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Thread: Indiana's 'No Gay Wedding' Pizzeria Has Closed[W:1581]

  1. #1811
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    Re: Indiana's 'No Gay Wedding' Pizzeria Has Closed

    Quote Originally Posted by nota bene View Post
    So if I believe that abortion on demand is immoral, the law says that I am required to cater a Planned Parenthood fundraiser? Is that what you're saying? I don't have the right of refusal?
    No the law doesn't say anything like that. Planned parenthood is not a protected class. Now if you agreed to cater a Planned Parenthood function for black people or nonChristians, you could not then refuse to cater a planned parenthood function for white people or Christians, claiming something about your religion only recognizes that whites or Christians should not have abortions. That would be illegal discrimination based on the people involved in the event.
    "A woman is like a teabag, you never know how strong she is until she gets in hot water." - Eleanor Roosevelt

    Keep your religion out of other people's marriages.

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    Re: Indiana's 'No Gay Wedding' Pizzeria Has Closed

    Well, I didn't mention religion; I was referring to conscience.

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    Re: Indiana's 'No Gay Wedding' Pizzeria Has Closed

    Quote Originally Posted by nota bene View Post
    Well, I didn't mention religion; I was referring to conscience.
    Even if the claim was one of conscience, it wouldn't change anything. The same rules apply.
    "A woman is like a teabag, you never know how strong she is until she gets in hot water." - Eleanor Roosevelt

    Keep your religion out of other people's marriages.

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    Re: Indiana's 'No Gay Wedding' Pizzeria Has Closed

    Quote Originally Posted by matchlight View Post
    I don't understand your question.
    He's going to pull the "what about sacrificing virgins" argument on you

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    Re: Indiana's 'No Gay Wedding' Pizzeria Has Closed

    Quote Originally Posted by Grim17 View Post
    Yes they are being forced to abandon their religious beliefs, or face legal action.
    That is a lie and it seems to be the only thing you are capable to bring to the discussion.No one is forced to do anything. How are they forced to abandon anything when they freely take on a responsibility to do something?

    So your position is, that a person must give up their religious freedom, their beliefs, and their moral conscience to open a bakery?
    More lies. I never said anything of the sort. Either you lack basic reading skills or the ability to formulate a rational and intelligent argument. Anyone can open any business they choose and they also must choose who they want to be their clientele. Those who open businesses to the public have the obligation to serve the public. One can not do something freely and then claim that one is being forced.

    Certainly it is. Forcing a Muslim, Christian or Jewish bakery owner to provide goods or services for a ceremony that violates their religious beliefs, is asking them to give up their right to believe in the tenets of their religion.
    NO IT IS NOT. Have you at least made an attempt to understand what I wrote? If they open a business to serve the public they have to serve the public. No one is forced to open a business to serve the public.

    Refusal to take part in the wedding ceremony, in no way abridges their right to get married.
    No one said it does, but it IS discrimination.

    Forcing people to abandon their religious beliefs for someones party, is the height of intolerance.
    Repeating the same failed argument is the height of ignorance. NO ONE IS FORCED TO DO ANYTHING.

    Who are they discriminating against?
    Seriously? The people who they refuse to serve.

    Who is in attendance is absolutely irrelevant... It's the event they object to.
    There would be no event if people did not participate in it. They are objecting to a gay couple having the event.

    It is?
    Yes, abundantly.

    Then please tell me when any of these businesses that have been discussed in the last week, have said they will not serve gay people?
    Are you attempting to say that no business would deny service to gays if they could?

    Every single one of them have made it clear that they will not refuse service to gay people and have not done so.
    But they would cater of participate in a wedding for divorced people, adulterers etc.

    You are a bigot.
    Because I opposed discrimination, and you are the one who supports it?

    You have just displayed your intolerance for the beliefs of others.
    I have no problem with anyone's beliefs. I just expect people to live up to the obligations they freely take on. It is the way to ensure a safe and civilized society. It is unfortunate that you lack the ability to understand that.

    But it doesn't work both ways...
    Of course it works both ways and that is the beauty of it. Too bad that ignorance prevents you from understanding that simple concept.

    Because religious people are the scum of the earth in your eyes
    More ignorant lies.

    that do not have rights and do not deserve to be treated equally.
    On the contrary, everybody has rights and should be treated equally.

    Your position is one of intolerance and pure bigotry.
    Yet I oppose discrimination and you defend it.
    Last edited by prometeus; 04-07-15 at 06:24 PM.
    My views are my views, then there is the Christian view:
    Quote Originally Posted by WCH View Post
    Of course the third world dregs are breeding like rabbits.

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    Re: Indiana's 'No Gay Wedding' Pizzeria Has Closed

    Quote Originally Posted by nota bene View Post
    So if I believe that abortion on demand is immoral, the law says that I am required to cater a Planned Parenthood fundraiser? Is that what you're saying? I don't have the right of refusal?
    You do not if you have a catering open to the public. You could have a number of other forms of businesses that would allow refusal, but not one open to the public.
    My views are my views, then there is the Christian view:
    Quote Originally Posted by WCH View Post
    Of course the third world dregs are breeding like rabbits.

  7. #1817
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    Re: Indiana's 'No Gay Wedding' Pizzeria Has Closed

    Quote Originally Posted by Grim17 View Post
    I asked a few questions in there and you failed to address them... It's obvious to me why you didn't, because if you did it would either contradict your stance, or make you look like a fool.
    I've answered your questions in several earlier posts. Once again, you can do nothing other than make up stuff.

    And the answer is that a vendor supplying a good or service to a wedding is not "participating in the wedding"

    For example, the florist who delivers flowers to my date does not participate in the date or the blowjob she gives me after getting the flowers.
    Last edited by sangha; 04-07-15 at 06:51 PM.
    Quote Originally Posted by matchlight View Post
    Justice Thomas' opinions consistently contain precise, detailed constitutional analyses.
    Quote Originally Posted by jaeger19 View Post
    the vast majority of folks that need healthcare are on Medicare.. both rich and poor..

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    Re: Indiana's 'No Gay Wedding' Pizzeria Has Closed

    Quote Originally Posted by j-mac View Post
    You are correct in saying that you were the first to mention "private buses" however, that was only after you got called out on your poor analogy where you said only this:

    "and why would a black person want to be driven on a bus where the driver didnt want them?"
    Yes, I said that but it's not an analogy. It was a demonstration of how absurd your question was:
    Why would a gay couple want someone opposed to their lifestyle to participate in their day anyway?
    That was you in post #1694 the very first mention by you of a bus at all....Notice no "private" in there at all....And following the line of postings before that, clearly IMHO, you injected this analogy to disingenuously tie this argument of this thread to the civil rights struggles of the past.
    Correct. I didn't mention private or public because it makes no difference. Why would black person want a bus driver who opposes their lifestyle to participate in their day? It doesn't matter if the driver is employed by the govt or a private business. Why would black person want a bus driver who opposes their lifestyle to participate in their day?

    And the answer is simple: They don't give a **** what the driver thinks just as the gay couple might not care what the baker thinks. They just want a cake.

    As to your assertion that public transit systems are sometimes privately operated, I found this:

    ...snip...
    In many cities private bus companies were taken over by municipally controlled transit commissions in the 1930s and 1940s.

    The airline industries in many countries were placed under the control of a national public carrier, for example Air France, Trans Canada Airlines, and British Overseas Airways Corporation.

    Railways were nationalized in Europe after World War Two, and in the US, after the collapse of the Penn Central Railroad and several other lines, a publicly-funded passenger system (Amtrak) was set up, and a publicly owned freight railroad was established (Conrail)."

    snip

    "Urban transit systems remain dominantly publically owned and operated. Intercity is mostly private, which brings the question about if city transportation would gain to be privatized."

    https://people.hofstra.edu/geotrans/...n/ch9c1en.html

    So I stand by my claim that most urban public transportation services are publicly owned, and operated...

    Did we clear that up, and can now move back on topic?
    No, you once again have failed to remember what was said. Whether nor most bus lines were public or private was never discussed. What you did make an issue is whether or not most cities had private bus lines. There's a difference.

    ANd worst of all, your own quotes confirms what I said:
    As to your assertion that public transit systems are sometimes privately operated,
    Quote Originally Posted by matchlight View Post
    Justice Thomas' opinions consistently contain precise, detailed constitutional analyses.
    Quote Originally Posted by jaeger19 View Post
    the vast majority of folks that need healthcare are on Medicare.. both rich and poor..

  9. #1819
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    Re: Indiana's 'No Gay Wedding' Pizzeria Has Closed

    Quote Originally Posted by Bodhisattva View Post
    There are certainly bigots about religion just as there are bigots regarding SSM.
    If one doesnt approve of say...lying, or maybe killing, or stealing, or raping, or any other numbers of 'sin' categories, are they considered 'bigots'?
    Last edited by VanceMack; 04-07-15 at 06:50 PM.

  10. #1820
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    Re: Indiana's 'No Gay Wedding' Pizzeria Has Closed

    Quote Originally Posted by voyager1 View Post
    Two things:
    1. These businesses would have to show how catering a gay marriage is in contrast to their religion AND that will open up how the business is run. If the business can't show that their faith is part of other operations they are hosed. Because yes the courts will go there. If you are Christian you better not be picking and choosing what parts of the religion you practice when it comes to dealing with the public. I can't wait till when a journalist finds one of these places open on a Sunday for example

    2. The GOP needs to distance it's self from this issue. This thing is a loser of an issue in 2016.
    Meh...a few more video taped attempts to have Muslims cater to gay marriages, a couple of law suits...and this stuff all goes away.

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