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Thread: Video Shows Officer Shooting Unarmed Black Man in South Carolina

  1. #941
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    Re: Video Shows Officer Shooting Unarmed Black Man in South Carolina

    Quote Originally Posted by Objective Voice View Post
    I disagree, but let's move on because unless the video imagery is made clearer, there's really no way to tell conclusively if Mr. Scott or Officer Slager had possession of the taser prior to it being knocked or thrown to the ground.
    The evidence is that the suspect took the taser. Nothing counters that.
    The downward motion of the Officer's arm attempting to draw his weapon could not account for the direction or force of the thrown taser.
    The fact that the Officer is in the process of drawing his firearm at that point is just supportive of the evidence that the suspect had it.


    Quote Originally Posted by Objective Voice View Post
    Again, assuming that Mr. Scott did possess Officer Slager's taser after the scuffle but before he fled, he certainly didn't have it once he ran the second time.
    Which as already pointed out he was a threat at the point in time that the Officer was responding . That isn't going to change.


    Quote Originally Posted by Objective Voice View Post
    Arrogance on my part, no.
    Of course it was.
    You declared you did something you obviously didn't do, all in an attempt to add more credence to your argument.
    That is not only arrogance at work, but deception as well.


    Quote Originally Posted by Objective Voice View Post
    there was no imminent nor immediate threat to him
    As continually pointed out, that is not the standard.
    Probable cause to believe the suspect was a significant threat is the standard.


    Quote Originally Posted by Objective Voice View Post
    One can only go with the facts and/or evidence that's before them.
    Now you are trying to deflect with dishonesty.

    You had the whole topic and all the information provided in it before you.
    “The law is reason, free from passion.”
    Aristotle

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    Re: Video Shows Officer Shooting Unarmed Black Man in South Carolina

    Quote Originally Posted by Objective Voice View Post
    First off, I notice you've stopped using the terms "immediate" or "imminent" threats to describe the perceived position Officer Slager believed himself to be in and downgraded such to "significant". Unfortunate for your position, a "significant threat" doesn't measure up to "imminent or immediate danger".
    Just stop with your dishonesty.

    I have been the one who has continually pointed out that "immediate or imminent" is not the standard, and pointed out what it is.

    Probable cause to believe the suspect was a significant threat is the standard.
    Which is what SCOTUS concluded.


    Quote Originally Posted by Objective Voice View Post
    And I've openly admitted that I had not seen the slow motion CNN video beforehand. Once I did review it, I corrected my position as necessary. But you...you're still an ass no matter what.
    And? Your presentation was dishonest, and pointing out why you hadn't seen it is not being an ass.


    Quote Originally Posted by Objective Voice View Post
    Second, I totally disagree with your assessment that the tether lines from the taser were wrapped around the victim or the officer. Mr. Scott wouldn't have been able to run and Officer Slager wouldn't have been able to walk unimpeded if they were.
    [sarcasm]Of course you do![/sarcasm]
    That would be because you are not paying attention to the information already provided.


    Quote Originally Posted by Objective Voice View Post
    Again, based on the evidence I was privy to, yes.
    More dishonest deflection. You had the whole thread with it's entire content before you.
    Yet you did not even bother.


    Quote Originally Posted by Objective Voice View Post
    Third, assuming that the tether was wrapped around (at least) Mr. Scott, common sense would still lead one to conclude that the "significant threat" had abated since the taser leads had already been ejected from the device and the tether remained expelled. You can also conclude that the taser itself had already be discharged since Officer Slager choose not to use it again. (Of course, by then it was on the ground and the tether training the assailant.)
    This is again you showing you have not paid attention to the information provided.
    Pay attention this time and learn something.
    The taser can be used two different ways. By cartridge which fires probes/darts that stick in the body, and by contact prongs.
    The fact that a cartridge has been expended is irrelevant to the taser still being a viable weapon.


    Quote Originally Posted by Objective Voice View Post
    My point here just as others who have commented against Officer Slager's actions is that Mr. Scott, an unarmed man at the time of his death, was not a threat to the would-be arresting officer. I don't disregard the fact that there was a struggle. I don't disregard the likelihood that Mr. Scott may have possessed Officer Slager's taser. I'm just saying as have others that despite what occurred moments prior to the shooting, Mr. Scott wasn't an "imminent or immediate or significant" threat to Officer Slager or the public at the time he fled unarmed and was subsequently shot multiple times.
    And again, as soon as he took the taser he was a significant threat.
    The video previously provided shows that an unarmed fleeing suspect can be fired upon as the law allows.

    As already provided from the SCOTUS case of Tennessee v. Garner.
    Dicta speaking in regards to what they held.
    If the suspect threatens the officer with a weapon or there is probable cause to believe that he has committed a crime involving the infliction or threatened infliction of serious physical harm, deadly force may be used if necessary to prevent escape, and if, where feasable, some warning has been given.


    But for some reason those wishing to argue don't understand that.


    So for argument purposes let's switch to the other point I made.

    Show the Officer knew the suspect threw the taser and was not still in possession of it when he continued responding to the significant threat the suspect was.
    Under those conditions no one can logically claim that the Officer's response was unreasonable.
    “The law is reason, free from passion.”
    Aristotle

  3. #943
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    Re: Video Shows Officer Shooting Unarmed Black Man in South Carolina

    Quote Originally Posted by Blemonds View Post
    Why would you try to twist what I said? Oh, that's right. Everything has to be twisted to make Slager look as bad as possible so that this incident falls into an agenda
    Mornin' Blemonds...Look, I think you know that more than often I fall on the side of agreement with you and other conservatives on a broad range of issues...But after viewing the videos, and reading a great deal of the coverage, and Police statements on this from SLED, I have to say that the officer was wrong, and he knew it immediately after dropping the suspect. I'll tell you why I think this is so....

    1. Slager first tazed the suspect, and was in close enough proximity to take him down right there...Why didn't he? I want to hear that explanation.

    2. When the suspect slapped the tazer out of Slager's hand and proceeded to run, is not the same as trying to "take" his tazer. And the jury will have to decide if that constituted a threat to Slager, or others in the course of deciding justification of firing on the suspect.

    3. Slager is on video moving the slapped away tazer after the suspect was down, instead of rendering first aid as he tried to say he did...That goes to his own knowledge of guilt after the fact...Not good.

    Now I will say, that it isn't over until Slager gets his day in court, and is allowed to explain why it is he felt he had to fire 8 shots instead of chasing the suspect down and rendering him under arrest...He'll have to explain why it is he moved the tazer over to near the downed suspect after he was on the ground instead of rendering first aid...And what I hope is investigated further is how other officers immediately tried to cover the incident by also saying things like they rendered CPR when they didn't....Training is key to any good Police dept. and I want to know that if there is a training issue in some of these departments they are exposed, and addressed...But don't immediately just jump to the conclusion that Slager is innocent of charges because he was a cop, cops make mistakes too, and are subject to acting outside the law...And when they do they need to be held accountable just like the people they are out there to police.
    Americans are so enamored of equality that they would rather be equal in slavery than unequal in freedom.

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    Re: Video Shows Officer Shooting Unarmed Black Man in South Carolina

    Quote Originally Posted by Excon View Post
    as soon as he took the taser he was a significant threat.
    Mornin' Excon....I have a question for ya....You're using the terminology that the suspect "took" the taser from Slager...but if you look at the video captured by the bystander, it appears more like the suspect slapped the taser from Slager's hand, or even that Slager threw the taser to the ground as the suspect started to take flight, in order to draw his gun....So, what evidence do you see that the suspect "took" possession of the taser?

    As already provided from the SCOTUS case of Tennessee v. Garner.
    Dicta speaking in regards to what they held.
    If the suspect threatens the officer with a weapon or there is probable cause to believe that he has committed a crime involving the infliction or threatened infliction of serious physical harm, deadly force may be used if necessary to prevent escape, and if, where feasable, some warning has been given.


    But for some reason those wishing to argue don't understand that.
    I understand that, and I think it's reasonable to assume that the Chief of Police for N. Charleston also knows the law, yet, he still fired Slager, and had him placed under arrest for Murder....What you are saying is something that the court has to decide....I don't think we have all the information that will be brought out at trial yet...

    Show the Officer knew the suspect threw the taser and was not still in possession of it when he continued responding to the significant threat the suspect was.
    Under those conditions no one can logically claim that the Officer's response was unreasonable.
    Police are trained observers...Or should be...It is clear that the suspect is running with NOTHING in his hands, why? Because he didn't "take" the taser, instead slapped it out of Slager's hand....I think Slager knew that, and chose to use lethal force instead of expending the energy needed to run down, and subdue the suspect...For that bad decision Slager is accountable.
    Americans are so enamored of equality that they would rather be equal in slavery than unequal in freedom.

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    Re: Video Shows Officer Shooting Unarmed Black Man in South Carolina

    Quote Originally Posted by disneydude View Post
    You gave "evidence"? Hardly. An op-ed piece written by a well known right-winger who wrote for the national review is hardly "evidence". Be that as it may....I've heard the same rhetoric from people on all sides of the spectrum. I, absolutely, am left-wing. I don't try to attempt to hide my biases by adopting labels to somehow try to make it seem as if I have no bias, like some try to do. I also recognize that there is left-wing propaganda and there is right-wing propaganda. But to try to pidgoen-hole politifact as a biased liberal shill is a joke. I don't always agree with politifact, but they are one of the most credible sites out there. Sorry.



    I have an extreme individual liberty bias. that said, like I said, your sig is funny, and even if the national review dude was the rightest winged person in history, you failed to address his statistics, which are indeed fact.


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    Think not that I am come to send peace on earth: I came not to send peace, but a sword.

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    Re: Video Shows Officer Shooting Unarmed Black Man in South Carolina

    What is sad is that across the country there is a move for the police to improve their relationship with their communities.
    This has been going on for some time with such simple things as getting out of the squad car and intermingling with the populace. It is often common to say there is a cop up ahead with his car pulled over but refer to him as the policeman walking ahead of you on the sidewalk. It is good for the community and for the police to have contact other than for speeding in a 25 zone. In our community the police have had different functions with kids which has been very successful.
    Then we have this kind of crap along with the reserve officer in Oklahoma who mistook his gun for his taser and it just sets things back a few steps.

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    Re: Video Shows Officer Shooting Unarmed Black Man in South Carolina

    Quote Originally Posted by Blemonds View Post
    Not if you shoot him in the heat of the moment
    Lol, don't try that in any heated moment.
    Killing one person is murder, killing 100,000 is foreign policy

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    u mad, snowflake?
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    Re: Video Shows Officer Shooting Unarmed Black Man in South Carolina

    Quote Originally Posted by solletica View Post
    Body cams on cops are 100% worthless. The police depts. would just doctor the body cam videos or else the cops would turn off the cams and/or censor specific footage.

    In the event body cam videos were available for the public to see, there would be huge discrepancies in the video picked up by those cams and those picked up by bystander cameras and/or cell phones.


    departments that use body cams have an 80% reduction in abuse complaints.


    Body-worn police cameras in Southern California 'cut complaints' - BBC News


    so "100%" worthless seems, ..... wrong.


    Matthew 10:34
    Think not that I am come to send peace on earth: I came not to send peace, but a sword.

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    Re: Video Shows Officer Shooting Unarmed Black Man in South Carolina

    Quote Originally Posted by Excon View Post


    "Safe rule if thumb…if someone tries to tell you a cop murdered someone in broad daylight, on a public street, in front of who knows how many witnesses, with no chance in hell of getting away with it, stop and think about what it is they are asking you to believe. No doubt, there are bad cops out there, but that doesn’t mean they are stupid. Heck, even non-cop criminals know better than that for the most part, except for the ones who don’t care if they get caught."









    Your comment is absurd in light of the fact that this is a debate.

    So again, as you were previously asked and didn't answer.

    You do understand that this is going to a GJ right?


    I do believe that this killer cop will be going on trial.

    You go ahead and believe whatever you want to believe.

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    Re: Video Shows Officer Shooting Unarmed Black Man in South Carolina

    What the cop did, was wrong. However, he derserves his day in court and to argue his side of the story. That's America people, like it or not. And if he argues well enough, and the prosecution does not present their case well, he could possibly get away with murder. This problem is not relegated to police, it happens throughout our justice system. The large variable being the accused ability to defend and present their case.

    Based on what I saw, it was murder. But I only saw a portions of the entire confrontation. I don't know if he had a weapon at one point, or if the officer had a reasonable fear of his life if the guy got away from him and had the ability to acquire a weapon. The courts will hear the case and decide.

    Last thing: If you don't fight with, argue, or run from the police, you wont get shot or hurt. Fight your case in court, not on the street with an officer (who is human) with a firearm. There are no humans on the face of this planet who are immune from rash decisions in stressful situations. And yes, police, are human. Just take your fight to court instead of on the side of the road.
    - There was never a good war, or a bad peace.
    - Idealistically, everything should work as you planed it to. Realistically, it depends on how idealistic you are as to the measure of success.
    - Better to be a pessimist before, and an optimist afterwords.

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