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Thread: Iranians See Victory, Hope for New Image in Nuclear Agreement

  1. #151
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    Re: Iranians See Victory, Hope for New Image in Nuclear Agreement

    Quote Originally Posted by ReverendHellh0und View Post
    nice slight of hand attempt. Iran, as we were talking about have been less than honest, and have been hostile to inspectors.
    Indeed. But that was before Iran fully comprehended the crushing power of international sanctions.

    They understand non-compliance consequences much better now.

    Quote Originally Posted by ReverendHellh0und View Post
    not really, but lets say ok, still better than giving them the stuff they want to build bombas. *shrug*
    That is the (Western) two-pronged point of the negotiations, 1) to negotiate terms that make it extremely difficult for Iran to construct a bomb and 2) to make detection of such activity much much easier.


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    Re: Iranians See Victory, Hope for New Image in Nuclear Agreement

    Quote Originally Posted by Simpleχity View Post
    Indeed. But that was before Iran fully comprehended the crushing power of international sanctions.

    They understand non-compliance consequences much better now.

    Really? REALLY? as of 2012 they were plotting assasinations, 2011 making ieds. 2008 ied's made in iran killing Americans. Threats, supporting hezbollah, and other terrorist groups.


    Now, they "learned thier lesson"?

    are you for real?


    That is the (Western) two-pronged point of the negotiations, 1) to negotiate terms that make it extremely difficult for Iran to construct a bomb and 2) to make detection of such activity much much easier.

    This is really about Obama legacy building. given his past failures. I don't have much hope on this one.
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  3. #153
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    Re: Iranians See Victory, Hope for New Image in Nuclear Agreement

    Quote Originally Posted by cpwill View Post
    Sanctions don't stop, they merely slow, development. And in an autocracy, sanctions don't hurt the leadership, they hurt the people. I don't think their reinstatement is going to get Iran to give up it's program.
    That may be true, but we failed the help the uprising when we had a chance. Iran's population is young and with severe sanctions the young will take care of the leadership.
    Liberals - Punish the Successful, Reward the Unsuccessful
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  4. #154
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    Re: Iranians See Victory, Hope for New Image in Nuclear Agreement

    Quote Originally Posted by Born Free View Post
    That may be true, but we failed the help the uprising when we had a chance. Iran's population is young and with severe sanctions the young will take care of the leadership.
    That is unlikely. Even the Green Movement was in favor of the nuclear program, and outside pressure strengthens the autocrats hands inside the state. Unless we were preparing to force regime change, it's a poor strategy.
    “In America we have a two-party system,” a Republican congressional staffer told a visiting group of Russian legislators. “There is the stupid party. And there is the evil party. I am proud to be a member of the stupid party. Periodically, the two parties get together and do something that is both stupid and evil. This is called: bipartisanship."

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    Re: Iranians See Victory, Hope for New Image in Nuclear Agreement

    Quote Originally Posted by Simpleχity View Post
    That is the (Western) two-pronged point of the negotiations, 1) to negotiate terms that make it extremely difficult for Iran to construct a bomb
    Make it extremely difficult, Iran had nuclear plant under ground that no one knew about.

    to make detection of such activity much much easier.
    Without inspectors having free and immediate access anytime anywhere there is no detection.
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    Re: Iranians See Victory, Hope for New Image in Nuclear Agreement

    Quote Originally Posted by cpwill View Post
    That is unlikely. Even the Green Movement was in favor of the nuclear program, and outside pressure strengthens the autocrats hands inside the state. Unless we were preparing to force regime change, it's a poor strategy.
    If sanctions don't work why is Iran even talking. Iran would just keep doing what it is doing, getting their nukes.
    Liberals - Punish the Successful, Reward the Unsuccessful
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    Re: Iranians See Victory, Hope for New Image in Nuclear Agreement

    Quote Originally Posted by ReverendHellh0und View Post
    Really? REALLY? as of 2012 they were plotting assasinations, 2011 making ieds. 2008 ied's made in iran killing Americans. Threats, supporting hezbollah, and other terrorist groups.
    In 2012 the US was still fighting in Afghanistan. This is 2015. Things change.


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    Re: Iranians See Victory, Hope for New Image in Nuclear Agreement

    Quote Originally Posted by Born Free View Post
    If sanctions don't work why is Iran even talking. Iran would just keep doing what it is doing, getting their nukes.
    President Rouhani is the former lead nuclear negotiator for Iran. During that time he developed and proposed a strategy to the Supreme Leader which proposed that Iran engage in regular, continual, ever-extended negotiations in order to keep political will for a strike from building in the West while Iran continues development.

    Now he's President. And Iran is engaging in regular, continual, seemingly ever-extended negotiations, which are keeping political will for a strike from building in the West....
    “In America we have a two-party system,” a Republican congressional staffer told a visiting group of Russian legislators. “There is the stupid party. And there is the evil party. I am proud to be a member of the stupid party. Periodically, the two parties get together and do something that is both stupid and evil. This is called: bipartisanship."

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    Re: Iranians See Victory, Hope for New Image in Nuclear Agreement

    Quote Originally Posted by Simpleχity View Post
    In 2012 the US was still fighting in Afghanistan. This is 2015. Things change.
    Oh yes. No doubt they've all had a come to Jesus moment and realized that their earlier support for terrorism was bad.


    Um. You can link to these major significant changes on the part of the Iranian leadership, can you not?
    “In America we have a two-party system,” a Republican congressional staffer told a visiting group of Russian legislators. “There is the stupid party. And there is the evil party. I am proud to be a member of the stupid party. Periodically, the two parties get together and do something that is both stupid and evil. This is called: bipartisanship."

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