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Thread: Amnesty International condemns U.S. failure to act on torture report

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    Re: Amnesty International condemns U.S. failure to act on torture report

    Quote Originally Posted by TheDemSocialist View Post
    But Israel is essentially an occupying power controlling what and who can enter both the West Bank and Gaza strip. And its also going to be very hard to convince many people that we should just do what you described in Iraq, because now apparently many on the right wing thought we should of stayed and occupied Iraq for a very long time.
    Israel has been attacked by it's many adversaries every day since 1948. They occupy more area than they were originally granted by Balfour, but such are the spoils of war. That area is no longer occupied territory, it's part of Israel.
    "A democracy cannot exist as a permanent form of government. It can only exist until the majority discovers it can vote itself largess out of the public treasury." Attributed to Alexander Tytler

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    Re: Amnesty International condemns U.S. failure to act on torture report

    Quote Originally Posted by Frodly View Post
    How would that have possibly been any better? We should have never gone in. That is the only reasonable answer. And under a circumstance where going in is a foregone conclusion, having a competent plan for how to deal with a post-war Iraq, and implementing that plan, would be the only option. Instead there not only wasn't a competent plan, there was actually no plan at all. That is not hyperbole or an exaggeration, but simply a statement of fact. We didn't even have a plan for how to secure the country after the war, let alone rebuild it. Instead we allowed Paul Bremer to act with carte blanche and he made calamitous decision after calamitous decision (De-Ba'athification, was probably the most incompetent decision, where any person with any affiliation to the Ba'ath party was removed from government positions, even if they were school teachers. That decision basically jumpstarted the insurgency and isolated Iraqs Sunni population. A move whose consequences are still being felt today). After that point, we hastily imposed a government of entirely incompetent Iraqis, and then tried to avoid political catastrophe in Iraq to bolster Bush's election campaign. We didn't have a real coherent plan for securing Iraq until 2006-2007. So not only was invading at all a terrible idea, we handled the post-war situation just about as badly as was possible.
    The point is that we need an intelligent, consistent military and foreign policy. Quite unlike the one we currently have. We should not only talk, we should do. We should be good to our word and understand who are friends and enemies are. Also unlike the policies we currently have. I am totally opposed to wars of occupation and protracted conflict. Our military is so strong that properly used occupation and protraction should be unnecessary. I could care less and believe that we should not be involved in nation building. We should support the good, crush the bad and then go home.
    "A democracy cannot exist as a permanent form of government. It can only exist until the majority discovers it can vote itself largess out of the public treasury." Attributed to Alexander Tytler

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