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Thread: Khamenei calls ‘Death to America’ as Kerry hails progress on nuke deal

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    Re: Khamenei calls ‘Death to America’ as Kerry hails progress on nuke deal

    Quote Originally Posted by Dittohead not! View Post
    Well, maybe. I think B'smith makes a pretty good case for mis translation.
    For his mistranslation, sure.
    But your comment is absurd in light of Official sources saying it means "wipe".


    Quote Originally Posted by Dittohead not! View Post
    Consider this: The American president, on behalf of the United Nations, just brokered a deal
    Is that what you think?


    Quote Originally Posted by Dittohead not! View Post
    and assented to having inspectors to see to it that they kept their word.
    Double D'oh!
    Though not final...
    Inspection of what again?
    Did you forget to include the word "declared"?
    Which is the opposite of undeclared.


    Quote Originally Posted by Dittohead not! View Post
    It makes sense that having perpetuated that mistranslation was a part of their strategy to get sanctions lifted.

    You are suggesting they were making those threats, all those threats going many years all in a strategy to get sanctions lifted?
    Bs!
    They made those threats because they desire what they state, especially as those statements are of a type that are deserving of more sanctions.





    Quote Originally Posted by B'smith View Post
    Please stop trying to bait me with your vague & repeated "comments are absurd"

    It is irrefutable that there has been an extensive, major media, anti Iran bias leaving many people hostile to a country to which they've never been & people they've never met. That would include you and too many Americans

    The only "they" that matters here are the original speakers and those attempting to produce OBJECTIVE & ACCURATE translations of which there have been very few.

    It seems that you've never learned to become fluent in a second language or you would have a better understanding of mistranslations and the fact that some sentiments simply can't be accurately translated.

    I've been to Iran & maintain contact with Iranians and High Ranking US Military Officers who report friendly working relationships with Iran's military personnel during their frequent encounters.

    For Example, US & Iranian sailors routinely exchange greetings & gifts while aiding each other in Search-&-Rescue Ops & routine accidents. Lemon & sugar coated cashews from the Iranians are especially popular among US sailors & Marines.

    The US - Iranian Relationship can easily improve & be beneficial to all as there is much more going on between Iran & the US that is classified, censored or ignored by a US media with a history of anti Iran bias.

    If there is to be a "final word on it", it should certainly be a well informed & objective "final word"


    Your comments continue to be illogical and absurd.

    It is irrefutable that they meant what they said, as represented by Official sources.

    You do not get to discount what they say it means. They decide that, not you, and not someone trying to spin what they mean.

    They told you what it means and that is the final word on it. Period.
    “The law is reason, free from passion.”
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    Re: Khamenei calls ‘Death to America’ as Kerry hails progress on nuke deal

    Quote Originally Posted by Excon View Post
    For his mistranslation, sure.
    But your comment is absurd in light of Official sources saying it means "wipe".



    Is that what you think?


    Double D'oh!
    Though not final...
    Inspection of what again?
    Did you forget to include the word "declared"?
    Which is the opposite of undeclared.



    You are suggesting they were making those threats, all those threats going many years all in a strategy to get sanctions lifted?
    Bs!
    They made those threats because they desire what they state, especially as those statements are of a type that are deserving of more sanctions.







    Your comments continue to be illogical and absurd.

    It is irrefutable that they meant what they said, as represented by Official sources.

    You do not get to discount what they say it means. They decide that, not you, and not someone trying to spin what they mean.

    They told you what it means and that is the final word on it. Period.
    You can not take the statements made by a regime like that of Iran at face value.
    “A people that elect corrupt politicians, imposters, thieves and traitors are not victims... but accomplices” George Orwell


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    Re: Khamenei calls ‘Death to America’ as Kerry hails progress on nuke deal

    Quote Originally Posted by Excon View Post
    For his mistranslation, sure.
    But your comment is absurd in light of Official sources saying it means "wipe".



    Is that what you think?


    Double D'oh!
    Though not final...
    Inspection of what again?
    Did you forget to include the word "declared"?
    Which is the opposite of undeclared.



    You are suggesting they were making those threats, all those threats going many years all in a strategy to get sanctions lifted?
    Bs!
    They made those threats because they desire what they state, especially as those statements are of a type that are deserving of more sanctions.







    Your comments continue to be illogical and absurd.

    It is irrefutable that they meant what they said, as represented by Official sources.

    You do not get to discount what they say it means. They decide that, not you, and not someone trying to spin what they mean.

    They told you what it means and that is the final word on it. Period.
    ______________________

    What qualifies you to speak so authoritatively on Foreign Language mistranslations, the sentiments of Iran's people, Iranian military personnel, Iranian leaders or Iranian propensity for initiating a War?

    You have only submitted sources that are admittedly pro Israel, have a history of repeating proven mistranslations & evaded my questions.

    Since you won't answer my questions, readers here can only assume that you have never learned a foreign language, been to Iran, lived among its people, studied its history, recently spoken with Iranians, maintained contact with any, know anyone who has worked with them or experienced life in another culture.

    Please correct me if I'm wrong.

    You are welcome to an opinion on any topic but do not seem qualified to dismiss others as "illogical and absurd"


    I assume that if Israel's Minister of Intelligence and Atomic Energy, Dan Meridor didn't interpret the "Wipe Israel off the map..." literally, no one could:


    “Meridor: Iran never called to wipe out Israel”
    Meridor: Iran never called to wipe out Israel - Israel News, Ynetnews
    EXCERPT Minister of Intelligence and Atomic Energy Dan Meridor told Al Jazeera that Iran never vowed to "wipe Israel off the map," as Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu has repeatedly claimed.

    In 2005 Iranian President Mahmoud Ahmadinejad was quoted as saying that Israel should be "wiped off the map," but it was later revealed that the translation of his remarks, published by media outlets around the world, was incorrect.

    Ahmadinejad was actually quoting the leader of the 1979 Islamic revolution: "The Imam said this regime occupying Jerusalem must vanish from the page of time."CONTINUED

    *
    "Wipe off the map" has, at the most, meant "erase from a physical, geographic "map" after Israel's natural disintegration"

    NOT "Be annihilated, militarily, by Iran"

    RECENT IRANIAN SENTIMENT:


    “Don’t Fear the Hardliners”
    http://foreignpolicy.com/2015/04/04/...arif-khamenei/

    EXCERPT “The scenes in Tehran in the hours following the announcement of the nuclear deal were a testament to how important Iranians felt it*was to their lives. In different cities, people took to the streets on Thursday, honking horns, waving flags, cheering. It had been a long time coming.

    Supreme Leader, Ayatollah Khamenei, had been involved in the negotiating process all along, constantly “providing advice” to the government and its negotiators. This was a clear message to the hawks: the supreme leader is on the negotiating team’s side and aware of all of its work."CONTINUED

    If Khamenei is so supportive of these negotiations, he cannot be but so obsessed with attacking Israel
    Last edited by B'smith; 04-05-15 at 12:57 PM.

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    Re: Khamenei calls ‘Death to America’ as Kerry hails progress on nuke deal

    Quote Originally Posted by B'smith
    Nothing matters except for ACCURATE translations in all cases relating to Iranian quotes from Farsi.
    If by "official translations", you mean the "Wipe Israel...." , that is a fraudulent mistranslation and is NOT what the speaker said even if you consider it "Official".
    A few hundred years ago, the "Official version" was that the earth was flat
    Since then it has been discovered that that conception is false & the earth is not flat.
    It is the same with those "Wipe Israel..." quotes even if you (or others) consider them "Official"
    The earth is not flat nor did Khamenei (& others) threaten to "Wipe Israel from the face of the earth"
    The source you cited "Times of Israel" is among those who repeated/helped spread earlier mistranslations & are untrustworthy. An "Official" mistranslation is just as false as an "unofficial" mistranslation. I can't make this any simpler.Do you understand the meaning of "mistranslation"?
    1. I compressed your Usual extra-erratically spaced post down to single space; also these _______
    More Volume doesn't mean more content.

    Intent was the same and the Source of the 'Mistranslation' was Iran ITSELF.
    Contemporary Wiki entry

    "One may wonder: where did this false interpretation originate?
    Who is responsible for the translation that has sparked such worldwide controversy?

    The answer is surprising. The inflammatory 'wiped off the map' quote was first disseminated not by Iran's enemies, but by Iran itself.
    The Islamic Republic News Agency, Iran's official Propaganda arm, used this phrasing in the English version of some of their news releases covering the World Without Zionism conference.

    International media including the BBC, Al Jazeera, Time magazine and countless others picked up the IRNA quote and made headlines out of it without verifying its accuracy, and rarely referring to the source. Iran's Foreign Minister soon attempted to clarify the statement, but the quote had a life of its own. Though the IRNA wording was inaccurate and misleading, the media assumed it was true, and besides, it made great copy.

    The phrase 'Wiped away' can Still be seen on Mr Ahmadinejad's Presidential website....

    Mahmoud Ahmadinejad and Israel - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
    What Did he actually say/mean?

    Iranian President at Tehran Conference: 'Very Soon, This Stain of Disgrace [i.e. Israel] Will Be Purged From the Center of the Islamic World
    [.....]
    "They [ask]: 'Is it possible for us to witness a world without America and Zionism?' But you had best know that this slogan and this goal are attainable, and surely can be achieved.

    [[[...]]] "When the dear Imam [Khomeini] said that [the Shah's] regime must go, and that we demand a world without dependent governments, many people who claimed to have political and other knowledge [asked], 'Is it possible [that the Shah's regime can be toppled]?' That day, when Imam [Khomeini] began his movement, all the powers supported [the Shah's] corrupt regime [[[...]]] and said it was not possible.
    [[[...]]]
    Imam [Khomeini] said:
    'This regime that is occupying Qods [Jerusalem] must be Eliminated from the pages of history.' This sentence is very wise. The issue of Palestine is NOT an issue on which we can Compromise.
    Is it possible that an [Islamic] front allows another front [i.e. country] to arise in its [own] heart? This means defeat, and he who accepts the Existence of this regime [i.e. Israel] in fact signs the defeat of the Islamic world.
    In his battle against the World of Arrogance, our dear Imam [Khomeini] set the regime occupying Qods [Jerusalem] as the target of his fight. I do not doubt that the new wave which has begun in our dear Palestine and which today we are also witnessing in the Islamic world is a wave of morality which has spread all over the Islamic world.
    Very soon, this stain of disgrace [ie. Israel] will vanish from the center of the Islamic world - and this is attainable."
    What did he mean that Islam/Iran Cannot accept Israel or compromise with it, and that:
    "Very soon, this stain of disgrace [Israel] will vanish from the center of the Islamic world - and this is attainable."
    What would make it "Attainable to get rid of this Stain of Disgrace" "Very Soon"?

    Surely "Very soon" the Arabs/Iranians aren't going to get a Conventional advantage over Israel.
    Surely Israel isn't going to vote itself out of existence either.
    So what could he have Possibly meant by "attainable" "Very Soon"?
    Last edited by mbig; 04-06-15 at 03:08 PM.
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    Re: Khamenei calls ‘Death to America’ as Kerry hails progress on nuke deal

    Quote Originally Posted by mbig View Post
    1. I compressed your Usual extra-erratically spaced post down to single space; also these _______
    More Volume doesn't mean more content.

    Intent was the same and the Source of the 'Mistranslation' was Iran ITSELF.


    What Did he actually say/mean?

    Iranian President at Tehran Conference: 'Very Soon, This Stain of Disgrace [i.e. Israel] Will Be Purged From the Center of the Islamic World

    What did he mean that Islam/Iran Cannot accept Israel or compromise with it, and that:
    "Very soon, this stain of disgrace [Israel] will vanish from the center of the Islamic world - and this is attainable."
    What would make it "Attainable to get rid of this Stain of Disgrace" "Very Soon"?

    Surely "Very soon" the Arabs/Iranians aren't going to get a Conventional advantage over Israel.
    Surely Israel isn't going to vote itself out of existence either.
    So what could he have Possibly meant by "attainable" "Very Soon"?
    Perhaps he expects Allah to take care of the problem.
    “A people that elect corrupt politicians, imposters, thieves and traitors are not victims... but accomplices” George Orwell


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    Re: Khamenei calls ‘Death to America’ as Kerry hails progress on nuke deal

    Quote Originally Posted by Dittohead not! View Post
    You can not take the statements made by a regime like that of Iran at face value.

    When they are speaking about the violence which they would like to happen, you sure can.
    “The law is reason, free from passion.”
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    Re: Khamenei calls ‘Death to America’ as Kerry hails progress on nuke deal

    Quote Originally Posted by B'smith View Post
    What qualifies you to speak so authoritatively on Foreign Language mistranslations, the sentiments of Iran's people, Iranian military personnel, Iranian leaders or Iranian propensity for initiating a War?


    Your comments continue to be illogical and absurd.

    It is irrefutable that they meant what they said, as represented by Official sources.

    Nothing you provided refutes what they say they meant.
    Do you really not get that?


    You do not get to discount what they say it means. They decide that, not you, and not someone trying to spin what they mean.


    What qualifies me? Apparently you are not paying attention.

    They told you what it means. Period.
    “The law is reason, free from passion.”
    Aristotle
    (≚ᄌ≚)

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    Re: Khamenei calls ‘Death to America’ as Kerry hails progress on nuke deal

    Quote Originally Posted by Excon View Post

    When they are speaking about the violence which they would like to happen, you sure can.
    You can believe the Iranians if you'd like. I'll remain skeptical.
    “A people that elect corrupt politicians, imposters, thieves and traitors are not victims... but accomplices” George Orwell


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    Re: Khamenei calls ‘Death to America’ as Kerry hails progress on nuke deal

    Quote Originally Posted by Dittohead not! View Post
    You can believe the Iranians if you'd like. I'll remain skeptical.
    “The law is reason, free from passion.”
    Aristotle
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    Re: Khamenei calls ‘Death to America’ as Kerry hails progress on nuke deal

    Quote Originally Posted by Excon View Post
    Is that an illustration of the difficulty of maintaining that statements by the regime in Iran actually can be taken at face value?
    “A people that elect corrupt politicians, imposters, thieves and traitors are not victims... but accomplices” George Orwell


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