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Thread: Gov. Mike Pence: Change RFRA law to make it clear discrimination won't be allowed

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    Re: Gov. Mike Pence: Change RFRA law to make it clear discrimination won't be allowed

    Quote Originally Posted by Gina View Post
    The Christian bakery would be discriminating against the gay couple. The gay couple would be not be discriminating but they are, yes, making a statement.

    I have an issue with scenarios like this. The argument has been made over and over, let business owners discriminate and if the marketplace of consumers doesn't like it, that business will suffer. The marketplace will speak and all will be righted.

    So, here we have businesses who are doing just that, and there is an outcry when the marketplace speaks.

    It soul crushing to hear my LGBT and non-white family, friends and acquaintances tell me of the bigotry they are routinely confronted with, so I will not condemn those who choose to confront it. Despite the quoted scenario.

    So have at me.
    I would disagree that the marketplace is speaking. The courts are doing the speaking and not giving the marketplace a chance.

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    Re: Gov. Mike Pence: Change RFRA law to make it clear discrimination won't be allowed

    Quote Originally Posted by Amadeus View Post
    Very true, I discriminate against people who discriminate.
    Don't forget your extreme often cited just hate for those you disagree with politically. That's what I was referring to. Not at all surprised you missed it though. Lol.

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    Re: Gov. Mike Pence: Change RFRA law to make it clear discrimination won't be allowed

    Quote Originally Posted by X Factor View Post
    Hi Gina. It's an interesting question. Do we believe people should be able to operate their business according to their own moral/ethical beliefs or does someone lay down those rights as soon as they start a business? I really don't know the right answer or if there even is one. There's a restaurant close by where I work that has Bible verses and sayings posted all over it. Should they be mandated to take that all down if someone says they're offended? The reality of life, I think, is that two very valid worthwhile rights can sometimes conflict and one must necessarily give way to the other and that's always going to cause tension.
    I don't see how they could be forced to take down their Bible verses. That is free speech.

    If they refuse to serve someone because they are LGBT or something like it, then that is a problem and yeah, that's where there is tension. I honestly don't see that running a restaurant (a bakery or photography studio) is akin to practicing one's religion or limiting their ability practice it. That's where I come down on this issue.
    Ricky John Best and Taliesin Myrddin Namkai-Meche
    Micah David-Cole Fletcher
    I have no personal connection to these men. Ricky and Taliesin died and Micah was severely injured because they chose not to sit by silently, instead, they chose to confront hate. My condolences to their families for their tremendous loss and my best wishes to Micah for a full recovery and long, fruitful life.

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    Re: Gov. Mike Pence: Change RFRA law to make it clear discrimination won't be allowed

    Quote Originally Posted by Goshin View Post
    Conscientious Objectors were allowed to not carry a weapon and not fight. My BIL was one such in Vietnam. He went in when drafted as a C.O. and served as an unarmed medic for a front line infantry unit.


    We do have a history of trying to take into consideration the honest objections-of-conscience held by citizens, whether religious or otherwise. Some reasonable compromise is not unjust.


    If a doctor declines to perform an abortion, he can refer the patient to another physician. If a wedding photographer doesn't want to participate in a gay wedding (or a Klan wedding, or a skinhead wedding, or a biker wedding, or a Black Panther wedding), let him refer the prospective customer to another service provider and no harm is done.
    Here's a reasonable compromise:

    We only step in to prevent businesses from rejecting customers based on personal characteristics they can't control and only then when that characteristic has historically been used to the detriment of those people.
    Quote Originally Posted by calamity View Post
    Well, certainly the customer is not an N-word.
    Quote Originally Posted by apdst View Post
    You know her?

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    Re: Gov. Mike Pence: Change RFRA law to make it clear discrimination won't be allowed

    Quote Originally Posted by Lutherf View Post
    I would disagree that the marketplace is speaking. The courts are doing the speaking and not giving the marketplace a chance.
    People, businesses, and other states spoke up and said they would avoid doing business with Indiana. That is 'the marketplace speaking.'
    Quote Originally Posted by apdst View Post
    Jerkoffness is protected by The Constitution. That's what makes America great.
    Quote Originally Posted by applejuicefool View Post
    A murderer putting a bullet through someone's brain is a medical procedure too.

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    Re: Gov. Mike Pence: Change RFRA law to make it clear discrimination won't be allowed

    Quote Originally Posted by Lutherf View Post
    I would disagree that the marketplace is speaking. The courts are doing the speaking and not giving the marketplace a chance.
    The market is speaking very loudly in Indiana.
    Quote Originally Posted by calamity View Post
    Well, certainly the customer is not an N-word.
    Quote Originally Posted by apdst View Post
    You know her?

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    Re: Gov. Mike Pence: Change RFRA law to make it clear discrimination won't be allowed

    Quote Originally Posted by Deuce View Post
    Posting bible verses and discriminating against customers based on their race aren't the same thing.
    You say that now, but wait until someone talks about how they don't feel welcomed there based on the Bible verses and that is de facto discrimination. My suspicion is that you would not exactly be up front and out there advocating for the business's right to post them.

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    Re: Gov. Mike Pence: Change RFRA law to make it clear discrimination won't be allowed

    Quote Originally Posted by ksu_aviator View Post
    Only liberals assume freedom = discrimination. What does that tell you?
    It tells me you have liberals wrong. Liberals are not saying that.
    Ricky John Best and Taliesin Myrddin Namkai-Meche
    Micah David-Cole Fletcher
    I have no personal connection to these men. Ricky and Taliesin died and Micah was severely injured because they chose not to sit by silently, instead, they chose to confront hate. My condolences to their families for their tremendous loss and my best wishes to Micah for a full recovery and long, fruitful life.

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    Re: Gov. Mike Pence: Change RFRA law to make it clear discrimination won't be allowed

    Quote Originally Posted by Lursa View Post
    Exactly. If people want this particular 'freedom' back, then they can have it. And if it's that important to them, I dont see why they wouldnt post it.

    I mean, if you dont really want to serve blacks or Muslims, for ex., then you should have that 'freedom' back but you do have to post it, otherwise how will such people know to avoid your business?
    Sounds reasonable to me.

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    Re: Gov. Mike Pence: Change RFRA law to make it clear discrimination won't be allowed

    Quote Originally Posted by Lursa View Post
    Exactly. If people want this particular 'freedom' back, then they can have it. And if it's that important to them, I dont see why they wouldnt post it.

    I mean, if you dont really want to serve blacks or Muslims, for ex., then you should have that 'freedom' back but you do have to post it, otherwise how will such people know to avoid your business?
    Why are people obligated to tell people where to shop? It's not their concern if someone isn't informed on where they will get service.

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