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Thread: Amnesty International condemns U.S. failure to act on torture report

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    Re: Amnesty International condemns U.S. failure to act on torture report

    Quote Originally Posted by MrVicchio View Post
    AI is brave when condemning America....
    How dare you criticize 'Murica! 'Murica is never deserving of criticism!
    Just a democratic-socialist in the heartland of America.CHECK OUT MY TUMBLR(BLOG)HERE "Life is beautiful. Let the future generations cleanse it of all evil, oppression, and violence, and enjoy it to the full."

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    Re: Amnesty International condemns U.S. failure to act on torture report

    Quote Originally Posted by TheDemSocialist View Post
    How dare you criticize 'Murica! 'Murica is never deserving of criticism!
    I wasn't. I was mocking this brave organization standing against America cause ya know, we're soooo scary and dangerous to dissenters.
    Climate, changes. It takes a particularly uneducated population to buy into the idea that it's their fault climate is changing and further political solutions can fix it.



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    Re: Amnesty International condemns U.S. failure to act on torture report

    Quote Originally Posted by sawdust View Post
    Obama doesn't want to torture anyone. He doesn't want to capture anyone. He'd rather just drone them to death.

    Oh he wants to do both. The only difference is, we used to torture directly and we used to do extraordinary rendition so someone else could torture people for us. Now we just do the latter, but not the former. It isn't really an improvement, it just adds a layer of deniability.
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    Re: Amnesty International condemns U.S. failure to act on torture report

    Quote Originally Posted by MrVicchio View Post
    I wasn't. I was mocking this brave organization standing against America cause ya know, we're soooo scary and dangerous to dissenters.

    Have you not seen the videos of what happens to protestors? Police beat protestors, its just that idiots pretend it is justified, because it isn't happening to them. Is the American government as overtly violent towards its own people as many dictatorships? Of course not. Firstly because our government has far more sophisticated methods of control. However, even when those break down, and our government does use violence, they keep the violence hidden from public view.
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    Re: Amnesty International condemns U.S. failure to act on torture report

    Quote Originally Posted by Frodly View Post
    Have you not seen the videos of what happens to protestors? Police beat protestors, its just that idiots pretend it is justified, because it isn't happening to them. Is the American government as overtly violent towards its own people as many dictatorships? Of course not. Firstly because our government has far more sophisticated methods of control. However, even when those break down, and our government does use violence, they keep the violence hidden from public view.
    Its... a CONSPIRACY!
    Climate, changes. It takes a particularly uneducated population to buy into the idea that it's their fault climate is changing and further political solutions can fix it.



  6. #16
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    Re: Amnesty International condemns U.S. failure to act on torture report

    Quote Originally Posted by TheDemSocialist View Post
    How? How do you realistically fight a force that hides in rural ares (oftten rugged covered areas), adapts to the population, wins a lot of the populations support? What does this actually mean? Is a simple bombing run on Talibani camps it? Or more? What?

    We rolled through Kuwait and Into Iraq in Gulf 1 stopping short of Bagdad, which at the time I thought was the right thing to do. We rolled through Bagdad in Gulf 2. We should have stopped there and declared victory and left. If Hussain had come back to power, he would have been our lap dog because of the threat we posed. Protracted war with no popular local support is not something we can ever win. We should never make our goal killing an individual with an army. Israeli's do it right. We are big and clumsy.
    "A democracy cannot exist as a permanent form of government. It can only exist until the majority discovers it can vote itself largess out of the public treasury." Attributed to Alexander Tytler

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    Re: Amnesty International condemns U.S. failure to act on torture report

    Quote Originally Posted by MrVicchio View Post
    Its... a CONSPIRACY!

    Is it? Where does the conspiracy come in? Of course there is no conspiracy. You just have no argument to make, so you fall back on mindless attempts to distract from the issue, because nowhere in my post did I ever imply or state a conspiracy was taking place. However, if you don't think it is happening, here is some evidence to the contrary.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OQy-psNy2L4


    How about this one? Clearly the protestors initiate the violence here!!

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B_f06VQOkI4

    We live in a virtual police state, but surveillance, self policing, and propaganda are the main tools of control. Violence is only used under particular circumstances. Especially when they can beat peaceful protestors and people like you won't care. I mean the dirty hippies deserve it anyways, right!!
    I'm a Tarte, what!! You want some of this??

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    Re: Amnesty International condemns U.S. failure to act on torture report

    Quote Originally Posted by sawdust View Post
    We rolled through Kuwait and Into Iraq in Gulf 1 stopping short of Bagdad, which at the time I thought was the right thing to do. We rolled through Bagdad in Gulf 2. We should have stopped there and declared victory and left. If Hussain had come back to power, he would have been our lap dog because of the threat we posed. Protracted war with no popular local support is not something we can ever win. We should never make our goal killing an individual with an army. Israeli's do it right. We are big and clumsy.

    How would that have possibly been any better? We should have never gone in. That is the only reasonable answer. And under a circumstance where going in is a foregone conclusion, having a competent plan for how to deal with a post-war Iraq, and implementing that plan, would be the only option. Instead there not only wasn't a competent plan, there was actually no plan at all. That is not hyperbole or an exaggeration, but simply a statement of fact. We didn't even have a plan for how to secure the country after the war, let alone rebuild it. Instead we allowed Paul Bremer to act with carte blanche and he made calamitous decision after calamitous decision (De-Ba'athification, was probably the most incompetent decision, where any person with any affiliation to the Ba'ath party was removed from government positions, even if they were school teachers. That decision basically jumpstarted the insurgency and isolated Iraqs Sunni population. A move whose consequences are still being felt today). After that point, we hastily imposed a government of entirely incompetent Iraqis, and then tried to avoid political catastrophe in Iraq to bolster Bush's election campaign. We didn't have a real coherent plan for securing Iraq until 2006-2007. So not only was invading at all a terrible idea, we handled the post-war situation just about as badly as was possible.
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  9. #19
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    Re: Amnesty International condemns U.S. failure to act on torture report

    Quote Originally Posted by sawdust View Post
    We rolled through Kuwait and Into Iraq in Gulf 1 stopping short of Bagdad, which at the time I thought was the right thing to do. We rolled through Bagdad in Gulf 2. We should have stopped there and declared victory and left. If Hussain had come back to power, he would have been our lap dog because of the threat we posed. Protracted war with no popular local support is not something we can ever win. We should never make our goal killing an individual with an army. Israeli's do it right. We are big and clumsy.
    But Israel is essentially an occupying power controlling what and who can enter both the West Bank and Gaza strip. And its also going to be very hard to convince many people that we should just do what you described in Iraq, because now apparently many on the right wing thought we should of stayed and occupied Iraq for a very long time.
    Just a democratic-socialist in the heartland of America.CHECK OUT MY TUMBLR(BLOG)HERE "Life is beautiful. Let the future generations cleanse it of all evil, oppression, and violence, and enjoy it to the full."

  10. #20
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    Re: Amnesty International condemns U.S. failure to act on torture report

    Quote Originally Posted by Frodly View Post
    Is it? Where does the conspiracy come in? Of course there is no conspiracy. You just have no argument to make, so you fall back on mindless attempts to distract from the issue, because nowhere in my post did I ever imply or state a conspiracy was taking place. However, if you don't think it is happening, here is some evidence to the contrary.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OQy-psNy2L4


    How about this one? Clearly the protestors initiate the violence here!!

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B_f06VQOkI4

    We live in a virtual police state, but surveillance, self policing, and propaganda are the main tools of control. Violence is only used under particular circumstances. Especially when they can beat peaceful protestors and people like you won't care. I mean the dirty hippies deserve it anyways, right!!
    You have emergency stores of tin foil on hand dont you?
    Climate, changes. It takes a particularly uneducated population to buy into the idea that it's their fault climate is changing and further political solutions can fix it.



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