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Thread: Obama Sends Iran a Nowruz Message, Calls Nuclear Talks a 'Historic Opportunity[W:274]

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    Re: Obama Sends Iran a Nowruz Message, Calls Nuclear Talks a 'Historic Opportunity'

    Quote Originally Posted by Montecresto View Post
    Oh dear.
    Yeah.....kind of hard to use those limited Arab History books to have a response for something off the cuff, huh Monte?

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    Re: Obama Sends Iran a Nowruz Message, Calls Nuclear Talks a 'Historic Opportunity'

    Quote Originally Posted by Montecresto View Post
    Oh for Christ's sake!!!!

    The ability to make treaties, agreements, or even nonbinding handshakes with foreign leaders has long rested with the White House — sometimes, but not always, with the consent of the Senate. But exactly what type of deal they cut is often dictated by political realities in Washington. And presidents stretching back to George Washington himself have grumbled about Senate obstruction in the process.

    Treaties vs. Executive Agreements: When Does Congress Get a Vote? - Washington Wire - WSJ
    Awww somebody get this guy a copy of the ****ing Constitution before this fascist bull**** makes me puke:

    [The President] shall have Power, by and with the Advice and Consent of the Senate, to make Treaties, provided two thirds of the Senators present concur...


    In this country we have a little thing called 3 separate but equal branches of government, now I understand that as a Putin supporter you love fascist dictatorship as opposed to liberal democracy but here, in this country, we do not have a dictator and any treaty signed by the POTUS without first receiving the advice and consent of the Senate isn't worth the paper it's printed on. This line of argumentation is complete BS and how do we know it is BS? Because Obama's own Vice President Joe Biden has said as much:

    Senators Joseph R. Biden Jr., Democrat of Delaware, and Jesse Helms, Republican of North Carolina, said an agreement on ''significant obligations by the United states regarding deployed U.S. strategic nuclear warheads'' would ''constitute a treaty subject to the advice and consent of the Senate.''

    Their letter to Secretary of State Colin L. Powell was dated March 15, two days after President Bush expressed optimism that a deal on nuclear arms cuts would be ready for his meeting in May with President Vladimir V. Putin.

    ''With the exception of the SALT I agreement, every significant arms control agreement during the past three decades has been transmitted to the Senate pursuant to the Treaty Clause of the Constitution,'' the letter says. ''Mr. Secretary, we see no reason whatsoever to alter this practice.''


    http://www.nytimes.com/2002/03/17/wo...rms-deals.html
    Last edited by face, your; 03-21-15 at 12:05 PM.

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    Re: Obama Sends Iran a Nowruz Message, Calls Nuclear Talks a 'Historic Opportunity'

    Quote Originally Posted by brothern View Post
    Second, you forget that Jordan, Egypt, Turkey, Lebanon and Palestine are all Sunni. Iran is not only predominantly Shi'a, but it is to Shia Islam as Saudi Arabia is to Sunni Islam. Heck, it's run by Ayatollahs (the title given to the highest ranked Twelver Shi'a Muslim clerics). Of course Sunnis aren't going to hold Iran in a positive light.


    Iran is a Pariah state.

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    Re: Obama Sends Iran a Nowruz Message, Calls Nuclear Talks a 'Historic Opportunity'

    Quote Originally Posted by matchlight View Post
    There are several dozen Islamists who are the bigshots in that regime, and they are all more or less Khomeinists, thirty-five years after Khomeini founded the Islamic Republic. I have seen pictures of backhoes whose buckets were raised to full height and used to hang people from, the bodies suspended right there in the streets. In the protests of 2009, which Obama went out of his way to say nothing about, the regime's goons killed one young woman right on the sidewalk in Tehran, and dozens of others were arrested in various cities and taken to a couple secret lockups in Tehran that are really dungeons.

    No one knows what happened to these people--they just disappeared, almost certainly murdered. A female reporter, originally from Iran but living abroad, went there to investigate a story and apparently was seized and murdered right in the hallway of a building on the university campus in Tehran. I saw film of the dried gore, with a student explaining what had happened there. I believe him. This same regime sent Hizballah jihadists all the way to Buenos Aires in 1992 to bomb the Israeli Embassy and a Jewish community center. Twenty-nine Jews were murdered by a car bomb at the embassy and eighty-seven more by a Lebanese suicide bomber at the community center. More than 350 people were injured.

    These people are as evil as the Nazis were, and no one should be taken in by the fact many of them wear suits and ties and smile and speak English. Appearing moderate and reasonable is just one of their calculated deceptions. The whole history of this regime and its founder is rotten. In the late 1930's in Cairo, an exiled Iranian radical named Muhammad Navab-Safavi had met Hasan al-Banna, the founder of the Muslim Brotherhood, and been inspired to establish a terrorist group he called the "Fedayeen of Islam." Back in Iran during WWII, Navab-Safavi, after an unsuccessful try at forming a pro-Nazi terrorist group to murder British, met up with a young, violence-preaching cleric named Ruhollah Khomeini.

    Khomeini had been denouncing a secular judge named Ahmad Kasravi, who had written several popular books criticizing the influence of Islam on Persia. He now used his religious authority to order Kasravi's assassination by Navab-Safavi's small group of "soldiers of Allah." And having been instructed by Navab-Safavi and Khomeini to use a blade in order to "shed the miscreant's blood," they did just that. Kasravi was the first of about a dozen people these jihadists murdered during the 1940's and 1950's, including a prime minister and a minister of education.

    These are Khomeini's words:

    "The sword is the key to paradise which can be opened only for holy warriors! There are thousands of other [Quranic] verses and hadiths urging Muslims to value war and to fight. Does all that mean that Islam is a religion that prevents men from waging war? I spit upon those foolish souls who make such a claim." ...................

    "The great Prophet of Islam in one hand carried the Quran and in the other a sword; the sword for crushing the traitors and the Quran for guidance . . . Islam is a religion of blood for the infidels but a religion of guidance for other people." ..................

    "[I]f we kill infidels in order to put a stop to their [corrupting] activity, we have indeed done them a service. For their eventual punishment will be less . . . [To kill them] is a surgical operation commanded by Allah . . . War is a blessing for the world and for every nation. It is Allah himself who commands men to wage war and kill . . . it is war that purifies the earth . . . our young warriors know that to kill the infidels is one of the noblest missions Allah has reserved for mankind."


    It is the followers of this degenerate bastard who are determined to get hold of atom bombs, and this sorry excuse for a president is quite willing to let them. Maybe they remind him of his Muslim father and Muslim step-father, or his Muslim college roommate.
    It's not that the terrorists are unaware of how the civilized world conducts itself - they've got the internet and phones and all the modern conveniences other parts of the world have, so they know. They have chosen to follow an evil path instead, wantonly and openly killing fellow human beings in the most nightmarish ways a perverted mind can conceive. Rivers of blood are their legacy.

    There can be no negotiating with fanatics like this - they must be stopped or this planet is doomed. There is no middle ground here that I can see. In medicine, a cancerous tumor is removed to allow life to continue. The civilized world is not always right in the things they do, but anyone who thinks a barbarian way of ruling, using cruelty and terror to subjugate people, is what we should follow is totally wrong and not acceptable. This is not the world of Genghis Khan any longer - most of humanity has moved on since then.

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    Re: Obama Sends Iran a Nowruz Message, Calls Nuclear Talks a 'Historic Opportunity'

    Quote Originally Posted by face, your View Post
    Awww somebody get this guy a copy of the ****ing Constitution before this fascist bull**** makes me puke:

    [The President] shall have Power, by and with the Advice and Consent of the Senate, to make Treaties, provided two thirds of the Senators present concur...


    In this country we have a little thing called 3 separate but equal branches of government, now I understand that as a Putin supporter you love fascist dictatorship as opposed to liberal democracy but here, in this country, we do not have a dictator and any treaty signed by the POTUS without first receiving the advice and consent of the Senate isn't worth the paper it's printed on. This line of argumentation is complete BS and how do we know it is BS? Because Obama's own Vice President Joe Biden has said as much:

    Senators Joseph R. Biden Jr., Democrat of Delaware, and Jesse Helms, Republican of North Carolina, said an agreement on ''significant obligations by the United states regarding deployed U.S. strategic nuclear warheads'' would ''constitute a treaty subject to the advice and consent of the Senate.''

    Their letter to Secretary of State Colin L. Powell was dated March 15, two days after President Bush expressed optimism that a deal on nuclear arms cuts would be ready for his meeting in May with President Vladimir V. Putin.

    ''With the exception of the SALT I agreement, every significant arms control agreement during the past three decades has been transmitted to the Senate pursuant to the Treaty Clause of the Constitution,'' the letter says. ''Mr. Secretary, we see no reason whatsoever to alter this practice.''


    Senators Insist on Role in Nuclear Arms Deals - NYTimes.com
    Ooooh, the WSJ V NYT!
    Killing one person is murder, killing 100,000 is foreign policy

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    Re: Obama Sends Iran a Nowruz Message, Calls Nuclear Talks a 'Historic Opportunity'

    Quote Originally Posted by MMC View Post
    Yeah.....kind of hard to use those limited Arab History books to have a response for something off the cuff, huh Monte?
    Arab history books. Now what are you rambling about.
    Killing one person is murder, killing 100,000 is foreign policy

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    Re: Obama Sends Iran a Nowruz Message, Calls Nuclear Talks a 'Historic Opportunity'

    Quote Originally Posted by face, your View Post
    More absolute nonsense, I would think it has more to do with their official state motto being "death to America and Israel", and the fact that they have perpetrated numerous acts of war against the US and Israel, oh and FYI the overwhelming majority of the international community has a problem with Iran, they are a true pariah state:

    Sanctions against Iran - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

    To put it mildly you don't have a damn clue what you're talking about.
    Quote Originally Posted by mmc
    .
    This I year turned down an invite from several of my friends, who are going to visit Iran in April. The three that are going are an American gay couple and an Iranian friend of mine.
    I don't have the PTO, otherwise I'd gladly have gone, but I'm hitting up Australia / NZ and Eastern Europe this year. However I seriously entertained the thought and did the initial planning of the trip.

    Unless you are Islamophobic, it is a perfectly wonderful country, which Americans are allowed to visit. I wouldn't throw myself into the backwater Iran, just as I wouldn't throw myself into the backwater that the Colombian guerrilla gangs own, but I do very much know what I'm talking about outside of your F.U.D.

    Quote Originally Posted by a351 View Post
    None of them have repeatedly gone out of their way to attack US interests and their allies It really is that simple.
    The Navy shot down and murdered 290 Iranian citizens on an Iran Air flight. Quite similar to what the Ukrainian separatists did. We've never once apologized, and only offered compensation once we were dragged into the International Court of Justice by Iran.

    Iran's government has legitimate means to dislike the United States.
    Help fight Zika, TB, HIV/AIDs and water pollution by donating your CPU's excess processing time to scientific research.
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    Re: Obama Sends Iran a Nowruz Message, Calls Nuclear Talks a 'Historic Opportunity'

    Quote Originally Posted by brothern View Post
    This I year turned down an invite from several of my friends, who are going to visit Iran in April. The three that are going are an American gay couple and an Iranian friend of mine.
    I don't have the PTO, otherwise I'd gladly have gone, because I'm hitting up Australia / NZ and Eastern Europe this year. However I seriously entertained the thought and did the initial planning of the trip.

    Unless you are Islamophobic, it is a perfectly wonderful country, which Americans are allowed to visit. I wouldn't throw myself into the backwater Iran, just as I wouldn't throw myself into the backwater that the Colombian guerrilla gangs own, but I do very much know what I'm talking about outside of your F.U.D.


    The Navy shot down and murdered 290 Iranian citizens on an Iran Air flight. Quite similar to what the Ukrainian separatists did. We've never once apologized, and only offered compensation once we were dragged into the International Court of Justice by Iran.

    Iran's government has legitimate means to dislike the United States.
    Anyone who has traveled to Iran knows what a wonderful country it is. Most Americans don't make it over there and are easily frightened by an agenda driven government with corporate interests at stake. "Do we have to wait for the smoking gun in the form of a mushroom cloud over a US city?"
    Killing one person is murder, killing 100,000 is foreign policy

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    Re: Obama Sends Iran a Nowruz Message, Calls Nuclear Talks a 'Historic Opportunity'

    Quote Originally Posted by Montecresto View Post
    Oh for Christ's sake!!!!

    The ability to make treaties, agreements, or even nonbinding handshakes with foreign leaders has long rested with the White House sometimes, but not always, with the consent of the Senate. But exactly what type of deal they cut is often dictated by political realities in Washington. And presidents stretching back to George Washington himself have grumbled about Senate obstruction in
    That's just too damn bad. We have a Constitution to protect us from government grabbing power and other misbehavior. Obama doesn't like being restrained by the Constitution, he's made that clear.
    "We have met the enemy and they are ours..." -- Oliver Hazard Perry
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    Re: Obama Sends Iran a Nowruz Message, Calls Nuclear Talks a 'Historic Opportunity'

    Quote Originally Posted by Anthony60 View Post
    That's just too damn bad. We have a Constitution to protect us from government grabbing power and other misbehavior. Obama doesn't like being restrained by the Constitution, he's made that clear.
    No presidents like being restrained by the constitution, at least one considered it a god damn piece of paper. I'm well aware of Obama's musings on aspects of the constitution. Throughout our countries history, whole groups of people have disagreed with aspects of our constitution, which is why it's had many amendments. The problem is with extra constitutional precedences set by presidents that go unchallenged by their supporters. Partisanship is the problem.
    Killing one person is murder, killing 100,000 is foreign policy

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