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Thread: Indiana's 'No Gay Wedding' Pizzeria Has Closed[W:1581]

  1. #701
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    Re: Indiana's 'No Gay Wedding' Pizzeria Has Closed

    Quote Originally Posted by iliveonramen View Post
    Selling a cake to someone does not equal giving up your own beliefs or change how you think. If you sell a shirt a Muslim wears to their Mosque does that make you a Muslim? Or any less of a Christian? Does it mean you can no longer believe anything you want? No, no, and no. It means you sold him a shirt.
    In your opinion. Others feel differently.

    Quote Originally Posted by iliveonramen View Post
    A business does not have individual rights. You don't have to let blacks, gays, women, or anyone else into your home. Your private residence. You don't have to talk to gay people. When you open a business though and open it up to the public there's a different set of rules.
    No, a business doesn't have individual rights. It can't. Its an inanimate thing. The owner however does.
    I have an answer for everything...you may not like the answer or it may not satisfy your curiosity..but it will still be an answer. ~ Kal'Stang

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    Re: Indiana's 'No Gay Wedding' Pizzeria Has Closed

    Quote Originally Posted by Kal'Stang View Post
    Doing such would open them up to a libel lawsuit. Not going to happen.

    The store owner said it themselves. They would not refuse service to anyone that walked into their store to buy a pizza. So yes, they were not talking about your scenario.
    That is not what she said at all. In fact, the owner said that if a gay person came into their restaurant and asked them to "provide" pizza for their wedding, they would have to refuse. They didn't mention what everyone is assuming catering to be here. There is no way to fit a group that could eat 20 pizzas in that small little place. So those pizzas would be to go. She, the owner, was talking about the situation I described.

    And no, the reporter would not be libel for slander, because what I described is a form of catering. The food providers do not have to be present at the event or even deliver the food to the actual event to be considered "catering" the event.
    "A woman is like a teabag, you never know how strong she is until she gets in hot water." - Eleanor Roosevelt

    Keep your religion out of other people's marriages.

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    Re: Indiana's 'No Gay Wedding' Pizzeria Has Closed

    Quote Originally Posted by iliveonramen View Post
    They can have any personal beliefs they want but wrapping it in religion is what is wrong. No one is asking someone to create a cake for a gay wedding and sign off on the marriage certificate. This is about commerce and the only versus in the bible that deal with commerce are about being fair in business to the people you trade with and your workers. There are a ton of versus regarding trading with people that you may not agree with. There's no verse that says "You can not trade cloth that will be used to worship an idol" but plenty of the Jews trading with other groups.
    I would disagree - they can hold whatever personal beliefs they may, religious or otherwise. Personally, I have no problem with catering a gay wedding, but I respect those who prefer not to. That doesn't mean I agree with them, but I'll continue to respect deeply held personal beliefs regardless of the consequences. I am a Christian, and I don't believe I am responsible for the doings of others. I don't judge them and I'm not required to answer for them. Therefore, I will respect the right of others to do as they deem fit. That doesn't constitute agreement or endorsement - just a level of tolerance I expect to be returned. Without that mutual respect and tolerance, all deals are off.
    "I believe that man will not merely endure: he will prevail. He is immortal, not because he alone among creatures has an inexhaustible voice, but because he has a soul, a spirit capable of compassion and sacrifice and endurance." William Faulkner

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    Re: Indiana's 'No Gay Wedding' Pizzeria Has Closed

    Quote Originally Posted by roguenuke View Post
    That is not what she said at all. In fact, the owner said that if a gay person came into their restaurant and asked them to "provide" pizza for their wedding, they would have to refuse. They didn't mention what everyone is assuming catering to be here. There is no way to fit a group that could eat 20 pizzas in that small little place. So those pizzas would be to go. She, the owner, was talking about the situation I described.

    And no, the reporter would not be libel for slander, because what I described is a form of catering. The food providers do not have to be present at the event or even deliver the food to the actual event to be considered "catering" the event.
    When the reporter stated "while the owners say" that means that the owners are being quoted. If a reporter changes that quote then they can be sued for libel. (which is different from slander by the by).
    I have an answer for everything...you may not like the answer or it may not satisfy your curiosity..but it will still be an answer. ~ Kal'Stang

    My mind and my heart are saying I'm in my twenties. My body is pointing at my mind and heart and laughing its ass off. ~ Kal'Stang

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    Re: Indiana's 'No Gay Wedding' Pizzeria Has Closed

    Quote Originally Posted by polgara View Post
    Good morning, Kal'Stang.

    I know. It's just unreal to me that the discussion about "rights" on this topic have deteriorated to this point in our Country. Emotion, rather than logic, seems to have taken over on what should be a dry legal matter. Maybe that's how things get handled these days, on both sides of the coin - create chaos to get attention. When I see the "pushback" that is taking place with the financial outpouring for the pizzeria, it appears that both sides are digging in their heels to show where they stand. What's next?
    Good morning.

    Actually this type of thing has been going on for as long as I can remember personally.
    I have an answer for everything...you may not like the answer or it may not satisfy your curiosity..but it will still be an answer. ~ Kal'Stang

    My mind and my heart are saying I'm in my twenties. My body is pointing at my mind and heart and laughing its ass off. ~ Kal'Stang

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    Re: Indiana's 'No Gay Wedding' Pizzeria Has Closed

    Quote Originally Posted by humbolt View Post
    I would disagree - they can hold whatever personal beliefs they may, religious or otherwise. Personally, I have no problem with catering a gay wedding, but I respect those who prefer not to. That doesn't mean I agree with them, but I'll continue to respect deeply held personal beliefs regardless of the consequences. I am a Christian, and I don't believe I am responsible for the doings of others. I don't judge them and I'm not required to answer for them. Therefore, I will respect the right of others to do as they deem fit. That doesn't constitute agreement or endorsement - just a level of tolerance I expect to be returned. Without that mutual respect and tolerance, all deals are off.
    If only more people thought this way.
    I have an answer for everything...you may not like the answer or it may not satisfy your curiosity..but it will still be an answer. ~ Kal'Stang

    My mind and my heart are saying I'm in my twenties. My body is pointing at my mind and heart and laughing its ass off. ~ Kal'Stang

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    Re: Indiana's 'No Gay Wedding' Pizzeria Has Closed

    Quote Originally Posted by Amadeus View Post
    So basically, anyone can start a religion with any set of rules, and those would be legit religious values?
    Some do, like the Pastafarians

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    Re: Indiana's 'No Gay Wedding' Pizzeria Has Closed

    Quote Originally Posted by Kal'Stang View Post
    When the reporter stated "while the owners say" that means that the owners are being quoted. If a reporter changes that quote then they can be sued for libel. (which is different from slander by the by).
    No they would not be reasonably libel. And it could also be that the owners consider catering from their pizzeria to be the form I said. They don't cater at all, from everything I've read, so why would they be talking about something they don't do to begin with? And that is not how she, the owner, phrased the refusal. She said they would not "provide" (her exact quote, after mentioning in her hypothetical that the gays walked into their shop) pizza for a gay wedding. Did they even deliver at all?
    "A woman is like a teabag, you never know how strong she is until she gets in hot water." - Eleanor Roosevelt

    Keep your religion out of other people's marriages.

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    Re: Indiana's 'No Gay Wedding' Pizzeria Has Closed

    Quote Originally Posted by rocket88 View Post
    So give them your money to make a point? I don't understand that line of thinking. If it's a politician, a charity, or a preacher it makes sense.

    By this logic, I can have a profitable business by simply claiming I won't serve gays and then moan about how the ebil libruls are ruining me.
    Funny, just two days ago, liberals of all stripes were clamoring about how the market was making itself heard with regard to this pizza shop, and now you're all butt hurt that the market is making itself heard.. Jees man, get your stories straight..


    Tim-
    “When buying and selling are controlled by legislation, the first things to be bought and sold are legislators.” - P. J. O’Rourke
    “Socialism is great until you run out of someone elses money” Margaret Thatcher

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    Re: Indiana's 'No Gay Wedding' Pizzeria Has Closed

    Quote Originally Posted by Deuce View Post
    Ahh yes, the old "liberals love Muslims" meme.

    Also, do people really still believe the Fox News version of that "give them jobs" deal? Really? You never actually bothered to go watch the actual video and see what was actually said? Weren't you the least bit curious?


    My how you assume..

    Does it make you feel bigger when you put down others?

    For the 1,897,987th time, I have no access whatsoever to Fox News, nor Russ Limbaugh nor do I ascribe to very many conservative principles.

    Do you ever watch Fox?

    maybe you should.

    have a god day, we are done
    "Small people talk about people, average people talk about events, great people talk about ideas" Eleanor Roosevelt

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