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Thread: Indiana's Pence to sign bill allowing businesses to reject gay customers

  1. #751
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    Re: Indiana's Pence to sign bill allowing businesses to reject gay customers

    Quote Originally Posted by JasperL View Post
    That the term might be used when it's not appropriate doesn't change the "practical meaning." It's only recently that we've pretended that it can apply to both MLK, Jr. and Robert Byrd in his Klan days. When we pretend it does describe both men, we've just decided the word has no practical meaning and might as well be struck from everyday usage.
    I agree..it's too subjective.
    32 “Whoever acknowledges me before others, I will also acknowledge before my Father in heaven. 33 But whoever disowns me before others, I will disown before my Father in heaven.
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    I'm kind of a big deal

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    Re: Indiana's Pence to sign bill allowing businesses to reject gay customers

    Quote Originally Posted by Hicup View Post
    Yes there are, you are profoundly wrong.




    As a gay man living in a state that protects your right to service by the public, you do, well, in fact, have a right to it.




    Force as in SWAT teams raiding establishments. Probably not, but force comes in many different ways, some of which include punitive fines, and legal fees.



    A bit redundant, see above.



    No force to say yes I will serve you, but if you say no I won't serve you, you will be legally compelled, if you insist, you will be tried and if found guilty, you will be fined. If you persist, you will be fined even more to a point where you will not be able to continue business. But you know all this, don't you? I mean how could you not know this, it has only been pointed out to you about 15 million times already.





    Round and round we go, eh?




    And around, and around..




    Not following? What does a contract have to do with anything?


    Tim-
    links? proof? facts? let me know when you have them
    you really should pay attention to context and the actually discussion instead of your obsession with me always trying to get your first chck in the win column.

    would you like my proof to get further destroyed?

    i make widgets, you are a gay man, you walk in my store and want 500 widgets by 5:00, what law forces me to serve you cause you are gay. please state it in your next post or simply show honesty and integrity admit your clime is factually wrong

    anything besides listing the law or admitting you are wrong will result in another failure of your claims and your posts losing to facts.

    Im betting this is dodged or back peddled on who is in?

    also to answer your question "right to contract" doesnt have anything to do with this but somebody made that false claim too
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    Re: Indiana's Pence to sign bill allowing businesses to reject gay customers

    Quote Originally Posted by disneydude View Post
    LOL....do you REALLY think what you wrote has ever been the definition of "Bigotry"? If so...I suggest a English course may be in order.

    As for marriage...which of the vast definitions throughout the course of history are you referring to?
    I suggest you Google it.

    big·ot·ry
    ˈbiɡətrē/
    noun
    intolerance toward those who hold different opinions from oneself.
    "the difficulties of combating prejudice and bigotry"
    32 “Whoever acknowledges me before others, I will also acknowledge before my Father in heaven. 33 But whoever disowns me before others, I will disown before my Father in heaven.
    Matt. 10:32-33

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    Re: Indiana's Pence to sign bill allowing businesses to reject gay customers

    Quote Originally Posted by WCH View Post
    It's meant to be shameful or hurtful. LOL!

    But hey. it works on politicians.
    It's not intended as a compliment, that's for sure, but it (WAS?) is a useful word to describe a person who is intolerant of people of different ethnic/religious/national origin/sexual orientation, etc. It was until recently universally understood to refer to, e.g., those defending Jim Crow laws in the South in the 1950s and NOT those working to overturn those laws. It would apply to a business owner with "WHITES ONLY" in the window and not a business owner who fires a waiter for refusing to wait on "fa*s or ni**ers" and whose restaurant welcomes anyone of any race, creed or color as customers. Etc.

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    Re: Indiana's Pence to sign bill allowing businesses to reject gay customers

    Quote Originally Posted by Phys251 View Post
    Oh my gosh, 'a cartoon argument' - worse yet, its not even funny. Equally unfunny to Bowers is honesty:

    "If I discriminate against or criticize you its called free speech, free association, and freedom of religion. If you return the sentiment and conduct, it is exactly the same thing". Persecution only occurs when someone repeatedly harasses or punishes another in a manner designed to injure, grieve, or afflict; to make someone suffer because of their belief. You know, like a founder of Mozilla "getting whacked (hounded into resigning) by the gay mafia" (Bill Mahr) .
    Last edited by maxparrish; 03-27-15 at 03:27 PM.

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    Re: Indiana's Pence to sign bill allowing businesses to reject gay customers

    Quote Originally Posted by disneydude View Post
    LOL....do you REALLY think what you wrote has ever been the definition of "Bigotry"? If so...I suggest a English course may be in order.

    As for marriage...which of the vast definitions throughout the course of history are you referring to?
    Just curious how you define bigotry. I was brought up to understand it's strongly and stubbornly disliking people, beliefs or ideas that you don't agree with. I'm sure every one of us on here qualifies as a bigot in some way. Do you like everything and everyone, all the time?
    Horse sense is the thing a horse has which keeps it from betting on people. ~W.C. Fields

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    Re: Indiana's Pence to sign bill allowing businesses to reject gay customers

    Quote Originally Posted by JasperL View Post
    That's not true - it's only recently that the definition of bigotry has been turned on its head to include those who are intolerant of bigots, and so would include the civil rights workers killed in Alabama, AND those who killed them. Orwell is smiling somewhere....
    No, everyone is a bigot in some way or another. It might not be towards gays, but there is no doubt you're a bigot in some way or another.

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    Re: Indiana's Pence to sign bill allowing businesses to reject gay customers

    Quote Originally Posted by tres borrachos View Post
    I'm 53 - I hope you don't consider that old. I'm not "even especially religious" - I'm not religious at all. Neither my husband nor I believe, and our sons weren't Christened, Baptized, or any of that. None of them have ever attended a church service. I'm conservative though, but I'm also one of those people who think consenting adults should marry whoever the hell they want - same sex, 19 wives, whatever. It isn't my business, just like it was nobody's business when I decided to marry my husband.
    I consider anyone who was an adult during the fifties "old," since they grew up in a time I can't relate to except in purely abstract terms.

    Quote Originally Posted by tres borrachos View Post
    I know the black vote on Prop 8 wasn't the biggest in relevance. Then again, there is no truth to the statement "the Republican base hates gays".
    82% of Republicans vs 36% of Democrats voted for prop 8. 85% of conservatives vs. 22% of liberals voted for prop 8. Opposition to ssm remains, for now, a Republican/conservative thing. Of course, these numbers are from 2008, so if the vote were held again today the Republican/conservative percentages would probably be less extreme.

    Edit: Yup, the percentages would be different. Strong Opposition to ssm, which almost certainly came mostly from conservatives, has dropped from 40% in 2009 to 24% today.

    http://www.pollingreport.com/civil.htm
    Last edited by Cardinal; 03-27-15 at 03:33 PM.

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    I'm kind of a big deal

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    Re: Indiana's Pence to sign bill allowing businesses to reject gay customers

    Quote Originally Posted by WCH View Post
    I suggest you Google it.

    big·ot·ry
    ˈbiɡətrē/
    noun
    intolerance toward those who hold different opinions from oneself.
    "the difficulties of combating prejudice and bigotry"
    lets see one side (equal rights side) doesnt like the others opinions of others but has no problem with the others being allowed to marry and supports the laws and rights protecting them

    the other side (agains equal rights) doesnt like the others opinions AND doesnt want gays to be allowed to marry and doesnt want them to have the same rights and laws that protect them

    hmmmmm
    wheres the tolerance at again?
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    Re: Indiana's Pence to sign bill allowing businesses to reject gay customers

    Quote Originally Posted by disneydude View Post
    LOL....do you REALLY think what you wrote has ever been the definition of "Bigotry"? If so...I suggest a English course may be in order.

    As for marriage...which of the vast definitions throughout the course of history are you referring to?

    A bigot is One who is strongly partial to one's own group, religion, race, or politics and is intolerant of those who differ. Truth is that since the 1600's the use of the word bigot was used as a slur, rhetorical in nature, and that usage persists today. There is no mention of rationale, or irrationality, and the way you used it above was in-fact being bigoted, whether you like to admit it or not. You claim a bigot is someone with an "irrational" hate or fear of something, but this has never been the case, and even if it was, the subjectivity of the term and syntax overrides your objective. What you fail to see is that, you think people of conviction are irrational when opposing homosexual behavior, yet you provide no context for why they are. In the oldest version in English, the term bigot was defined as someone who holds a strong opinion of something in spite of evidence to the contrary. In this, and in many cases when the term is used today, rationale, and evidence are a matter of opinion, and such has effectively rendered the usage of bigot in this context as moot, or rhetorical. Why some continue to use it suggests that it provides them some internal higher authority over those that they oppose in debate, but this is imagined and self-imposed. It has no real truth basis, only subjective pre-confirmed biases.

    You're welcome.

    Tim-
    “When buying and selling are controlled by legislation, the first things to be bought and sold are legislators.” - P. J. O’Rourke
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