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Thread: Iranians See Victory, Hope for New Image in Nuclear Agreement

  1. #141
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    Re: Iranians See Victory, Hope for New Image in Nuclear Agreement

    Quote Originally Posted by Kobie View Post
    You seem to be operating under the idea that Iran is not capable of acting in good faith. If that's the case, then isn't any negotiation doomed to fail? And if THAT'S the case, doesn't that pretty much reduce the options for a nuke-free Iran down to:

    A. Crushing sanctions that would only accelerate Iran's belligerence; and/or
    B. A pre-emptive military action?


    As recently as 2012, they were plotting to assasinate American officials.

    As recently as 2011 we've seen IED's marked "made in Iran" killing people, and a few years before that, specifically Americans.


    so, yeah, I don't want to give this oppressive religious fascist regime access to technology, that at minimum will give them dirty bomb materials.
    If you build an army of 100 lions and their leader is a dog, in any fight, the lions will die like a dog. But if you build an army of 100 dogs and their leader is a lion, all dogs will fight like a lion.

  2. #142
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    Re: Iranians See Victory, Hope for New Image in Nuclear Agreement

    Quote Originally Posted by cpwill View Post
    Oh. Except not. Iran's already announced that, too.
    In that case the deal is not verifiable, then there really is no deal.
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  3. #143
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    Re: Iranians See Victory, Hope for New Image in Nuclear Agreement

    Quote Originally Posted by ReverendHellh0und View Post
    As recently as 2012, they were plotting to assasinate American officials.

    As recently as 2011 we've seen IED's marked "made in Iran" killing people, and a few years before that, specifically Americans.


    so, yeah, I don't want to give this oppressive religious fascist regime access to technology, that at minimum will give them dirty bomb materials.
    You did not answer my question. If any negotiations are doomed to fail, what is your suggestion?
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  4. #144
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    Re: Iranians See Victory, Hope for New Image in Nuclear Agreement

    Quote Originally Posted by Kobie View Post
    Well, if they renege on allowing inspectors access, then obviously the agreement is void.
    I'm talking about inspectors are going to have free and immediate access anytime, anywhere they want to show up, if not there really is no deal. Is that how you see it.
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  5. #145
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    Re: Iranians See Victory, Hope for New Image in Nuclear Agreement

    Quote Originally Posted by LowDown View Post
    Ordinary Iranians are hoping this means an end to sanctions. The White House has repeatedly said that sanctions don't come off until the Iranians prove themselves trustworthy and capable of adhering to the agreement, which is never going to happen.
    The continued use of centrifuges for things like medicine and science, not for nukes. And it's to be monitored by outside parties.

    I don't understand how people can seriously be under the impression that we are safer with an Iran that has no direct supervision over their activities than an Iran that is doing everything in complete privacy. How would an arrangement like this not be completely and utterly better than the current situation?

  6. #146
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    Re: Iranians See Victory, Hope for New Image in Nuclear Agreement

    Quote Originally Posted by Born Free View Post
    In that case the deal is not verifiable, then there really is no deal.
    Verifying Iran Nuclear Deal Not Possible, Experts Say

    ...“The Joint Comprehensive Plan of Action will not be effectively verifiable,” said Paula DeSutter, assistant secretary of state for verification, compliance, and implementation from 2002 to 2009....
    You don't say....
    “In America we have a two-party system,” a Republican congressional staffer told a visiting group of Russian legislators. “There is the stupid party. And there is the evil party. I am proud to be a member of the stupid party. Periodically, the two parties get together and do something that is both stupid and evil. This is called: bipartisanship."

  7. #147
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    Re: Iranians See Victory, Hope for New Image in Nuclear Agreement

    Quote Originally Posted by Kobie View Post
    You did not answer my question. If any negotiations are doomed to fail, what is your suggestion?
    Get the national community to shut Iran off from everything. The sanctions is what got Iran to the table in the first place.
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  8. #148
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    Re: Iranians See Victory, Hope for New Image in Nuclear Agreement

    Quote Originally Posted by Kobie View Post
    You did not answer my question. If any negotiations are doomed to fail, what is your suggestion?
    Lift all sanctions of non-dual use, non-military material. Let the Iranian people get some economic growth going.

    And then severely degrade their nuclear development capability.
    “In America we have a two-party system,” a Republican congressional staffer told a visiting group of Russian legislators. “There is the stupid party. And there is the evil party. I am proud to be a member of the stupid party. Periodically, the two parties get together and do something that is both stupid and evil. This is called: bipartisanship."

  9. #149
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    Re: Iranians See Victory, Hope for New Image in Nuclear Agreement

    Quote Originally Posted by Kobie View Post
    You did not answer my question. If any negotiations are doomed to fail, what is your suggestion?



    I would like for my country to not have economic or other relations with that government until free and democratic elections are held for one. Two, I would like for our country to take it's past actions into consideration of it's nuclear ambitions and protect WE the People form any threats this may cause...


    Handing them technology hoping they become nice, is stupid policy.
    If you build an army of 100 lions and their leader is a dog, in any fight, the lions will die like a dog. But if you build an army of 100 dogs and their leader is a lion, all dogs will fight like a lion.

  10. #150
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    Re: Iranians See Victory, Hope for New Image in Nuclear Agreement

    Quote Originally Posted by Born Free View Post
    Get the national community to shut Iran off from everything. The sanctions is what got Iran to the table in the first place.
    Sanctions don't stop, they merely slow, development. And in an autocracy, sanctions don't hurt the leadership, they hurt the people. I don't think their reinstatement is going to get Iran to give up it's program.
    “In America we have a two-party system,” a Republican congressional staffer told a visiting group of Russian legislators. “There is the stupid party. And there is the evil party. I am proud to be a member of the stupid party. Periodically, the two parties get together and do something that is both stupid and evil. This is called: bipartisanship."

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