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Thread: One-year-old shot dead by 3-year old in Cleveland home.

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    Re: One-year-old shot dead by 3-year old in Cleveland home.

    Quote Originally Posted by Jerry View Post
    This is a perfect example of what I'm talking about. The study cited did not reach the conclusion the news article is presenting. Here is that study, here is it's conclusion:


    The study is saying if you were a victim of a gunshot then you're likely going to be a victim of violence again. This study said nothing about suicide other than suicide by gun is more likely to succeed. My source did not contradict this. My source said if you're denied a gun you'll just find some other way to kill yourself.
    Suicide is three times more likely to be attempted and to be successful with a gun in the house. I didn't write the studies I just presented them. By all means feel free to take up their conclusions with their authors

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    Re: One-year-old shot dead by 3-year old in Cleveland home.

    Quote Originally Posted by Goshin View Post
    Ditto.
    Once you've actually presented more than just personal opinion you might have a point

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    Re: One-year-old shot dead by 3-year old in Cleveland home.

    Quote Originally Posted by shrubnose View Post

    This thread is about kids killed by guns.

    If you want to start threads about those other topics, get after it.
    The comparison is a very good parallel. Your reaction just demonstrates the common prejudice about guns, rather than actual child safety (or parental responsibility).
    "Freedom doesn't mean safe, it means free."

    "No, you'll be *a* judge of that, just like everyone else who reads it."
    Quote Originally Posted by applejuicefool View Post
    A murderer putting a bullet through someone's brain is a medical procedure too.

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    Re: One-year-old shot dead by 3-year old in Cleveland home.

    Quote Originally Posted by flogger View Post
    I've already posted multiple studies that show otherwise. Here are more...

    Access to Guns Increases Risk of Suicide, Homicide | UC San Francisco....
    Another perfect example. From your link:
    Since not all of the studies assessed whether victims had firearms in their homes, the meta-analysis does not draw conclusions about the associations between suicide or homicide and the location of the firearms, but merely whether victims had access to them.
    So if a woman keeps a hunting rifle at home in a safe, she "has access to a gun", and if she's the victim of a gunshot while out on the town, no where near her own gun, this study admits that they just count her in their conclusion. They admit that they couldn't prove that the gun the victim owned is the same gun which killed the victim, they admit even further that the gun may not have been in the area when the victim was shot.

    Faulty research. Biased source.
    Last edited by Jerry; 04-14-15 at 04:20 PM.

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    Re: One-year-old shot dead by 3-year old in Cleveland home.

    Quote Originally Posted by Goshin View Post
    Or maybe the AAP's study is biased. Or they've assembled their data in a manner that supports the conclusions they preferred. Wouldn't be the first time.
    "There are lies; there are damned lies; and then there are statistics..."
    Why would they do this ?

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    Re: One-year-old shot dead by 3-year old in Cleveland home.

    Quote Originally Posted by Goshin View Post
    Well, I have things to do besides swap links nobody reads. Laters.
    Oh that reminds me I have the first four episodes of this season of Game of Thrones to watch!

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    Re: One-year-old shot dead by 3-year old in Cleveland home.

    Quote Originally Posted by flogger View Post
    Why would they do this ?
    The same reason others distort data and statistics, to promote an agenda.
    You know the time is right to take control, we gotta take offense against the status quo

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    "I should have loved freedom, I believe, at all times, but in the time in which we live I am ready to worship it."

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    Re: One-year-old shot dead by 3-year old in Cleveland home.

    Quote Originally Posted by flogger View Post
    Suicide is three times more likely to be attempted and to be successful with a gun in the house. I didn't write the studies I just presented them. By all means feel free to take up their conclusions with their authors
    Oh distancing yourself from the very studies you presented, interesting...

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    Re: One-year-old shot dead by 3-year old in Cleveland home.

    Quote Originally Posted by Goshin View Post
    Are you SURE you're not anti-gun? You haven't said a single positive thing about gun ownership in this thread, that I noticed... but plenty of negative.

    No, you're not advocating any specific legislation just the now, but every post in the thread has been negative towards gun ownership.
    The positive for me is they're fun to shoot, and I enjoy hunting. They're also risky. It's a trade off. I believe in making an informed decision about that trade-off. So I'm interested in the research, and report it as I understand it.

    Above I'm asking for a citation because I don't believe the assertion. He said that the studies that show risk of death go up when a gun is brought into the house are wrong because in most cases the murder weapon is brought into the home by someone else. That makes no sense. The studies look at murder rates and suicide rates, and control for households that own guns. Why would gun owning households be more likely to have an intruder come into their home with a gun, and kill them? That makes no sense. And if it's true, then obviously owning a gun for self defense INCREASES the odds than an armed intruder will kill you (or makes your home more attractive to robbers, or at best does nothing to protect your family from murder).

    Maybe I'm thinking of this wrong but I'd like to see the evidence for his assertion. He's claimed my studies are BS and dismissed them with an so far unsourced assertion. I'm entitled to a cite.

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    Re: One-year-old shot dead by 3-year old in Cleveland home.

    Quote Originally Posted by Jerry View Post
    Faulty research. Biased source.
    Please present your unbiased one that counters its conclusions ? Meanwhile in an attempt to get back on topic

    Teaching firearm safety to children: failure of a program. - PubMed - NCBI

    http://www.slate.com/articles/health...spite_nra.html

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