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Thread: Indiana's Pence to sign bill allowing businesses to reject gay customers

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    Re: Indiana's Pence to sign bill allowing businesses to reject gay customers

    Quote Originally Posted by JANFU View Post
    So was the company right, legally that is, in asking you to leave the premises?
    Legally, it not a right vs wrong dynamic, it's a can vs cannot dynamic. Any business can ask you to leave for any or no reason, what counts is how they answer to a judge in the resulting lawsuit. If they ask you to leave, you have to leave even if they're wrong, because if you refuse then you're wrong. What you do is then complain to their corporate headquarters, who will consider if your taking the story to the media is worth loosing your business. If they decide against you or if there is no corporate office, then you can file a complaint with the city and lawmakers will want the business to explain why they're denying the city the sales tax of the transaction. And if that doesn't work out then you can file a civil lawsuit for denying your right to Public Access.

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    Re: Indiana's Pence to sign bill allowing businesses to reject gay customers

    Quote Originally Posted by maquiscat View Post
    Actually what they are saying is that if a customer wants to refuse a business transaction based upon the business owner's race, gender, creed, sexuality, etc then they may do so, but the business owner cannot do the same in return. Sounds like you favor discrimination in one direction but not the other.
    The minute a person has to take out a license to shop in a municipality, you might actually have a point. Until then, not so much. But I'll humour you and say quite clearly that I've never had occasion where I went to purchase something and either left a store or refused a purchase I wanted to make based on the race, gender, religion, age, or sexual orientation of the owner of the store or salesperson who served me. I'm not a religious person, so I can't say what would possess a person to refuse to be waited upon by someone based on any of the above criteria. That's because I don't discriminate based on who a person is. But I do discriminate based on how I'm treated and/or the actions of an individual I'm interacting with. I don't suffer fools lightly and they get none of my time.
    A Canadian conservative is one who believes in limited government and that the government should stay out of our wallets and out of our bedrooms.

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    Re: Indiana's Pence to sign bill allowing businesses to reject gay customers

    A private business should not be forced to serve customers they don't want to serve. Exceptions should exist for medical services, or if there's no viable alternative for the customer. But if a business wants to not serve black people, they should have every right not to, just as everyone offended by that has every right not to shop at their store.
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    Re: Indiana's Pence to sign bill allowing businesses to reject gay customers

    Quote Originally Posted by fmw View Post
    Except business owners, apparently.
    OK, if you want to avoid the point, that's fine. But again, there is no harm when you make a choice as a consumer. When a business discriminates it is the opposite of choice and the harm is easily identifiable.

    And as I said, IMO the harm to a business that chooses to open a business that serves the public to be required to serve the public, without arbitrary and harmful discrimination, is a slight harm and part of owning a business open to the public, same way they have to abide by labor laws, zoning laws, etc.

    So one kind of discrimination is OK while another one is not. I don't find that acceptable. You can deny service to customer A but not customer B. sorry, it doesn't work for me.
    They're not discriminating against you - they're presumably enforcing uniform terms of service applicable to everyone. And I don't agree that it's OK for discriminatory practices to potentially prohibit some other person from engaging in commerce. If you do, if you think it would be OK for Mastercard and Visa and AMEX to shut out all Muslims, and effectively bar them from the online marketplace because they're Muslim, that's an opinion I don't share, but you have to accept that as a potential downside.

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    Re: Indiana's Pence to sign bill allowing businesses to reject gay customers

    Quote Originally Posted by spud_meister View Post
    A private business should not be forced to serve customers they don't want to serve. Exceptions should exist for medical services, or if there's no viable alternative for the customer. But if a business wants to not serve black people, they should have every right not to, just as everyone offended by that has every right not to shop at their store.
    Businesses have no right to hinder commerce unless a customer is harming the business. A free-flowing economy is the healthiest, which makes for a stronger nation. Keep your personal biases at home.

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    Re: Indiana's Pence to sign bill allowing businesses to reject gay customers

    Quote Originally Posted by sangha View Post
    And so can other men

    Have any more irrelevancies you care to share?
    How can another man trample my rights?
    "Life, liberty, and property do not exist because men have made laws. On the contrary, it was the fact that life, liberty, and property existed beforehand that caused men to make laws in the first place."
    -- Frederic Bastiat

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    Re: Indiana's Pence to sign bill allowing businesses to reject gay customers

    Quote Originally Posted by spud_meister View Post
    A private business should not be forced to serve customers they don't want to serve. Exceptions should exist for medical services, or if there's no viable alternative for the customer. But if a business wants to not serve black people, they should have every right not to, just as everyone offended by that has every right not to shop at their store.
    It is a public business.
    So you favor repealing all Civil Rights laws that pertain to color. Hey why not throw in disabilities as well?
    And why do medical services get a pass? Check into it they do.
    Quote Originally Posted by Erod View Post
    The damage to the black community from all this will be devastating.
    Not only on public perception and reputation, but cops simply won't want to police these neighborhoods anymore.
    The shooter was later found to be white.

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    Re: Indiana's Pence to sign bill allowing businesses to reject gay customers

    Quote Originally Posted by Jerry View Post
    Businesses have no right to hinder commerce unless a customer is harming the business. A free-flowing economy is the healthiest, which makes for a stronger nation. Keep your personal biases at home.
    I see you are okay with coercion and force.
    "Life, liberty, and property do not exist because men have made laws. On the contrary, it was the fact that life, liberty, and property existed beforehand that caused men to make laws in the first place."
    -- Frederic Bastiat

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    Re: Indiana's Pence to sign bill allowing businesses to reject gay customers

    Quote Originally Posted by AGENT J View Post
    1.) you wouldnt have broken any laws for refusing business so why would somebody force you out of business
    The Christian bakers refused, and now are out of business. Reality mugs you again.

    Quote Originally Posted by AGENT J View Post
    2.) what you are describing isnt reality or happening
    See #1
    Quote Originally Posted by AGENT J View Post
    3.) i would agree IF that was happening but its not, you are free to say no with nothing happening
    See #1
    Quote Originally Posted by AGENT J View Post
    4.) i agree 100% it is a very simply concept thats why its confusing you cant grasp it. you can say no so your point is meaningless
    facts win again
    No, you can't say no. See #1. Your facts aren't facts, you just think they are.
    Disinformation campaign? The Russian collusion meme pushed by the 'news' media, behaving as a political propaganda organ, hell bent to destroy a legitimately elected president to implement his agenda per the votes of the same electorate. Reference The Big Lie Reference Goebbels

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    Re: Indiana's Pence to sign bill allowing businesses to reject gay customers

    Quote Originally Posted by freeRadical View Post
    How can another man trample my rights?
    Try talking about the issue this thread is about.
    Quote Originally Posted by matchlight View Post
    Justice Thomas' opinions consistently contain precise, detailed constitutional analyses.
    Quote Originally Posted by jaeger19 View Post
    the vast majority of folks that need healthcare are on Medicare.. both rich and poor..

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