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Thread: Florida teen kills brother, wounds another after argument over food

  1. #31
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    Re: Florida teen kills brother, wounds another after argument over food

    Quote Originally Posted by Hatuey View Post



    There are various multibillion franchises with fictional weapons that beg to differ.

    What makes the games with fictional weapons any better, Hat? It is still glorifying violence.

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    Re: Florida teen kills brother, wounds another after argument over food

    Quote Originally Posted by Goshin View Post
    What makes the games with fictional weapons any better, Hat? It is still glorifying violence.
    I think human beings draw a line between violence with fictional weapons and can't easily do so with violence made to look realistic. We all watched those WB cartoons with Elmer Fudd shooting at Bugs Bunny and Daffy from the 1950s and 1960s. There were also violent tv shows where it was clear that the violence was staged. Yet for some reason, we simply didn't have this many incidents. I could also be wrong and it could simply be that the media reports them more often and they've always happened. However, I think there is a serious difference between media portrayals of weapons 30 years ago and today. I think what has been lost in today's media is the reinforcement or suggestion that it's all fake. To some degree it can be attributed to a lack of consciousness that isn't reinforced.
    I refuse to accept the view that mankind is so tragically bound to the starless midnight of racism and war that the bright daybreak of peace and brotherhood can never become a reality. - MLK

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    Re: Florida teen kills brother, wounds another after argument over food

    Quote Originally Posted by Schwartz View Post
    At least there would be no anonymous guns around 13-year-old kids. Could anyone tell me what's so bad about stricter gun legislation? Those who want to obtain guns will be able to do so anyways. Those who need no gun - and therefore know nothings about safety and proper storage - will face some hurdles that will stop them from obtaining one.
    Do you really believe that?

  4. #34
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    Re: Florida teen kills brother, wounds another after argument over food

    Quote Originally Posted by Hatuey View Post
    I think human beings draw a line between violence with fictional weapons and can't easily do so with violence made to look realistic. We all watched those WB cartoons with Elmer Fudd shooting at Bugs Bunny and Daffy from the 1950s and 1960s. There were also violent tv shows where it was clear that the violence was staged. Yet for some reason, we simply didn't have this many incidents. I could also be wrong and it could simply be that the media reports them more often and they've always happened. However, I think there is a serious difference between media portrayals of weapons 30 years ago and today. I think what has been lost in today's media is the reinforcement or suggestion that it's all fake. To some degree it can be attributed to a lack of consciousness that isn't reinforced.

    I agree that things have changed somewhat, but disagree as to causes.

    30 years ago was 1985. We were just coming down from a violent crime high in the 1970s, which has continued to decline.... which seems to argue that this crisis isn't exactly a major pandemic.

    I remember 1985 well. I had graduated from HS and started college. I remember watching very violent movies starring Arnie and Chuck and others where real or realistic weapons were used.

    Back up another decade, or two... as a kid I watched John Wayne and other war and cowboy movies with real revolvers, rifles, shotguns, Tommy guns and military weapons.


    I don't see this as being the critical difference between the mindset of that day and of today. And frankly considering the long-term decline in violent crime across the country, it calls into question whether anything we've discussed is actually making things *worse*.... since overall violent crime isn't worse, it's less.


    Media hype makes a lot of things, like minors doing stupid things with weapons, SEEM worse, but is it really? Stats seem to say otherwise.

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    Re: Florida teen kills brother, wounds another after argument over food

    Quote Originally Posted by Schwartz View Post
    Florida teen kills brother, wounds another after argument over food | Fox News

    Are we going to do something about it? Kids are dying one by one and absolutely nothing is being done. In 2010, guns took the lives of 31,076 Americans in homicides. 73,505 Americans were treated in hospital emergency departments for non-fatal gunshot wounds in 2010.

    Probably gun control is not a bad idea if you think? Obviously this incident could be avoided with no guns being present in the household. Nobody wants to deprive you from the right to bear arms, all we have to do is comply with stricter legislation. When grown up people die it is sad but when innocent kids suffer it becomes unbearable.
    Instead of commenting on your idiotic blaming of an inanimate object, let's talk about every action the BOY did was already illegal.
    Quote Originally Posted by jet57 View Post
    If certain gun guys are insulted by that? Good, they should be ashamed: the rest of US are sick and tired of having our intelligence insulted[/i].



  6. #36
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    Re: Florida teen kills brother, wounds another after argument over food

    Quote Originally Posted by MACS-24 View Post
    Instead of commenting on your idiotic blaming of an inanimate object, let's talk about every action the BOY did was already illegal.

    1. Minor in possession of firearm unsupervised (depending on state law and circumstances).
    2. Murder
    3. Assault with a deadly weapon/Ass't w/ Intent to Kill.

    but sure, some NEW law would have stopped him in his tracks...


    Kids are dying one by one in traffic accidents too, in far greater numbers than by gunshot, yet apparently that doesn't hit his radar for some reason.

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    Re: Florida teen kills brother, wounds another after argument over food

    Quote Originally Posted by Goshin View Post
    I agree that things have changed somewhat, but disagree as to causes.

    30 years ago was 1985. We were just coming down from a violent crime high in the 1970s, which has continued to decline.... which seems to argue that this crisis isn't exactly a major pandemic.

    I remember 1985 well. I had graduated from HS and started college. I remember watching very violent movies starring Arnie and Chuck and others where real or realistic weapons were used.

    Back up another decade, or two... as a kid I watched John Wayne and other war and cowboy movies with real revolvers, rifles, shotguns, Tommy guns and military weapons.


    I don't see this as being the critical difference between the mindset of that day and of today. And frankly considering the long-term decline in violent crime across the country, it calls into question whether anything we've discussed is actually making things *worse*.... since overall violent crime isn't worse, it's less.


    Media hype makes a lot of things, like minors doing stupid things with weapons, SEEM worse, but is it really? Stats seem to say otherwise.
    I think you missed the part where I say there was a reinforcement that it was fake. Hell, I doubt the average person ever questioned that John Wayne was worlds away from a real cowboy. The same could be said for Chuck and Arnold movies. Even on its best day, Commando simply was a bit of a joke. Today, I don't think that exists. As for the other violence you suggested, I admit I wasn't even alive in the 70s so I don't know for sure but I think that can be attributed to a similar lack of consciousness. However that was brought on by poverty that lasted well into the mid 80s. However, these factors simply don't exist today. You have kids from suburban homes killing class mates because of bullying. You have kids from upper class homes killing their parents over money. You have neighbors killing each other over loud music. You can't simply chalk that up to media hype. It becomes clear that there is a very dangerous culture where guns are promoted as a solution to every problem. Who is responsible? We can say it is the media, but that's like saying cigarette companies had no role in higher smoking rates and lung cancer incidence.
    I refuse to accept the view that mankind is so tragically bound to the starless midnight of racism and war that the bright daybreak of peace and brotherhood can never become a reality. - MLK

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    Re: Florida teen kills brother, wounds another after argument over food

    Quote Originally Posted by Hatuey View Post
    I think you missed the part where I say there was a reinforcement that it was fake. Hell, I doubt the average person ever questioned that John Wayne was worlds away from a real cowboy. The same could be said for Chuck and Arnold movies. Even on its best day, Commando simply was a bit of a joke. Today, I don't think that exists. As for the other violence you suggested, I admit I wasn't even alive in the 70s so I don't know for sure but I think that can be attributed to a similar lack of consciousness. However that was brought on by poverty that lasted well into the mid 80s. However, these factors simply don't exist today. You have kids from suburban homes killing class mates because of bullying. You have kids from upper class homes killing their parents over money. You have neighbors killing each other over loud music. You can't simply chalk that up to media hype. It becomes clear that there is a very dangerous culture where guns are promoted as a solution to every problem. Who is responsible? We can say it is the media, but that's like saying cigarette companies had no role in higher smoking rates and lung cancer incidence.


    Yeah, the confluence of cigarette companies and gun manufacturers isn't working for me.


    Cigarettes don't really do anything positive for you. They aren't useful.


    Guns are useful in many ways. There are not merely a purposeless "vice".


    And again, it is highly debatable whether this stuff is really "worse" than it was 30-40 years ago, given that the overall violent crime rate is substantially down over that time period.

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    ISIS: Carthago Delenda Est
    "I used to roll the dice; see the fear in my enemies' eyes... listen as the crowd would sing, 'now the old king is dead, Long Live the King.'.."

  9. #39
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    Re: Florida teen kills brother, wounds another after argument over food

    Quote Originally Posted by Goshin View Post
    Yeah, the confluence of cigarette companies and gun manufacturers isn't working for me.


    Cigarettes don't really do anything positive for you. They aren't useful.


    Guns are useful in many ways. There are not merely a purposeless "vice".


    And again, it is highly debatable whether this stuff is really "worse" than it was 30-40 years ago, given that the overall violent crime rate is substantially down over that time period.
    Whether they're useful or not doesn't matter. However, if that doesn't work for you: What about medicine? You can't see an ad on tv without a 4 minute explanation on what the side effects of that drug are. You can't even get an ad for menopause meds without some lady talking for 20 mins about how it could lead to some crazy side effect that only occurs in a small percentage of cases. We have literally developed a culture of consumption (in the pharmaceutical industry) where people are informed on the dozens of side effects whether they want to buy the drug or not. You can't get an abortion in some states without having to have a doctor tell you about killing children. Why is this not done with guns? Instead we have a reinforcement that guns are a solution to problems; from movies to video games and even certain politicians depending on their language and the time of the month. Do you believe that can't be changed in the same manner that it was established?
    I refuse to accept the view that mankind is so tragically bound to the starless midnight of racism and war that the bright daybreak of peace and brotherhood can never become a reality. - MLK

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    Re: Florida teen kills brother, wounds another after argument over food

    Quote Originally Posted by tres borrachos View Post
    So what would gun control have done to stop this? According to the article, nobody even knows whose gun it was.
    Does it even matter? Even if it was the parents gun there would be no charges because they have "suffered enough". That is what needs to be changed. Consequences for improper gun ownership needs to be law. The most common "use" for home weapons is to kill or injure the owner or his family and that is a travesty.
    Last edited by iguanaman; 03-26-15 at 04:27 PM.

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