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Thread: Our climate models are WRONG: Global warming has slowed - and recent [W:437]

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    Re: Our climate models are WRONG: Global warming has slowed - and recent changes are

    Quote Originally Posted by solletica View Post
    Translates to "rush told me that global warming is solely based in politics and predetermined agenda."
    Al Gore has made hundreds of millions of dollars off this fabrication. Nice job.

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    Re: Our climate models are WRONG: Global warming has slowed - and recent changes are

    Quote Originally Posted by JohnWOlin View Post
    Why do people still debate this? I guess time will take care of the ones that do...
    Because people need to be educated on the fraud that is AGW.

    If it wasn't for the people who are standing up to this the United States would be neck deep in destructive and repressive regulations. The destructive Carbon credit legislation that is hurting the economies of States like California would be part of the National landscape.

    Basically, consumers taxed so the Government can fix a problem that doesn't exist. I personally don't like being picked pocket by dishonest ideologues.
    " If no one among us is capable of governing himself, then who among us has the capacity to govern someone else ? "
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    Re: Our climate models are WRONG: Global warming has slowed - and recent changes are

    Quote Originally Posted by solletica View Post
    No, that's not what it means--explain temperature to us in your own words.

    Can't take you seriously if you use and don't know their meaning.
    Wet bulb or dry bulb ? And do you need me to expand on their relationship in reference to humidity and dew point ? Do you need me to plot RH on a psychometric chart too ?

    Just let me know " Mr Science "...


    Quote Originally Posted by solletica View Post
    Explain to us statistical homogenization in your own words.

    Why should we take your "criticism" seriously if you don't even know what you're criticizing
    Fraud and manipulation to arrive at a predetermined conclusion. Pro-AGW fodder for all of the useful idiots out there who think Man is warming the planet and that Co2 is something that should be regulated and taxed.
    " If no one among us is capable of governing himself, then who among us has the capacity to govern someone else ? "
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    Re: Our climate models are WRONG: Global warming has slowed - and recent changes are

    Quote Originally Posted by Fenton View Post
    Wet bulb or dry bulb ? And do you need me to expand on their relationship in reference to humidity and dew point ? Do you need me to plot RH on a psychometric chart too ?

    Just let me know " Mr Science "...




    Fraud and manipulation to arrive at a predetermined conclusion. Pro-AGW fodder for all of the useful idiots out there who think Man is warming the planet and that Co2 is something that should be regulated and taxed.
    Nothing that is occurring with the climate is inconsistent with the science.
    “It is difficult to get a man to understand something, when his salary (or faith) depends upon his not understanding it.”

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    Re: Our climate models are WRONG: Global warming has slowed - and recent changes are

    Quote Originally Posted by csbrown28 View Post
    Nothing that is occurring with the climate is inconsistent with the science.
    I agree.

    What's inconsistent are the claims from the Pro-AGW crowd who base their assertions on manipulated data.

    Who have redifined " Science " according to their arbitrary definitions and who continue to justify fraud because it fits their narrative..

    Their destructive solutions that involve Regulating and taxing a trace gas thats needed for photosynthesis is inconsistent with Science.

    Sorry, but they need to be challenged. If they were left to their own devices every State in the Nation would be under the crushing economic weight of Carbon emission " solutions " that only wind up fleecing the Middle class.

    All one needs to do is look at the destructive effects of Germany's purely ideological dive into solving " Global warming."

    Their " Green revolution " has led to massive subsidies payed for by the consumer through higher energy prices, taxes and fees. Germans back in 2013 already payed the Highest amount for electricity in the World but thanks to their conversion to over 100 percent " renewable energy sources " their utility rates increased another 20 percent.

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    Re: Our climate models are WRONG: Global warming has slowed - and recent changes are

    Quote Originally Posted by Nilly View Post
    It's a good job then that AGW has nothing to do with liberalism and everything to do with science.

    As far as I'm concerned, scientists have a far better track record of not pulling stuff out of their asses than either liberal or conservative politicians.
    But that's the problem, this isn't science. Science produces models which make predictions and those predictions are tested against reality to see if the models are accurate. Virtually none of the models have been borne out by reality. Almost all of the predictions have turned out to be entirely false. That means the models are bad. Credible scientists would reject the models and go back to the drawing board. Climate apologists are not doing that. Scientists are only scientists so long as they are actually doing science. There are lots of people who are not.
    There is nothing demonstrably true that religion can provide the world that cannot be achieved more rationally through entirely secular means.

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    Re: Our climate models are WRONG: Global warming has slowed - and recent changes are

    Quote Originally Posted by Erod View Post
    Good gosh, I've been to Rio Vista. It's an hour-plus drive south of Fort Worth out in the middle of nowhere.
    Hmmm your anecdote/opinion, or the government's MSA definition?
    Which is more credible?

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    Re: Our climate models are WRONG: Global warming has slowed - and recent changes are

    Quote Originally Posted by Cephus View Post
    But that's the problem, this isn't science. Science produces models which make predictions and those predictions are tested against reality to see if the models are accurate. Virtually none of the models have been borne out by reality. Almost all of the predictions have turned out to be entirely false. That means the models are bad. Credible scientists would reject the models and go back to the drawing board. Climate apologists are not doing that. Scientists are only scientists so long as they are actually doing science. There are lots of people who are not.
    Most of the current models to date are accurate to well within 1%....
    Last edited by SlevinKelevra; 04-27-15 at 06:41 PM.

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    Re: Our climate models are WRONG: Global warming has slowed - and recent changes are

    Quote Originally Posted by Fenton View Post
    I agree.

    What's inconsistent are the claims from the Pro-AGW crowd who base their assertions on manipulated data.

    Who have redifined " Science " according to their arbitrary definitions and who continue to justify fraud because it fits their narrative..

    Their destructive solutions that involve Regulating and taxing a trace gas thats needed for photosynthesis is inconsistent with Science.

    Sorry, but they need to be challenged. If they were left to their own devices every State in the Nation would be under the crushing economic weight of Carbon emission " solutions " that only wind up fleecing the Middle class.

    All one needs to do is look at the destructive effects of Germany's purely ideological dive into solving " Global warming."

    Their " Green revolution " has led to massive subsidies payed for by the consumer through higher energy prices, taxes and fees. Germans back in 2013 already payed the Highest amount for electricity in the World but thanks to their conversion to over 100 percent " renewable energy sources " their utility rates increased another 20 percent.
    I'm glad you agree, though I'm not certain what you're implying when you say "a trace gas thats needed for photosynthesis".

    I think there are destructive attitudes at both ends of the spectrum. I like to think of myself as a person who believes that the science gives evidence that the globe is warming and much of that warming can be attributed to increases in C02 and the majority of C02 comes from burning fossil fuels. Having said that I think under and over reaction can have serious consequences. I am much more moderate in my approach to solutions.

    I suspect that we are close to technologies that will, on their own will reduce our use of fossil fuels over the next 25-50 years. I don't think armageddon will occur before then. Mostly though increases in efficiency, electric cars being an example. They still require fossil fuels as about 67% of electricity in the US comes from the burning of fossil fuels. It is much easier to create technologies to reduce carbon emissions at the source, than at the end user.

    Now the debate should be, rightfully so, about how much technology we should pay for to reduce carbon emissions? Should we retrofit Coal, oil and gas plants with costly technologies? Or should we spend money on longer term goals of finding viable replacements like wind, solar, tidal, geothermal and even increase insulation and efficient technologies?

    IMO there is no silver bullet when you consider the costs of making changes. I realize that overly restrictive rules will only lead to people looking for inexpensive ways to subvert the rules. Case in point a friend of the family has a large business in salvaged cars. He can heat his warehouse with reasonably clean natural gas, or when the prices skyrocket he turns it off and kicks on the waste oil heater that burns used motor oil (he obviously gets for free). Costly taxes and restrictions will have a rate of diminishing return as they become more expensive on the general public and I for one realize that.

    Honestly, I think inexpensive common sense ideas are best for existing fossil fuel plants, and R&D for all the other "green technologies" based on real world viability.

    It's a conversation worth having if we could just get the moderates on both sides to ignore the zealots.
    “It is difficult to get a man to understand something, when his salary (or faith) depends upon his not understanding it.”

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    Re: Our climate models are WRONG: Global warming has slowed - and recent changes are

    Quote Originally Posted by Cephus View Post
    But that's the problem, this isn't science. Science produces models which make predictions and those predictions are tested against reality to see if the models are accurate. Virtually none of the models have been borne out by reality. Almost all of the predictions have turned out to be entirely false. That means the models are bad. Credible scientists would reject the models and go back to the drawing board. Climate apologists are not doing that. Scientists are only scientists so long as they are actually doing science. There are lots of people who are not.
    Not sure what "predictions" your speaking about, but can you show me a model that accurately assumed all of the external variables like solar output, the El Nino La Nina cycle, the North Atlantic Oscillation and increases in particulates do to the modernization of India and China (to name a few variable and unpredictable external influences)?

    I suspect that the bulk of the models that have been shown to be wrong made incorrect assumptions about external prevailing conditions, rather than being outright incorrect.

    From here we get into a war of links that attempt to make our points convincing no one because everyone has already decided what they believe and no amount of evidence to the contrary will prove otherwise. Right?
    “It is difficult to get a man to understand something, when his salary (or faith) depends upon his not understanding it.”

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