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Thread: U.S. companies hoard record amount of cash

  1. #311
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    Re: U.S. companies hoard record amount of cash

    Quote Originally Posted by CanadaJohn View Post
    Do you ever actually read an entire sentence or post or just cherry pick? Did you actually read the sentence I quoted that you responded to?

    It said, in conclusion "one way of controlling their healthcare and administrative costs by dumping their employees into the state-run health insurance pools called for under the law." Do you understand what those words mean? One way of reducing costs is to dump their employees into the ACA state run exchanges and pay the penalties, if necessary.
    Towers Watson does their survey every summer. You know what they found last summer?

    Nearly eight in 10 (77%) employers lack confidence in public insurance exchanges as a viable alternative to employer-sponsored coverage, and almost all employers surveyed (99.5%) have no plans to exit active medical plans and direct employees to this arrangement
    99.5% of employers have no intention whatsoever of re-directing their employees to a public exchange. Which conforms with every other survey of employer intentions, not to mention their actual actions now that the employer mandate is in effect.

    Get a grip. I don't really know what you get out of persisting in this fantasy but it's pretty clear that your hopes of ESI collapsing (or experiencing even a minor dent) aren't happening.

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    Re: U.S. companies hoard record amount of cash

    Quote Originally Posted by Greenbeard View Post
    Towers Watson does their survey every summer. You know what they found last summer?



    99.5% of employers have no intention whatsoever of re-directing their employees to a public exchange. Which conforms with every other survey of employer intentions, not to mention their actual actions now that the employer mandate is in effect.

    Get a grip. I don't really know what you get out of persisting in this fantasy but it's pretty clear that your hopes of ESI collapsing (or experiencing even a minor dent) aren't happening.
    Firstly, I have no agenda - I'm simply commenting on the OP and the issues. You're the one with the agenda.

    Secondly, again, did you comprehend what you quoted? 99.5% have "no plans to exit ACTIVE medical plans". What do they plan to do when their active contracts end? What would it cost them to exit their ACTIVE plans? When renewal time comes, will it be cheaper for them to renew their current plan or dump their employees into the state run ACA exchanges?

    I appreciate your view - we'll see in coming years how it works out. I'm done with this discussion - have a good night.
    "Liberals claim to want to give a hearing to other views, but then are shocked and offended to discover that there are other views." William F. Buckley Jr.

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    Re: U.S. companies hoard record amount of cash

    Quote Originally Posted by CanadaJohn View Post
    Firstly, I have no agenda - I'm simply commenting on the OP and the issues. You're the one with the agenda.

    Secondly, again, did you comprehend what you quoted? 99.5% have "no plans to exit ACTIVE medical plans". What do they plan to do when their active contracts end? What would it cost them to exit their ACTIVE plans? When renewal time comes, will it be cheaper for them to renew their current plan or dump their employees into the state run ACA exchanges?
    Most employees in the United States are in self-insured plans (their employer is their health insurer), their employers are not buying risk-bearing financial products from health insurers. Anyway, the survey covers that as well. Employers view the provision of health insurance as part of the benefit package as a key element of the employee value proposition--not just this year but in 2016 and beyond as well.

    Again, just to be clear, there is nothing to support the position you've been advancing. Those expecting ESI to erode in the next decade are in for a disappointment.

    Which may well be a negative--there are legitimate arguments that it should.

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    Re: U.S. companies hoard record amount of cash

    Quote Originally Posted by CanadaJohn View Post
    I really do marvel at people in the US who bemoan what they have and wish they had what Canada has, as an example. I highlighted the above from your statement because it's laughable to me. When I retired, almost 5 years ago, I had the option to continue my employer provided supplemental health insurance coverage at my own cost. Guess what? My supplemental insurance, for me, one person, was $380 monthly. That's to cover, with deductibles, limits and exclusions, the basics that our single payer system doesn't cover - dental, drugs, chiropractic, orthopedics, etc. etc. And that's on top of the $thousands I pay in taxes to support the basic system. And you're moaning because you pay $300 a month for the basics. Americans really need a reality check when it comes to healthcare and what others have.
    The thing is, because the cost of his premium is shared with his employer, the total cost of his plan is actually at least twice the $300/month he pays while your $380 covers it all.

    It's basically an apples and oranges comparison - your supplemental coverage to his comprehensive coverage.
    Quote Originally Posted by matchlight View Post
    Justice Thomas' opinions consistently contain precise, detailed constitutional analyses.
    Quote Originally Posted by jaeger19 View Post
    the vast majority of folks that need healthcare are on Medicare.. both rich and poor..

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    Re: U.S. companies hoard record amount of cash

    Quote Originally Posted by CanadaJohn View Post
    I really do marvel at people in the US who bemoan what they have and wish they had what Canada has, as an example. I highlighted the above from your statement because it's laughable to me. When I retired, almost 5 years ago, I had the option to continue my employer provided supplemental health insurance coverage at my own cost. Guess what? My supplemental insurance, for me, one person, was $380 monthly. That's to cover, with deductibles, limits and exclusions, the basics that our single payer system doesn't cover - dental, drugs, chiropractic, orthopedics, etc. etc. And that's on top of the $thousands I pay in taxes to support the basic system. And you're moaning because you pay $300 a month for the basics. Americans really need a reality check when it comes to healthcare and what others have.
    ok. i'll happily trade you our ****ed up system for yours. if we could, would you?

    full disclosure : i paid almost two grand because i cut my thumb a couple years ago. they superglued it shut, and gave me a tetanus shot. forty five minutes. the best part is that two companies sent me bills for the same service. i had to pay both. i have insurance.

    please say that you would trade health care systems. i have many more examples, and i am willing to hash them out with you.

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    Re: U.S. companies hoard record amount of cash

    Quote Originally Posted by Helix View Post
    ok. i'll happily trade you our ****ed up system for yours. if we could, would you?

    full disclosure : i paid almost two grand because i cut my thumb a couple years ago. they superglued it shut, and gave me a tetanus shot. forty five minutes. the best part is that two companies sent me bills for the same service. i had to pay both. i have insurance.

    please say that you would trade health care systems. i have many more examples, and i am willing to hash them out with you.
    Sure as ****, this Canadian certainly would not.

    BTW, my 85 year-old dad -- who's had cancer 3 times -- just got a new hip last week. He had to wait about 4 months.

    No death panels for him.
    No men are anywhere, and Im allowed to go in, because Im the owner of the pageant and therefore Im inspecting it, Trump said... Is everyone OK? You know, theyre standing there with no clothes. Is everybody OK? And you see these incredible looking women, and so I sort of get away with things like that.

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    Re: U.S. companies hoard record amount of cash

    Quote Originally Posted by Greenbeard View Post
    That isn't a fallacy. Restoring market-based dynamics to the health care markets (on both the insurance and care sides) is one of the goals of the law. That's part of what deductibles do.

    I think you've been hoodwinked by those on the right who told you for years that the ACA was some kind of surrogate for single-payer. It isn't. Quite the opposite.

    Yes, individuals still have to be cost-conscious under it and make financially responsible decisions for themselves. That's kind of a cornerstone of any market-based strategy.

    Like I said, if you want to argue the Families USA perspective, be my guest--but take a long look in the mirror at some point and figure out whatever it is you actually believe.
    Again, you people shouldnt meddle or attempt to comment on things you do not understand.

    Market based dynamics were utterly corrupted and undermined when the Government mandated the purchase of a Government created product under false pretenses.

    If it were Market based then I could chose not to purchase the product and find a suittable alternative without the threat of fines.

    If I HAD purchased it I could then appeal to the Federal Trade Commission for deceptive advertising.

    There would be RECOURSE and some level of accountability

    With ObamaCare there is NO recourse. No matter how bad the product was from the beginning , or how much more expensive it becomes I am mandated to purchase it.

    The Agency that I would need to appeal to is part of the same Government that misrepresented the product that I'm now stuck with

    Also, no matter how bad it is or expensive it becomes the Democrat party and their minions will do everything possible to discredit anyone who criticizes it. Its value isn't based on a thorough and objective analysis of its pros and cons. Its value is always going to be based on how good ot bad it makes the Democrats look.

    Some Free market fundamentals you got there.

    The Political party that came up with some BS story about a You tube video to cover for the deaths of 4 Americans under their watch because it was Politically convenient is the party thats telling me what a awesome product I'm being forced to pay for.

    Lol !

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    Re: U.S. companies hoard record amount of cash

    Quote Originally Posted by Helix View Post
    ok. i'll happily trade you our ****ed up system for yours. if we could, would you?

    full disclosure : i paid almost two grand because i cut my thumb a couple years ago. they superglued it shut, and gave me a tetanus shot. forty five minutes. the best part is that two companies sent me bills for the same service. i had to pay both. i have insurance.

    please say that you would trade health care systems. i have many more examples, and i am willing to hash them out with you.
    I have lived in both Canada and America.

    Imo, if you are lower class, the Canadian system is FAR better.

    if you are middle class, each has benefits.

    if you are well off or have 'Cadillac' insurance, America is far, FAR better.


    The Canadian system is designed for emergencies/'simple' life-and-death ailments and GP visits. If you are a genuine emergency case OR just need to see a GP for antibiotics for a simple infection; the Canadian system is great.

    But anything more complicated and the system can get very SLOW and is usually under-staffed.


    And remember, just because you don't have to buy medical insurance in Canada (though it helps), doesn't mean the average person is not paying many thousands of dollars in taxes for 'free' healthcare.
    Last edited by DA60; 03-29-15 at 09:40 PM.

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    Re: U.S. companies hoard record amount of cash

    Quote Originally Posted by Fenton View Post
    Again, you people shouldnt meddle or attempt to comment on things you do not understand.

    Market based dynamics were utterly corrupted and undermined when the Government mandated the purchase of a Government created product under false pretenses.

    If it were Market based then I could chose not to purchase the product and find a suittable alternative without the threat of fines.
    All markets are regulated, all effective markets have underlying structure that allows buyers to send (and sellers to receive) signals based on price and quality. Such is life in the real world.

    The tax penalty is there in this case because insurance markets have a well-known problem called adverse selection which requires some sort of intervention to correct.

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    Re: U.S. companies hoard record amount of cash

    Quote Originally Posted by DA60 View Post
    I have lived in both Canada and America.

    Imo, if you are lower class, the Canadian system is FAR better.

    if you are middle class, each has benefits.

    if you are well off or have 'Cadillac' insurance, America is far, FAR better.


    The Canadian system is designed for emergencies/'simple' life-and-death ailments and GP visits. If you are a genuine emergency case OR just need to see a GP for antibiotics for a simple infection; the Canadian system is great.

    But anything more complicated and the system can get very SLOW and is usually under-staffed.


    And remember, just because you don't have to buy medical insurance in Canada (though it helps), doesn't mean the average person is not paying many thousands of dollars in taxes for 'free' healthcare.
    like three hundred a month and maybe ten grand for a serious injury thousands?

    i never argued that Canadian health care was free. i argued that most of them wouldn't trade health care systems with us.

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