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Thread: Foreign ministers arrive amid crucial weekend for Iran nuclear talks

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    Re: Foreign ministers arrive amid crucial weekend for Iran nuclear talks

    Quote Originally Posted by Montecresto View Post
    Fair enough, we'll wait to see. Still, whatever the P5+1 agree on, is a P5+1 deal, and not a Kerry deal.
    P5+1 - Iran deal. We agree on that.

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    Re: Foreign ministers arrive amid crucial weekend for Iran nuclear talks

    Quote Originally Posted by donsutherland1 View Post
    We'll see what happens. I suspected that the framework agreement could be reached a few days late. Russia's position, which runs counter to those of the Western states involved in the talks, isn't all that surprising. Russia's interests with respect to Iran are not symmetrical to the Western ones. An immediate end to sanctions could boost Russian commerce and given Russia's current economic challenges, Russia would like to achieve that outcome.

    They changed it up from framework agreement to the new phase. Framework understanding.

    http://www.debatepolitics.com/intern...31-2015-a.html

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    Re: Foreign ministers arrive amid crucial weekend for Iran nuclear talks

    Quote Originally Posted by Montecresto View Post
    I won't disagree with that, and would point out that that would frame many a historical positions that the US has backed for similar reasons, that may not have been all that good for others though. It appears that that's what nations do, watch out for their own interests. That said, I seriously doubt that Russia, or China consider a nuclear armed Iran is a good thing.
    We agree that nations seek to protect/advance their interests, as they should. Just so it is clear, in no way am I suggesting that Russia's position vis-a-vis the complete lifting of sanctions on Iran should an agreement be reached suggests that Russia favors a nuclear-armed Iran. There is no indication that it does. The same holds true for the remainder of the P5 + 1 countries. There is no indication that they favor a nuclear-armed Iran or even would accept such an outcome.

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    Re: Foreign ministers arrive amid crucial weekend for Iran nuclear talks

    Quote Originally Posted by MMC View Post
    They changed it up from framework agreement to the new phase. Framework understanding.

    http://www.debatepolitics.com/intern...31-2015-a.html
    That's part of the papering over of differences where each side has sufficient flexibility to interpret things as it sees fit. "Understanding" is a less exacting term than "agreement" in the realm of diplomacy.

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    Re: Foreign ministers arrive amid crucial weekend for Iran nuclear talks

    Quote Originally Posted by Montecresto View Post
    There is China, Russia, France, the UK and Germany setting at this table. It's not all on Kerry's back.
    Until a few days ago when other ministers arrived, Kerry and Earnest Monitz (US Energy Secretary) were the chief negotiators for the P5+1.

    A good portion of this is indeed on Kerry's back.


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    Re: Foreign ministers arrive amid crucial weekend for Iran nuclear talks

    Quote Originally Posted by donsutherland1 View Post
    That's part of the papering over of differences where each side has sufficient flexibility to interpret things as it sees fit. "Understanding" is a less exacting term than "agreement" in the realm of diplomacy.
    Well, I will let you read it in all its glory. You can weigh in there. As that is what it will be. I doubt Congress will do anything about it, the Demos found a word they can play off of. So now all those that were ready to over-ride will back off. Even Menendez.

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    Re: Foreign ministers arrive amid crucial weekend for Iran nuclear talks

    Quote Originally Posted by Simpleχity View Post
    Until a few days ago when other ministers arrived, Kerry and Earnest Monitz (US Energy Secretary) were the chief negotiators for the P5+1.

    A good portion of this is indeed on Kerry's back.
    Sorry but it wouldn't matter if Kerry negotiated its entirety if Russia and China, Germany, the UK and France sign it too, it's a P5+1 agreement.
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    Re: Foreign ministers arrive amid crucial weekend for Iran nuclear talks

    Quote Originally Posted by Montecresto View Post
    Sorry but it wouldn't matter if Kerry negotiated its entirety if Russia and China, Germany, the UK and France sign it too, it's a P5+1 agreement.
    I didn't say it would. I said that Kerry did most of the heavy negotiating (with Monitz) and ergo, he shoulders the proportional responsibility.


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    Re: Foreign ministers arrive amid crucial weekend for Iran nuclear talks

    Quote Originally Posted by Simpleχity View Post
    I didn't say it would. I said that Kerry did most of the heavy negotiating (with Monitz) and ergo, he shoulders the proportional responsibility.
    Wrong. Again, if he negotiated its entirety, on behalf of the P5+1, and they agree to it and sign on, it's a P5+1 agreement. Likewise, if Lavrov negotiated the entire deal, and the US, UK, France, Germany and China all agreed with it and signed on, it would be a P5+1 agreement, Lavrov shouldering no more or less responsibility than his counterparts in the other participating countries.
    Killing one person is murder, killing 100,000 is foreign policy

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    Re: Foreign ministers arrive amid crucial weekend for Iran nuclear talks



    Strange, no Russia, China, France, UK, or German flag at the negotiating table. The P5+1 is responsible technically, but Kerry is responsible pragmatically.


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