn't. That's really stupid. I think you should take Dave's advice a few posts back.
    Killing one person is murder, killing 100,000 is foreign policy

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    re: Prisoner in van said Freddie Gray was ‘trying to injure himself,’ document [W:384]

    Quote Originally Posted by Excon View Post
    Prisoner in van said Freddie Gray was ‘trying to injure himself,’ document says

    BALTIMORE — A prisoner sharing a police transport van with Freddie Gray told investigators that he could hear Gray “banging against the walls” of the vehicle and believed that he “was intentionally trying to injure himself,” according to a police document obtained by The Washington Post.

    [...]

    Prisoner in van said Freddie Gray was



    Maybe folks were to quick to blame police.
    I got tired of embarrassing you in the other thread. I'm going to do it in here now.

    Freddie Gray Update: New Speculation On His Death, And Peaceful Protests : The Two-Way : NPR

    He added that another detainee who was riding in the van told police that Gray was "still moving around ... kicking and making noises" until the van reached the police station.

    That second detainee rode in the police van on the other side of a metal partition that divides its cargo space. When he was picked up, Gray was already in the van.

    Local news WJZ-TV reports that Donta Allen, 22, was that second man – and that he came forward Thursday out of concern over how his comments were being portrayed by both the police and the media.

    "When I was in the back of that van it did not stop or nothing. All it did was go straight to the station, but I heard a little banging, like he was banging his head," Allen said. " I didn't even know he was in the van until we got to the station."

    Saying his words have been distorted by recent reports and that he doesn't think Gray hurt himself intentionally, Allen also told a WJZ reporter, "The only reason I'm doing this is because they put my name in a bad state."

    Allen, who was reportedly taken into custody for a minor offense and was not charged with a crime, also spoke to WBAL TV. He told the station that when he got into the van, he didn't know Gray was already there. He said he heard "a little banging for like four seconds."
    "Political speech and writing are largely the defense of the indefensible. . . . Thus political language has to consist largely of euphemism, question-begging and sheer cloudy vagueness."
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    re: Prisoner in van said Freddie Gray was ‘trying to injure himself,’ document [W:384]

    Quote Originally Posted by fenton View Post
    Again, left wingers claim they represent the poor and disadvantaged, but in reality ignore the plight of people in the inner city continusly in favor for stupid false narratives and catch phrases that can fit on a bumper sticker.
    This I agree with, many Dem's like Obama are fake liberals. But it does imply Rep's are better, when they ignore the plight of people more than Dem's. As for catch phrases do you remember this one " Its Morning Again America" I still laugh at this one, by the ACTOR pres.

    " Hope and Change " has done what for the Black community ? They're disproportionately affected by the policies that have led to the worst " recovery " in our Nations History. Hateful is ignoring the fact unemployment is disproportionately higher for young Black males and most inner city areas like St Louis have been run by Democrats for years.
    Not sure what Obama has done for the Black community, I'm not black & don't live there, but I will take a guess here, & say you don't either. I didn't vote for Obama, I voted for the Green Party & McCain. But your statement ignores the fact that GWB put us in the financial crisis, & affected poor & black communities the most. Now I know Obama didn't do **** about it. But what people should be pissed off the most about is that he let the crooks go. Including GWB.

    More right wing BS that leaves out parts of the whole story.
    Last edited by kjwins; 05-01-15 at 08:58 AM.
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    re: Prisoner in van said Freddie Gray was ‘trying to injure himself,’ document [W:384]

    Quote Originally Posted by Capster78 View Post
    Summer, there are cases all the time of freak accidents that occur where people injure and kill themselves. I was watching a forensic files case where they were investigating how a man had died. They discovered that he had sliped on the tile floor, hit his head on a broom handle which caused a fracture and an open head would. Which he passed out from and eventually blead to death from while he was passed out. Things happen. It seems that this could be one of many things. Freak accident, maybe he was moving around in the van and he slipped or fell while the van was moving and hit his head. Or its possible he was trying to injure himself in order to stay in the hospital rather then stay in the jail until his trial. Its also possible that something may have occurred that we don't know about yet because we don't have all the evidence and there was some type of police brutality. Right now, we really don't know. But don't let that stop people from burning business, killing cops, destroying and stealing property and harassing innocent civilians.
    Absolutely agree that there are incidents of freak accidents. That does indeed happen from time to time. But...

    ...as in the example you provided, freak accidents usually have a single injury, not multiple injuries that are all severe and spaced at spots unlikely to be related from the same accident all around the body.
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    re: Prisoner in van said Freddie Gray was ‘trying to injure himself,’ document [W:384]

    Quote Originally Posted by Excon View Post
    No that would be you and anyone else that claims such nonsense.
    Use of force does not indicate wrongdoing on the part of Police.
    Man, there's a couple of you guys that are slippery like pigs on this. WHO pray tell has criticised police use of force, hmm? People are talking about and complaining about excessive use of force, you know, the kind that would violate the departments code of conduct that the police chief has indeed acknowledged within his department!
    Killing one person is murder, killing 100,000 is foreign policy

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    re: Prisoner in van said Freddie Gray was ‘trying to injure himself,’ document [W:384]

    Quote Originally Posted by CRModeration View Post
    I mean by the release of this testimony that the prisoner heard Gray banging against the van wall, the immediate assumption is that he managed to sever his own neck. This is particularly questionable when there is a definite record of spinal cord injuries done by this particular police force. I would argue that it's less likely that he severed his own neck in such an extraordinary way when there is a record like that that is publicly known.
    Got it! We agree.
    Killing one person is murder, killing 100,000 is foreign policy

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    re: Prisoner in van said Freddie Gray was ‘trying to injure himself,’ document [W:384]

    Quote Originally Posted by MaggieD View Post
    Hi, J-Mac. Good to see you!

    If we all here on DP waited for "just the facts, ma'am," it wouldn't be half as fun. Ha! With the information I have right now, I'm jumping to conclusions, true enough. But something happened to this guy, and I don't believe for one NY minute that he did it to himself in an over-zealous attempt to show police brutality. What we do know is that he wasn't properly restrained in the van and that at least one unauthorized stop was made. At least two cops put him in the van, unrestrained. I doubt the driver of the van was the lone LEO in the transport. Could have been, I suppose.

    This was a horrendous incident. Society needs to make sure there's no white-washing and that at the very least! LEO mistakes made here, if any, cost jobs. And if criminal intent is found? Prosecution. We simply can't give coppers carte blanche. We talk about paying the consequences for one's behavior all the time. They must be held accountable. If big IF it's appropriate.
    I agree...for the most part that is....Just a small point, in Balto, the "paddy wagon" drivers are unaccompanied....So, they are the sole officer at the time during transport with the prisoners...But, I agree, if the cops are to blame then they must be held accountable, however, we are NOT going to get to true "Justice" when everyone from the Mob, to the Mayor already has their minds made up about what they will accept in terms of the facts.
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    re: Prisoner in van said Freddie Gray was ‘trying to injure himself,’ document [W:384]

    Quote Originally Posted by Andalublue View Post
    Hmm, that's still not working, is it? Are you really quoting yourself? How are you going about creating these replies? Just trying to help you post intelligibly. At the moment I can't tell what's a quote, from whom and what is your original content.

    No, its a bit mixed up. Fenton asked me to tell him what was hate in his post. So I just copied & pasted his words. Then he quoted his own words, then I quoted them again. Thanks for the help.

    Sorry for being a butcher.
    “A drug is not bad. A drug is a chemical compound. The problem comes in when people who take drugs treat them like a license to behave like an asshole.” People do drugs because reality sucks, If you want people to stop doing drugs change reality.
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