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Thread: Indiana's Pence to sign bill allowing businesses to reject gay customers

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    Re: Indiana's Pence to sign bill allowing businesses to reject gay customers

    Quote Originally Posted by freeRadical View Post
    So you can't define it? I want to know your definition of public accomodation.
    No, I can't.

    The law defines it.
    Quote Originally Posted by matchlight View Post
    Justice Thomas' opinions consistently contain precise, detailed constitutional analyses.
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    the vast majority of folks that need healthcare are on Medicare.. both rich and poor..

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    Re: Indiana's Pence to sign bill allowing businesses to reject gay customers

    A
    Quote Originally Posted by tres borrachos View Post
    Conventions in Indiana? I've been to conventions all over the world, and never one there. I'm not sure how the threats to Pence are going to work...they said Arizona was dead after Brewer signed her bill into law, and tourism hasn't suffered there.

    I'll bet SCOTUS will overturn this easily.
    It hurt business here when Brewer signed the bill. A year later it was felt. Big new convention center and no one using it or hotels or golf courses.










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    Re: Indiana's Pence to sign bill allowing businesses to reject gay customers

    10 bucks says this law will backfire when enterprising liberals decide that serving Republicans I'd against their religion.


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    This issue has been plowed more times than Paris Hilton.
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    I call my wife a slut

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    Re: Indiana's Pence to sign bill allowing businesses to reject gay customers

    Quote Originally Posted by HenryChinaski View Post
    You really think that there's no harm done in forcing a black person out of a restaurant because he is black?
    That's what I said.

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    Re: Indiana's Pence to sign bill allowing businesses to reject gay customers

    Quote Originally Posted by Blemonds View Post
    One was tyranny aimed at the consumer, the new one is tyranny aimed at the merchant. Tyranny is tyranny
    This regime is tyrannical!!! It's requiring businesses open to the public to serve ALL the public. Oh, the HORROR!!

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    Re: Indiana's Pence to sign bill allowing businesses to reject gay customers

    Quote Originally Posted by disneydude View Post
    Therein lies the deception and BS that the Mormon church engaged in. There are documents and recordings that demonstrate the actions of the Mormon church and the efforts that they underwent to hide their illegal activities.
    I don't care even a little bit. Seems like free political speech to me. Regardless, I note the absence of a link to substantiate your claim.
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    Re: Indiana's Pence to sign bill allowing businesses to reject gay customers

    Quote Originally Posted by JasperL View Post
    It depends. You're I assume deliberately missing the point.

    You mention the baker. You have no idea what his conscience says about baking a cake versus baking a cake AND putting two grooms on top, but conclude that the law cannot require him to act contrary to his conscience AND that "he'd have to bake the cake." Both can't be true. Again, pick a side, any side.
    Sorry, but I'm pretty sure claims of conscience can't be extended to cake baking.
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    Re: Indiana's Pence to sign bill allowing businesses to reject gay customers

    Quote Originally Posted by JasperL View Post
    The law prohibits discrimination against Jews. A skinhead's conscience (presumably) tells him to discriminate against Jews. If he's in business open to the public, the law requires him to act contrary to his conscience.

    I don't know why you're insisting I embrace cognitive dissonance to have this discussion with you.
    There's no cognitive dissonance involved. Your skinhead is free to hate Jews and he's free to avoid participation in their activities but he's not free to decline normal commercial interaction just because of who they are, and the RFRA would not protect him in that case.
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    Re: Indiana's Pence to sign bill allowing businesses to reject gay customers

    Quote Originally Posted by JasperL View Post
    Also, too, let's try again on this:

    And on the broader question, you've also quoted legal experts who say there isn't any instance of the RFRA allowing discrimination against LGBT. But clearly some people's consciences demand they DO discriminate - they've sued for the right to discriminate against same sex couples and deny service to them.

    This law either does or does not give Christians the right to act consistent with their conscience and deny services to gays. Which is it?

    BTW, you're hilariously saying that if liberals believe one of your statements (law allows people to act consistent with their consciences), they're purposely ginning up a faux controversy, and to prove it you contradict yourself and point out nothing in RFRA or state equivalents allow for discrimination....
    It's a nuanced question that may be too fine-grained for you. The RFRA does not protect those who decline normal commercial interaction. It does protect those whose specific services would require them to participate in or appear to endorse an activity that offends their conscience. The hard cases are those determining where normal commercial interaction stops and infringements of conscience begin.
    "It's always reassuring to find you've made the right enemies." -- William J. Donovan

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    Re: Indiana's Pence to sign bill allowing businesses to reject gay customers


    Indiana's Religious Freedom Restoration Act, Explained

    2:10 PM, Mar 27, 2015 By JOHN MCCORMACKOn Thursday, Indiana governor Mike Pence signed the Religious Freedom Restoration Act (RFRA) into law, and some celebrities, politicians, and journalists--including Miley Cyrus, Ashton Kutcher, and Hillary Clinton, just to name a few--are absolutely outraged. They say the law is a license to discriminate against gay people:

    Read more...

    ". . . . Stanford law professor Michael McConnell, a former appellate court judge, tells THE WEEKLY STANDARD in an email: "In the decades that states have had RFRA statutes, no business has been given the right to discriminate against gay customers, or anyone else." So what is the Religious Freedom Restoration Act, and what does it say?
    The first RFRA was a 1993 federal law that was signed into law by Democratic president Bill Clinton. It unanimously passed the House of Representatives, where it was sponsored by then-congressman Chuck Schumer, and sailed through the Senate on a 97-3 vote.
    The law reestablished a balancing test for courts to apply in religious liberty cases (a standard had been used by the Supreme Court for decades). RFRA allows a person's free exercise of religion to be "substantially burdened" by a law only if the law furthers a "compelling governmental interest" in the "least restrictive means of furthering that compelling governmental interest."
    So the law doesn't say that a person making a religious claim will always win. In the years since RFRA has been on the books, sometimes the courts have ruled in favor of religious exemptions, but many other times they haven't. . . . . "
    "It's always reassuring to find you've made the right enemies." -- William J. Donovan

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