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Thread: Khamenei calls ‘Death to America’ as Kerry hails progress on nuke deal

  1. #491
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    Re: Khamenei calls ‘Death to America’ as Kerry hails progress on nuke deal

    Quote Originally Posted by US Conservative View Post
    Less than 50/50=most likely not.
    Only in your mind. Lord knows though that the Israeli and American right both have sought at every turn to sabotage the talks.
    Killing one person is murder, killing 100,000 is foreign policy

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    Re: Khamenei calls ‘Death to America’ as Kerry hails progress on nuke deal

    Quote Originally Posted by US Conservative View Post
    Iran shoots women who dare protest in the face. Spare me the tourist brochure.

    Why can't you respond without the sarcasm & simply admit that you don't like a country to which you've never been, know virtually nothing about & dislike its people whom you've never met?

    In protests everywhere, protesters occasionally get shot & worse, especially in Israel.

    Have you ever spent an extended time, by yourself in a completely different culture? Any different culture?

    In the Islamic world, your host insists on paying for everything (meals, just tea etc). It is more polite to spit in his face than reach in your pocket to pay. It's a cultural thing.

    On the way, he will take your hand & hold it to show that you are his guest, under his protection. If you relied on photos & U Tubes, you would mistaken assume all the men were gay. Right?

    In the marketplaces, people are almost insulted if you don't haggle over the price of goods. It has nothing to do the price so much as taking the time to communicate/socialize with them.

    I'm afraid that the dislike/hatred/distrust you have of the Iranians is more of an indicator of the media bias to which you & like minded individuals have been extensively exposed than realities about the Islamic world, Iran & the Iranians.


    For the record, I wouldn't want to live in an Islamic country but I don't think that cultural differences preclude trusting, mutually beneficial & friendly relationships.
    ______________
    This is about the author who wrote the article I cited.:


    John Simpson (journalist) - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
    en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_Simpson_(journalist)‎
    EXCERPT “... He has reported from more than 120 countries, including thirty war zones,”CONTINUED



    “Iran is the most charming country on Earth”
    John Simpson: Iran is the most charming country on Earth - Telegraph






    Thanks

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    Re: Khamenei calls ‘Death to America’ as Kerry hails progress on nuke deal

    Quote Originally Posted by B'smith View Post
    Why can't you respond without the sarcasm & simply admit that you don't like a country to which you've never been, know virtually nothing about & dislike its people whom you've never met?

    In protests everywhere, protesters occasionally get shot & worse, especially in Israel.

    Have you ever spent an extended time, by yourself in a completely different culture? Any different culture?

    In the Islamic world, your host insists on paying for everything (meals, just tea etc). It is more polite to spit in his face than reach in your pocket to pay. It's a cultural thing.

    On the way, he will take your hand & hold it to show that you are his guest, under his protection. If you relied on photos & U Tubes, you would mistaken assume all the men were gay. Right?

    In the marketplaces, people are almost insulted if you don't haggle over the price of goods. It has nothing to do the price so much as taking the time to communicate/socialize with them.

    I'm afraid that the dislike/hatred/distrust you have of the Iranians is more of an indicator of the media bias to which you & like minded individuals have been extensively exposed than realities about the Islamic world, Iran & the Iranians.


    For the record, I wouldn't want to live in an Islamic country but I don't think that cultural differences preclude trusting, mutually beneficial & friendly relationships.
    ______________
    This is about the author who wrote the article I cited.:


    John Simpson (journalist) - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
    en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_Simpson_(journalist)‎
    EXCERPT “... He has reported from more than 120 countries, including thirty war zones,”CONTINUED



    “Iran is the most charming country on Earth”
    John Simpson: Iran is the most charming country on Earth - Telegraph






    Thanks
    Ive never had ebola, I have no desire to get it. And I have travelled, but never to Iran.

    My parents met in Kuwait and they have both lived in Egypt and Kuwait, and spent time elsewhere.

    We still have many family friends from the ME.

    I grew up with people from the ME.

    I work with people from all over the world including the ME.

    So, I have an idea.

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    Re: Khamenei calls ‘Death to America’ as Kerry hails progress on nuke deal

    Quote Originally Posted by Montecresto View Post
    Only in your mind. Lord knows though that the Israeli and American right both have sought at every turn to sabotage the talks.


    RE: TREASON VIA "THE LOGAN ACT"


    At this point, Obama has a petition of over 155,000 signatures (and counting) requesting that charges be filed against the "Felonious Forty Seven" giving him additional leverage & an indication of growing support




    “150,000 call for treason charge for US senators”
    150,000 call for treason charge for US senators - The China Post

    EXCERPT “WASHINGTON -- More than 155,000 people by Wednesday had signed a petition to the White House urging charges be filed against 47 U.S. Republican senators who they say committed “treasonous” offenses by writing to Iran's leaders about ongoing nuclear negotiations.

    The White House has said it responds to such petitions when they reach the 100,000-signature threshold, providing President Barack Obama's administration with another opportunity to slam a letter that it considers inflammatory.

    According to the petition, the 47 senators “committed a treasonous offense when they decided to violate the Logan Act, a 1799 law which forbids unauthorized citizens from negotiating with foreign governments.”CONTINUED




    This is a brief definition of "The Logan Act"

    EXERPT: the Logan Act. This act makes it a felony for an American citizen “without authority of the United States” to interact “with any foreign government or any officer or agent thereof” with the intent to influence that government’s behavior on any disputes with the United States.”CONTINUED

    FROM: “Rep. Eric Cantor violates the Logan*Act”
    http://progressivenetwork.wordpress....the-logan-act/

    ______________________

    Thanks

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    Re: Khamenei calls ‘Death to America’ as Kerry hails progress on nuke deal

    Quote Originally Posted by US Conservative View Post
    Ive never had ebola, I have no desire to get it. And I have travelled, but never to Iran.

    My parents met in Kuwait and they have both lived in Egypt and Kuwait, and spent time elsewhere.

    We still have many family friends from the ME.

    I grew up with people from the ME.

    I work with people from all over the world including the ME.

    So, I have an idea.

    ____________________________________________
    Please stop with the disingenuous sarcasm Re: Iran = ebola. It might be good for "Points" with Third Graders & Xenophobes but does nothing to support the argument that Iran doesn't deserve a nuclear program.

    Thanks for responding but I asked if YOU had spent an extended (6 months + or so) by yourself in a completely different culture. Knowing people who have parachuted is not nearly as instructive as experiencing it yourself.

    For example, I was in the Islamic world 10 - 11 months hitch hiking, walking, Railroad etc & existing on the kindness of strangers

    Being in the M.E. etc to watch how Iranians etc communicate helps to understand what they mean & don't mean. Iranians are not the same as Iraqis, Syrians etc.

    When a merchant says his "family will starve" if he doesn't get a higher price, he doesn't mean it, knows that you don't believe it & doesn't expect you to believe that his family will literally "starve. It's just the standard marketplace rhetoric of the different culture.

    The same thing applies to the standard, hyperbolic rhetoric of the Iranian Revolution when the Ayatollah says "Death to ______". He doesn't mean it literally & doesn't expect his audience to believe that he means it literally.

    Another cultural difference is the notion of "Private Property. There is the tradition of extensive generosity & kindness to travelers in much of the Islamic world/M.E. The Bedouin & others for example keep a sheltered area maintained with water, fruit, bread for traveling strangers to sleep, eat etc.

    In the U.S., doing the same thing is considered a crime.

    Neither culture is "Evil" for these cultural differences but because of them, extensive negotiations are more essential than between similar cultures.

    There is no rational alternative.


    Thanks

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    Re: Khamenei calls ‘Death to America’ as Kerry hails progress on nuke deal

    Quote Originally Posted by B'smith View Post
    ____________________________________________
    Please stop with the disingenuous sarcasm Re: Iran = ebola. It might be good for "Points" with Third Graders & Xenophobes but does nothing to support the argument that Iran doesn't deserve a nuclear program.

    Thanks for responding but I asked if YOU had spent an extended (6 months + or so) by yourself in a completely different culture. Knowing people who have parachuted is not nearly as instructive as experiencing it yourself.

    For example, I was in the Islamic world 10 - 11 months hitch hiking, walking, Railroad etc & existing on the kindness of strangers

    Being in the M.E. etc to watch how Iranians etc communicate helps to understand what they mean & don't mean. Iranians are not the same as Iraqis, Syrians etc.

    When a merchant says his "family will starve" if he doesn't get a higher price, he doesn't mean it, knows that you don't believe it & doesn't expect you to believe that his family will literally "starve. It's just the standard marketplace rhetoric of the different culture.

    The same thing applies to the standard, hyperbolic rhetoric of the Iranian Revolution when the Ayatollah says "Death to ______". He doesn't mean it literally & doesn't expect his audience to believe that he means it literally.

    Another cultural difference is the notion of "Private Property. There is the tradition of extensive generosity & kindness to travelers in much of the Islamic world/M.E. The Bedouin & others for example keep a sheltered area maintained with water, fruit, bread for traveling strangers to sleep, eat etc.

    In the U.S., doing the same thing is considered a crime.

    Neither culture is "Evil" for these cultural differences but because of them, extensive negotiations are more essential than between similar cultures.

    There is no rational alternative.


    Thanks
    You can't simply look at one aspect (kindness to others) while dismissing others ("Islamic cultural police", repression-remember there are no gays in Iran, either because they dont exist or are dangling from cranes, protesters being shot in the face).

    I know some great Persians, we have the largest population nearby outside of the ME, the food alone is awesome-but the other parts? Not so good. Besides, its not anything against Iranians personally-but rather the brutal theocratic dictatorship that runs the nation.

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    Re: Khamenei calls ‘Death to America’ as Kerry hails progress on nuke deal

    Quote Originally Posted by US Conservative View Post
    You can't simply look at one aspect (kindness to others) while dismissing others ("Islamic cultural police", repression-remember there are no gays in Iran, either because they dont exist or are dangling from cranes, protesters being shot in the face).

    I know some great Persians, we have the largest population nearby outside of the ME, the food alone is awesome-but the other parts? Not so good. Besides, its not anything against Iranians personally-but rather the brutal theocratic dictatorship that runs the nation.

    ______________________

    The issue/topic here is Iran's right to have a nuclear program which is undeniable and has nothing to do with its treatment of Gays. Iran's support for Hezbollah is a frequent excuse yet is considered a "Terrorist" group by only 3 countries because of its Humanitarian & political work.

    I agree that the persecution of Gays is reprehensible however the "Conservative" / Right Wing's* concern for Gays only seems to blossom when it comes to Iran.

    If brutality of innocent civilians were the measure of a country's right to nukes, Israel & N. Korea should have had their nuclear arsenals confiscated decades ago.

    In 2014, Israel executed/killed more innocent civilians than in any year since 1967 and thousands more than Iran & yet is America's greatest Aid recipient +.

    N. Korea is a far greater nuclear threat to S. Korea, Japan etc but isn't getting nearly the pressure, deadlines, or spotlight as Iran

    Why?

    The egregious double-standard applied to Iran is not lost on the rest of the world which will increase tensions in the Region & place America at odds with Russia, China & most of the world militarily, financially & diplomatically.

    There is really no legitimate reason for US interests to deny Iran its right. Attempting to defend the indefensible is terrible for US security, future diplomatic efforts & overall interests.

    I care too much for this country & those defending it to jeopardize both for another fatally flawed injustice.


    Thanks



    *I'm simply "None of the Above" Re: Political stance

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    Re: Khamenei calls ‘Death to America’ as Kerry hails progress on nuke deal

    Quote Originally Posted by B'smith View Post
    ______________________

    The issue/topic here is Iran's right to have a nuclear program which is undeniable and has nothing to do with its treatment of Gays. Iran's support for Hezbollah is a frequent excuse yet is considered a "Terrorist" group by only 3 countries because of its Humanitarian & political work.

    I agree that the persecution of Gays is reprehensible however the "Conservative" / Right Wing's* concern for Gays only seems to blossom when it comes to Iran.

    If brutality of innocent civilians were the measure of a country's right to nukes, Israel & N. Korea should have had their nuclear arsenals confiscated decades ago.

    In 2014, Israel executed/killed more innocent civilians than in any year since 1967 and thousands more than Iran & yet is America's greatest Aid recipient +.

    N. Korea is a far greater nuclear threat to S. Korea, Japan etc but isn't getting nearly the pressure, deadlines, or spotlight as Iran

    Why?

    The egregious double-standard applied to Iran is not lost on the rest of the world which will increase tensions in the Region & place America at odds with Russia, China & most of the world militarily, financially & diplomatically.

    There is really no legitimate reason for US interests to deny Iran its right. Attempting to defend the indefensible is terrible for US security, future diplomatic efforts & overall interests.

    I care too much for this country & those defending it to jeopardize both for another fatally flawed injustice.


    Thanks



    *I'm simply "None of the Above" Re: Political stance
    Why should I care about Iran's alleged 'right' to a nuclear program? This isn't kindergarten. We use more nuanced metrics than mere equity. Raising a hue and cry about 'fairness' is silly.

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    Re: Khamenei calls ‘Death to America’ as Kerry hails progress on nuke deal

    Quote Originally Posted by Sherman123 View Post
    Why should I care about Iran's alleged 'right' to a nuclear program? This isn't kindergarten. We use more nuanced metrics than mere equity. Raising a hue and cry about 'fairness' is silly.
    _______________________
    Remember the phrase: "No Justice, No Peace"

    If you'd ever been involved in the "fruits" of unjust policy (aka War) you'd understand.




    So, why shouldn't Iran have a nuclear program in your mind?

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    Re: Khamenei calls ‘Death to America’ as Kerry hails progress on nuke deal

    Quote Originally Posted by B'smith View Post
    _______________________
    Remember the phrase: "No Justice, No Peace"

    If you'd ever been involved in the "fruits" of unjust policy (aka War) you'd understand.




    So, why shouldn't Iran have a nuclear program in your mind?
    Repeating a slogan doesn't make it an axiom. I would prefer Iran not possess a nuclear program because I believe they seek either a nuclear weapon or breakout capacity to create one. If they must have a program I believe it must be certain that they not have any reasonable capacity to construct a weapon. This is because I value the importance of liberal hegemony and its role in creating a more peaceful, prosperous, and just world. An Iran capable of challenging the liberal order and our agenda in the region is a severe danger.

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