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Gov. Mike Pence: Change RFRA law to make it clear discrimination won't be allowed

I see, so the fact that they have a catalog of cakes people can choose from makes no difference at all and yet your side acts like it matters. Figures. What do we call that? Oh right, dishonesty.

Who has EVER said the issue relies on a "catolog of cakes". I haven't heard anyone make that argument.
 
Well, that's a little extreme in an attempt to discount my suggestion. I'm just curious - how does one document their income from heroin trafficking? Do people give receipts for such activity?

I don't know. Maybe "Self Employed Pharmaceutical Representative".
 
Constitutional right to exclusiveness? Where is THAT found? You have no RIGHT to decide who will get your labor when you open a business to the public. You don't get to write your own rules because you open a business. If all that were required to practice discrimination is get a business license, we would still have white only lunch counters. Sorry...but America rejected that bigotry decades ago. Time to move into the 21st century.

So what you're saying is that I should work to repeal business licensing laws. Seems pretty hard to pull of, but ok.
 
Who has EVER said the issue relies on a "catolog of cakes". I haven't heard anyone make that argument.

I post in these threads far to often. Needless to say it happens a lot.
 
Constitutional right to exclusiveness? Where is THAT found? You have no RIGHT to decide who will get your labor when you open a business to the public. You don't get to write your own rules because you open a business. If all that were required to practice discrimination is get a business license, we would still have white only lunch counters. Sorry...but America rejected that bigotry decades ago. Time to move into the 21st century.

Yes, you know the right to association kind of implies you can't force people into associations. Meaning, in short, that exclusiveness is a right as well.
 
So what you're saying is that I should work to repeal business licensing laws. Seems pretty hard to pull of, but ok.

That isn't even close to what I am saying. The issue doesn't revolve around getting a license. The point is...if you want to open up a business. Fine....more power to you. But don't think that just because you open a business it means that you get to write your own rules and disregard the laws of this great country. Some people have tried to be "clever" and hide behind their religion and claim that their religion REQUIRES them to be a bigot so the government has to allow them to practice their bigotry and allow their discrimination. Sorry...but that argument is failing and will continue to fail. While you have every right to be a bigot if you so choose...you don't have a right to openly discriminate against any in America in 2015.
 
Don't forget your extreme often cited just hate for those you disagree with politically.

Of course, those political disagreements very clearly cover the kinds of topics we're discussing now (i.e. the abuse of religious freedom to conceal straight-up bigotry and discrimination). So yeah, guilty as charged. I hate your ideology. But I wouldn't deny you service. Just like I'm servicing you right now.
 
Constitutional right to exclusiveness? Where is THAT found? You have no RIGHT to decide who will get your labor when you open a business to the public. You don't get to write your own rules because you open a business. If all that were required to practice discrimination is get a business license, we would still have white only lunch counters. Sorry...but America rejected that bigotry decades ago. Time to move into the 21st century.

Could I open a business and put a sign in my window that says that only conservatives are welcome. Does any law on the books deny me that privilege?

Tim-
 
That isn't even close to what I am saying. The issue doesn't revolve around getting a license. The point is...if you want to open up a business. Fine....more power to you. But don't think that just because you open a business it means that you get to write your own rules and disregard the laws of this great country. Some people have tried to be "clever" and hide behind their religion and claim that their religion REQUIRES them to be a bigot so the government has to allow them to practice their bigotry and allow their discrimination. Sorry...but that argument is failing and will continue to fail. While you have every right to be a bigot if you so choose...you don't have a right to openly discriminate against any in America in 2015.

So why did you mention the license if it doesn't matter to your argument? I sorry, but I'm sensing you are being extremely dishonest right now.
 
Yes, you know the right to association kind of implies you can't force people into associations. Meaning, in short, that exclusiveness is a right as well.

No one is forcing anyone into an association. Bigots can associate with all the bigots that they want. They don't have to join black churches or gay choirs or anything of the sort. They can't however, discriminate and claim that their religion requires them to practice their bigotry in their business.
 
So why did you mention the license if it doesn't matter to your argument? I sorry, but I'm sensing you are being extremely dishonest right now.

Oh puh-lease. Take out the license...the issue remains. Are you going to start nitpicking over word choices now? Are you already out of arguments. If so...tell me now.
 
No one is forcing anyone into an association. Bigots can associate with all the bigots that they want. They don't have to join black churches or gay choirs or anything of the sort. They can't however, discriminate and claim that their religion requires them to practice their bigotry in their business.

That doesn't make a whole lot of sense, you know. That is like saying a woman doesn't have to sleep with a man, but she can't say no.
 
Actually yes. You can't refuse to do business with someone just because you don't like their political beliefs. Putting a sign in a window is not carte blanche to disregard the laws.
 
No one is forcing anyone into an association. Bigots can associate with all the bigots that they want. They don't have to join black churches or gay choirs or anything of the sort. They can't however, discriminate and claim that their religion requires them to practice their bigotry in their business.


Their business is their religion. If you open up your shop in the morning do you stop your religion at the door? What absurd statement?

Tim-
 
Actually yes. You can't refuse to do business with someone just because you don't like their political beliefs. Putting a sign in a window is not carte blanche to disregard the laws.

Yes you can, and the constitution permits it. I can indeed put as sign in my window that cater to ONLY conservatives and there's not anything the government could do to stop me. Unless of course you could point to some violation of the law?

Tim-
 
That doesn't make a whole lot of sense, you know. That is like saying a woman doesn't have to sleep with a man, but she can't say no.

Are you serious? Your arguments are getting weaker and weaker and more silly as you stretch. You need to learn how to make a solid analogy because every one you have tried thus far have been major fails. Not even close to being relevant.
 
I'm not playing stupid.

You said it, not me.

What part of the first Amendment are you referring to? Free speech?

If so, how is the government infringing on their free speech rights?[/quote]

Not so much.

Freedom of religion? The government is not infringing on their right to practice their religion.

See, you did know. If the practice of religion excludes participating in activities that are deemed inappropriate, then the government's requirement does violate the first.




Since everyone ignored it, I'll ask again:

Let's put it this way. What if an actress, who is unmarried and maintained her virginity because of religious beliefs, is requested by an adult film company to work as an actress in scenes that will bring her virginity to an end? Can she not claim religious freedom? Can she not refuse work?
 
Oh puh-lease. Take out the license...the issue remains. Are you going to start nitpicking over word choices now? Are you already out of arguments. If so...tell me now.

Yes, many people in these debates rely on the license, so it seems to me to strip that argument from you all I have to do is remove the license from the equation. I'm opposed to the damn idea of requiring people to get government approval in the first place, so it's cool with me to do either way.
 
Yes you can, and the constitution permits it. I can indeed put as sign in my window that cater to ONLY conservatives and there's not anything the government could do to stop me. Unless of course you could point to some violation of the law?

Tim-

You can put any sign in your window. If I come into your shop and you say "I won't do business with you because you are a liberal", anti-discrimination laws would protect my right to sue. You don't get to pick and choose who you do business with just because you open a shop.
 
Are you serious? Your arguments are getting weaker and weaker and more silly as you stretch. You need to learn how to make a solid analogy because every one you have tried thus far have been major fails. Not even close to being relevant.

Why is it a bad analogy? You're saying they are not forced to associate, but that they can't say no. How is that any different than saying the woman isn't forced to have sex, but she can't say no?
 
You can put any sign in your window. If I come into your shop and you say "I won't do business with you because you are a liberal", anti-discrimination laws would protect my right to sue. You don't get to pick and choose who you do business with just because you open a shop.

Actually yes I do, and you would lose, in fact you wouldn't even get to a trial.

Tim-
 
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