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Thread: Arkansas passes its own religious freedom bill despite uproar in Indiana

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    Re: Arkansas passes its own religious freedom bill despite uproar in Indiana

    Quote Originally Posted by Samhain View Post
    No, it was about barring someone from employment because they were a drug user. Native Americans use Peyote as part of their religion, and you have a religious viewpoint being burdened by anti-drug laws. The Federal law has be leveraged for various reasons that all come down to a religious practice conflicting with a non-religous law. And that's the whole point of each RFRA.

    The Indiana law added the word "significant" to the already established "burden", which actually makes it harder to apply. And they added that the law would apply to civil suits as well.

    With this in mind, its impossible to conclude that the RFRA laws, in any state, can be used for ad-hoc "no gays allowed" applications, because it would NEVER BE ACCEPTED AS AN ACTUAL DEFENSE.
    The federal "RFRA" doesn't apply to business service the way indiana does and what constitutes a "significant burden" is obviously open to interpretation and an attempt to get away with what they can without the courts striking the whole thing down, as much as "sincerely held religious belief" relies on mind reading. It's asinine thru and thru, the worst kind of ad hoc law making, where the courts will very possibly come to contradictory rulings on identical cases

    You clearly missed my point as well which is that indiana bigots are targeting LGBT with this law, unlike the early 90s RFRAs. The fact it will fail doesn't make it any less heinous

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    Re: Arkansas passes its own religious freedom bill despite uproar in Indiana

    Quote Originally Posted by OrphanSlug View Post
    Looks like plenty of States are determined to make a mess of this issue, Arkansas joins the list.

    Mornin OS. Well they did mention that the left now is out and cheering on business and corporations for speaking out.

    Before, as you know they were running around saying businesses and corporations aren't people. For some reason they have evolved.

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    Re: Arkansas passes its own religious freedom bill despite uproar in Indiana

    Quote Originally Posted by chromium View Post
    The federal "RFRA" doesn't apply to business service the way indiana does and what constitutes a "significant burden" is obviously open to interpretation and an attempt to get away with what they can without the courts striking the whole thing down, as much as "sincerely held religious belief" relies on mind reading. It's asinine thru and thru, the worst kind of ad hoc law making, where the courts will very possibly come to contradictory rulings on identical cases

    You clearly missed my point as well which is that indiana bigots are targeting LGBT with this law, unlike the early 90s RFRAs. The fact it will fail doesn't make it any less heinous
    Perhaps the biggest thing to note.

    Indiana took "person" from the FED RFRA and made it hilariously broad in definition.
    -----MOS 19D = cavalry scout = best damn MOS there is

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    Re: Arkansas passes its own religious freedom bill despite uproar in Indiana

    Quote Originally Posted by chromium View Post
    The federal "RFRA" doesn't apply to business service the way indiana does and what constitutes a "significant burden" is obviously open to interpretation and an attempt to get away with what they can without the courts striking the whole thing down, as much as "sincerely held religious belief" relies on mind reading. It's asinine thru and thru, the worst kind of ad hoc law making, where the courts will very possibly come to contradictory rulings on identical cases

    You clearly missed my point as well which is that indiana bigots are targeting LGBT with this law, unlike the early 90s RFRAs. The fact it will fail doesn't make it any less heinous
    Nothing in any of the RFRA laws target anyone, and you are just projecting your incorrect views. Like myself & legal experts have stated, and the opponents of these laws won't accept, is the RFRA has NEVER been used to successfully discriminate by denying service. But keep beating that drum.

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    Re: Arkansas passes its own religious freedom bill despite uproar in Indiana

    Quote Originally Posted by MMC View Post
    Mornin OS. Well they did mention that the left now is out and cheering on business and corporations for speaking out.

    Before, as you know they were running around saying businesses and corporations aren't people. For some reason they have evolved.
    That is nothing more than convenience. There was a time, back during the Prop 8 vote in California, that these same groups published information on businesses owned by those that supported the measure in boycott efforts.

    This is what I am talking about with the mess we have made. Try the voter, do not like the results and rush to the courts. Try the courts, do not like the results and rush to the polls for an alternative try.

    At the end of the day we have social conservatism that wants government on their side, social liberalism wants government on their side. We should have left government out the picture from the start, it is most unfortunate that we are so far past that now the only option left is government forced protections for some with question on Constitutionality.

    This is another one of those subjects that the history books will not look to kind on, I suspect putting the anti-gay movement of today right up there with racists of the 50's and 60's.
    "Every time something really bad happens, people cry out for safety, and the government answers by taking rights away from good people." - Penn Jillette.

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    Re: Arkansas passes its own religious freedom bill despite uproar in Indiana

    Quote Originally Posted by Samhain View Post
    Nothing in any of the RFRA laws target anyone, and you are just projecting your incorrect views. Like myself & legal experts have stated, and the opponents of these laws won't accept, is the RFRA has NEVER been used to successfully discriminate by denying service. But keep beating that drum.
    indiana's governor wrote to the lobbyists that the law would put a stop to the gay agenda and "cross dressing" (what he thinks of transgender) and it would protect christian. See, no mention of minority religions like the early 90s RFRA, no attempt to even pretend it's not anti gay.

    Now the governor is trying to circle the wagons and pretend it was never about that, only because the hostility to his law is at epic levels. You are pulling this apologist crap on behalf of a scumbag politician, but you may as well just stop, cause i'll never fall for it.

    The "RFRA" were never worded like this or conceived as an anti gay strategy until recently. It's way too early to know how many cases there'll be in the next few years, before federal courts get off their ass and put a stop to it. And rest assured this will be as loathed and conquered as "DOMA", "DADT", consensual sex laws, and every other attempt to oppress
    Last edited by chromium; 04-01-15 at 10:19 AM.

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    Re: Arkansas passes its own religious freedom bill despite uproar in Indiana

    Quote Originally Posted by notquiteright View Post
    Ah the 'unnamed' rights CON... except the Rights that the Feds do jump into, like equal treatment under the law, are very clearly FEDERAL. I admire how some CONs can shrug off 'fair' when it isn't their toad being squashed... you aren't being kept out of a diner, bus or hotel.... so you shrug and say oh well, it is what the Founders wanted... the states ignoring the CONSTITUTION for a century after a brutal Civil War that the South LOST!

    Love the bending of our history... the North PERIOD didn't want slaves, that the SOUTH treated as property, counted to gain the South more reps in Congress... try and get just a tad closer to the truth!

    The majority needs no protection from Gays, the Gays are not demanding kisses from straight folks, just equal access... again try and stand a bit closer to the truth
    In the discussion about the RFRA law here in Georgia the attorney representing the LGBT group that is opposed to the bill was specifically asked if he could point out a single specific instance where members of his constituency were discriminated against that this bill would have prevented. The answer was NO. This is the last I will say on this issue. Your denial of slavery in the north is enough evidence for me that you believe what you want instead of the truth. And your use of CON in all caps, appears to be a slur on either neocons (a small group who very few identify with) or conservatives in general. Regardless of your position, there are millions of conservatives who are proud of their position. The way you try to demonize those who don't agree with you makes you less likely to have someone engage in serious discussion with you. You come of as the very type of intolerant liberal that wants people with religious beliefs discriminated again simply because you don't agree with them. If you are against discrimination you should be against ALL discrimination, not just against you and yours. There are millions of conservatives who do not agree with a gay lifestyle who do not discriminate anyway. You are creating a problem where none exists.

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    Re: Arkansas passes its own religious freedom bill despite uproar in Indiana

    Quote Originally Posted by OrphanSlug View Post
    That is nothing more than convenience. There was a time, back during the Prop 8 vote in California, that these same groups published information on businesses owned by those that supported the measure in boycott efforts.

    This is what I am talking about with the mess we have made. Try the voter, do not like the results and rush to the courts. Try the courts, do not like the results and rush to the polls for an alternative try.

    At the end of the day we have social conservatism that wants government on their side, social liberalism wants government on their side. We should have left government out the picture from the start, it is most unfortunate that we are so far past that now the only option left is government forced protections for some with question on Constitutionality.

    This is another one of those subjects that the history books will not look to kind on, I suspect putting the anti-gay movement of today right up there with racists of the 50's and 60's.


    Well, the Apple CEO kind of went mute when asked why he was doing business in the ME and China. Especially with the way they treat gays and others. Then its deflect and talk about profits and the benefits of what they do.

  9. #29
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    Re: Arkansas passes its own religious freedom bill despite uproar in Indiana

    Quote Originally Posted by chromium View Post
    indiana's governor wrote to the lobbyists that the law would put a stop to the gay agenda and "cross dressing" (what he thinks of transgender) and it would protect christian. See, no mention of minority religions like the early 90s RFRA, no attempt to even pretend it's not anti gay.

    Now the governor is trying to circle the wagons and pretend it was never about that, only because the hostility to his law is at epic levels. You are pulling this apologist crap on behalf of a scumbag politician, but you may as well just stop, cause i'll never fall for it.

    The "RFRA" were never worded like this or conceived as an anti gay strategy until recently. It's way too early to know how many cases there'll be in the next few years, before federal courts get off their ass and put a stop to it. And rest assured this will be as loathed and conquered as "DOMA", "DADT", consensual sex laws, and every other attempt to oppress
    That was a lot of words to explain that you don't know how this law works.

  10. #30
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    Re: Arkansas passes its own religious freedom bill despite uproar in Indiana

    Walmart's President has stepped to the plate. As such I suspect the Gov has just had his balls cut off. Oh the irony.


    Walmart Takes Firm Stand Against Arkansas Religious Freedom Bill - ABC News
    Quote Originally Posted by Bucky View Post
    You have no empirical evidence backing up your false assertion. You are simply conjecturing based on a whim...
    Quote Originally Posted by Hawkeye10 View Post
    Or maybe "We now understand why women provoke men into hitting them".

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