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Thread: Obama Sends Iran a Nowruz Message, Calls Nuclear Talks a 'Historic Opportunity[W:274]

  1. #81
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    Re: Obama Sends Iran a Nowruz Message, Calls Nuclear Talks a 'Historic Opportunity'

    Quote Originally Posted by brothern View Post
    I'm perfectly happy with the tact that Obama is taking with Iran.

    The majority of the world is able to work perfectly decently with Iran. As a German, for example, you can fly into Iran and live and work at the Iranian branch of Siemens or Krupp without any Iranian or German ever thinking twice. It's a completely unremarkable situation, because believe it or not, Iran is a completely middle-of-the-road, 80 million pop country that falls into line with the expectations/problems we have with every other non-Western developing country.

    America (and Israel) is the only odd one out here. No other countries have such bizarre trust issues with Iran, nor does Iran have such difficulty rest of the world, probably because the rest of the world doesn't have such a large number of Cowboy-diplomat, conservative jingoists who seem to want to level Iran every chance they get.
    Wow, you haven't got a clue. You are right on par with Obama. Just another run-of-the-mill country they are. Supporting terrorism, killing our soldiers in Iraq. Yeah, no big deal. Yep, let's get them off the terror list. And see what they do with nukes. Probably just for defense.
    "We have met the enemy and they are ours..." -- Oliver Hazard Perry
    "I don't want a piece of you... I want the whole thing!" -- Bob Barker

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    Re: Obama Sends Iran a Nowruz Message, Calls Nuclear Talks a 'Historic Opportunity'

    Quote Originally Posted by brothern View Post
    The Navy shot down and murdered 290 Iranian citizens on an Iran Air flight.
    A killing has to be done with malicious intent to be murder. Are you claiming the captain of the Vincennes meant to fire that missile at an airliner? That would make him a war criminal, and by implication, would make the United States a nation that condones war crimes by its military.

    Quite similar to what the Ukrainian separatists did.
    Baloney.

    We've never once apologized,
    Why don't you write your president? He's usually eager to apologize for any alleged sin of the United States.

    and only offered compensation once we were dragged into the International Court of Justice by Iran.
    The United States is governed by the laws of the United States, not by international kangaroo courts.

    Iran's government has legitimate means to dislike the United States.
    I don't give a damn what those jihadist degenerates like or don't like. I look forward to the day when every last one of them is hanging by his heels.

  3. #83
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    Re: Obama Sends Iran a Nowruz Message, Calls Nuclear Talks a 'Historic Opportunity'

    Quote Originally Posted by matchlight View Post
    A killing has to be done with malicious intent to be murder. Are you claiming the captain of the Vincennes meant to fire that missile at an airliner? That would make him a war criminal, and by implication, would make the United States a nation that condones war crimes by its military.



    Baloney.



    Why don't you write your president? He's usually eager to apologize for any alleged sin of the United States.



    The United States is governed by the laws of the United States, not by international kangaroo courts.



    I don't give a damn what those jihadist degenerates like or don't like. I look forward to the day when every last one of them is hanging by his heels.
    Few if any Americans have been convicted of their war crimes. Victors don't prosecute their own. As to the Iranian airliner that was targeted and shot down. Why would it be a "war crime" if it was intentional. Were we at war with Iran? Or are you referring to America's perpetual state of war?
    Killing one person is murder, killing 100,000 is foreign policy

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    Re: Obama Sends Iran a Nowruz Message, Calls Nuclear Talks a 'Historic Opportunity'

    Quote Originally Posted by Montecresto View Post
    As to the Iranian airliner that was targeted and shot down. Why would it be a "war crime" if it was intentional.
    I do not accept your claim that "the Iranian airliner . . . was targeted." The Vincennes was firing at a radar image. I accept the statements of the captain that the ship's operations center, evaluating the speed, altitude, course, and location of that image, judged it to be that of an F-14, and that the aircraft's failure to respond to the ship's IFF signal to verify that it was friendly confirmed that judgment.

    You must know that it is a grave violation of the laws of war, as codified in the Geneva Conventions--in other words, a war crime--for military forces intentionally to target civilians. You must also know that the laws of war can be violated, and often are, where no formal state of war exists. You are slandering the United States, as you have done more than once here before.

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    Re: Obama Sends Iran a Nowruz Message, Calls Nuclear Talks a 'Historic Opportunity'

    Quote Originally Posted by polgara View Post
    It's not that the terrorists are unaware of how the civilized world conducts itself - they've got the internet and phones and all the modern conveniences other parts of the world have, so they know. They have chosen to follow an evil path instead, wantonly and openly killing fellow human beings in the most nightmarish ways a perverted mind can conceive. Rivers of blood are their legacy.

    There can be no negotiating with fanatics like this - they must be stopped or this planet is doomed. There is no middle ground here that I can see. In medicine, a cancerous tumor is removed to allow life to continue. The civilized world is not always right in the things they do, but anyone who thinks a barbarian way of ruling, using cruelty and terror to subjugate people, is what we should follow is totally wrong and not acceptable. This is not the world of Genghis Khan any longer - most of humanity has moved on since then.
    Outstanding post. Im sick of these terrorists trying to get medieval on everyone else.

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    Re: Obama Sends Iran a Nowruz Message, Calls Nuclear Talks a 'Historic Opportunity'

    Quote Originally Posted by brothern View Post
    The Navy shot down and murdered 290 Iranian citizens on an Iran Air flight. Quite similar to what the Ukrainian separatists did. We've never once apologized, and only offered compensation once we were dragged into the International Court of Justice by Iran.

    Iran's government has legitimate means to dislike the United States.
    Get some context. Our forces in the area had been skirmishing for some time with both the Iraqi's and Iranians. On the day Iran Air flight 655 was shot down, the Vincennes had been attacked by Iranian gun boats (shooting at its helicopter) and was pursuing them. The passenger aircraft fit appeared to be an Iranian F14, and the Commander was told it was descending (as attack aircraft do).
    Iran Air Flight 655 - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

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    Re: Obama Sends Iran a Nowruz Message, Calls Nuclear Talks a 'Historic Opportunity'

    Quote Originally Posted by matchlight View Post
    I do not accept your claim that "the Iranian airliner . . . was targeted." The Vincennes was firing at a radar image. I accept the statements of the captain that the ship's operations center, evaluating the speed, altitude, course, and location of that image, judged it to be that of an F-14, and that the aircraft's failure to respond to the ship's IFF signal to verify that it was friendly confirmed that judgment.

    You must know that it is a grave violation of the laws of war, as codified in the Geneva Conventions--in other words, a war crime--for military forces intentionally to target civilians. You must also know that the laws of war can be violated, and often are, where no formal state of war exists. You are slandering the United States, as you have done more than once here before.
    Yes, I'm aware of the Geneva conventions governing warfare. Were we at war with Iran when this plane was targeted and shot down. And if the captain had known it was a civilian vessel and was under higher orders to target it, do you think he'd be declaring that. Or do you think that he'd be saying he thought the Iranian passenger jet was an F-14?
    Killing one person is murder, killing 100,000 is foreign policy

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    Re: Obama Sends Iran a Nowruz Message, Calls Nuclear Talks a 'Historic Opportunity'

    Quote Originally Posted by Montecresto View Post
    Arab history books. Now what are you rambling about.
    Just helpin your mantra with keepin it real, Monte.

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    Re: Obama Sends Iran a Nowruz Message, Calls Nuclear Talks a 'Historic Opportunity'

    Quote Originally Posted by MMC View Post
    Just helpin your mantra with keepin it real, Monte.
    That doesn't explain your post.
    Killing one person is murder, killing 100,000 is foreign policy

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    Re: Obama Sends Iran a Nowruz Message, Calls Nuclear Talks a 'Historic Opportunity'

    Quote Originally Posted by brothern View Post
    This I year turned down an invite from several of my friends, who are going to visit Iran in April. The three that are going are an American gay couple and an Iranian friend of mine.
    I don't have the PTO, otherwise I'd gladly have gone, but I'm hitting up Australia / NZ and Eastern Europe this year. However I seriously entertained the thought and did the initial planning of the trip.

    Unless you are Islamophobic, it is a perfectly wonderful country, which Americans are allowed to visit. I wouldn't throw myself into the backwater Iran, just as I wouldn't throw myself into the backwater that the Colombian guerrilla gangs own, but I do very much know what I'm talking about outside of your F.U.D..


    Oh.....there are still real Persians in Iran. With what you said doesn't change what Iran has been about and been doing.

    Also, give up on the crystal ball routine when it concerns someone you don't know.

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