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Students, governor want U.Va. student arrest investigated

Ockham

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AP said:
CHARLOTTESVILLE, Va. (AP) — About 1,000 students gathered at the University of Virginia campus Wednesday night to demand justice for a student who was injured during an arrest and appears in a photo with a bloody face as an officer holds him down.
Gov. Terry McAuliffe has called for an investigation into the early-morning arrest of Martese Johnson. His lawyer says he needed 10 stitches in his head.
Court records show that Martese Johnson was charged on two counts: obstruction of justice without force, and public swearing or intoxication.

The Alcoholic Beverage Control agent who made the arrest, listed in court records as J. Miller, said in the arrest report that Johnson "was very agitated and belligerent."
But a group calling itself "Concerned Black Students" says Johnson's arrest was unprovoked and extreme.



About 1,000 students gathered at the University of Virginia campus Wednesday night to demand justice for a student who was injured during an arrest and appears in a photo with a bloody face as he is being held down by an officer.
Virginia Gov. Terry McAuliffe has also called for an investigation into the early-morning arrest of Martese Johnson, whose lawyer said he needed 10 stitches in his head.
Martese Johnson was charged on two counts: obstruction of justice without force, and public swearing or intoxication, Charlottesville General District Court records show.

Court records show that Johnson was charged with obstruction of… The Alcoholic Beverage Control agent who made the arrest, listed in court records as J. Miller, said in the arrest report that Johnson "was very agitated and belligerent."

A statement from a group calling itself "Concerned Black Students," however, claims the arrest of Johnson was unprovoked and extreme.

"The brutish force used resulted in his head and bodily injuries," the group said in a statement. "His treatment was unprovoked as he did not resist questioning or arrest."

Wednesday night's rally was moved several times, finally ending up at an outdoor amphitheater after more students than expected showed up.
"If we don't get it, shut it down!" many chanted in unison.

www.msn.com/en-us/news/crime/virgin...o-students-arrest/ar-BBip5Hs?ocid=ansnewsap11

So a few thoughts:

The facts are 1.) Martese Johnson was not of age to get into the bar 2.) ABC and Police were correct in pulling him aside after the bouncer rejected his entry. 3.) That Johnson was restrained is not a surprise. 4.) ABC in Va. and especially with U Va. students have had a "heavy handed" method in the past (see the article). 5.) The police did not use a taser or shoot Johnson as has been shown in similar types of arrests around the country. 6.) Johnson is black.

The country is in quite a tizzy about race - when and if a black person is arrested now, it has a good chance of becoming national news and if they are bloody ("if it bleeds, it leads") the media will jump all over it, giving activists quite a forum and echo chamber to vent their frustrations adding to the anti-police weight. In this particular case, it's unfortunate that Johnson hit his head and required stitches - it's not clear if the police were the cause of that or if during the restraint, he simply slipped or lost balance. There is a difference between the cops slamming his head repeatedly (I'm making this part up) into the concrete vs. Johnson accidentally getting the cut. Does this mean every time a black man is arrested it becomes national news? Should that be the case? In NJ just this past week, a black man with 4 others in a car was pulled over on Rt. 206 and refused to provide the cop his credentials and refuses to exit the car.
 
The police and ABC are known to be abusive does not excuse their abuse. I saw one article that indicates the sidewalk was spattered with his blood. I saw cellphone video taken after they had him down on the concrete while still in the process of cuffing him in which others were already yelling about his head bleeding. It is not clear to me if his charges is related to being drunk or because he told the officers what they were doing is f-ing racist. Seems a pretty unnecessary use of force to me either way.
 
So a few thoughts:

The facts are 1.) Martese Johnson was not of age to get into the bar 2.) ABC and Police were correct in pulling him aside after the bouncer rejected his entry. 3.) That Johnson was restrained is not a surprise. 4.) ABC in Va. and especially with U Va. students have had a "heavy handed" method in the past (see the article). 5.) The police did not use a taser or shoot Johnson as has been shown in similar types of arrests around the country. 6.) Johnson is black.

The country is in quite a tizzy about race - when and if a black person is arrested now, it has a good chance of becoming national news and if they are bloody ("if it bleeds, it leads") the media will jump all over it, giving activists quite a forum and echo chamber to vent their frustrations adding to the anti-police weight. In this particular case, it's unfortunate that Johnson hit his head and required stitches - it's not clear if the police were the cause of that or if during the restraint, he simply slipped or lost balance. There is a difference between the cops slamming his head repeatedly (I'm making this part up) into the concrete vs. Johnson accidentally getting the cut. Does this mean every time a black man is arrested it becomes national news? Should that be the case? In NJ just this past week, a black man with 4 others in a car was pulled over on Rt. 206 and refused to provide the cop his credentials and refuses to exit the car.

If he was white, this wouldn't make the news.
 
If he was white, this wouldn't make the news.

Correct. Because if he was white and subject to police brutality, an investigation would start immediately and not require public outcry to prompt it.
 
The police and ABC are known to be abusive does not excuse their abuse. I saw one article that indicates the sidewalk was spattered with his blood. I saw cellphone video taken after they had him down on the concrete while still in the process of cuffing him in which others were already yelling about his head bleeding. It is not clear to me if his charges is related to being drunk or because he told the officers what they were doing is f-ing racist. Seems a pretty unnecessary use of force to me either way.

Do you have a link to that video you mentioned? From what I could see of the article here there was only one police officer holding him down. Hardly unnecessary force if he's in an agitated state.
 
Correct. Because if he was white and subject to police brutality, an investigation would start immediately and not require public outcry to prompt it.

:roll: I'm sure that you have plenty of statistics to back this up right?
 
Do you have a link to that video you mentioned? From what I could see of the article here there was only one police officer holding him down. Hardly unnecessary force if he's in an agitated state.

 
Correct. Because if he was white and subject to police brutality, an investigation would start immediately and not require public outcry to prompt it.

Since white underage drinking is just as prevalent as black under age drinking, perhaps you can cite an investigation @ U Va. by ABC and white kids underage drinking which caused injury, and where an investigation started immediately and did not need public outcry? At least two within say, the last 2 years would be fine.
 


He kept asking, "How did this happen?" Well it happened because he is underage and trying to get into a bar.

His constant "You ****ing racist" comments were not helping. The video doesn't show the take down but in this case, Johnson should be happy he wasn't tazed or shot and that the officers only scuffed him up a bit. To the point I made in the OP though.... every time you see a black person get arrested now, we'll see the "You ****ing racist" epithet used because it makes news and the authorities will be automatically put on their heels as the DoJ and State legislatures as well as the standard NAACP and other organization dog pile on. In this particular case the cops did right and it looks to me, at this point, like it was a perfectly legal restraint of this individual.
 


Thanks. At least in that I see two cops holding him down and the third one occasionally helping a bit with trying to get the cuffs on. However there still isn't anything to indicate how exactly the guy got his head to bleeding. As is I don't see excessive force.
 
He kept asking, "How did this happen?" Well it happened because he is underage and trying to get into a bar.

His constant "You ****ing racist" comments were not helping. The video doesn't show the take down but in this case, Johnson should be happy he wasn't tazed or shot and that the officers only scuffed him up a bit. To the point I made in the OP though.... every time you see a black person get arrested now, we'll see the "You ****ing racist" epithet used because it makes news and the authorities will be automatically put on their heels as the DoJ and State legislatures as well as the standard NAACP and other organization dog pile on. In this particular case the cops did right and it looks to me, at this point, like it was a perfectly legal restraint of this individual.

If underage drinking (assuming that is what he was doing) warrants having your head busted against the pavement, what should be the punishment for white collar crimes? We don't need any judges and juries--we just need some God Fearing Police Officers to punish people with thousands in medical bills because the $25 fines are not keeping those people in their places.

You know some people just like to go to where the other people are without some nefarious intent. How dare a college student in a college town want to go into an Irish themed pub with St. Patty's Day upon us and all....
 
Thanks. At least in that I see two cops holding him down and the third one occasionally helping a bit with trying to get the cuffs on. However there still isn't anything to indicate how exactly the guy got his head to bleeding. As is I don't see excessive force.

I indicated in my original post that it did not show the take down I thought. This was the first tube I found when you asked. The one I originally saw did not have all that commentary. I think it was on the student newspaper website when I saw it, but it is the same video as to the relevant parts. Since the president of the University is quick on this in calling for an investigation, you can bet that this story has some legs to it. College Presidents do not generally go out of their way to defend college kids and seldom so quickly to the point they are picking up the phone and calling the governor before the story was in the MSM.
 
He kept asking, "How did this happen?" Well it happened because he is underage and trying to get into a bar.

His constant "You ****ing racist" comments were not helping. The video doesn't show the take down but in this case, Johnson should be happy he wasn't tazed or shot and that the officers only scuffed him up a bit. To the point I made in the OP though.... every time you see a black person get arrested now, we'll see the "You ****ing racist" epithet used because it makes news and the authorities will be automatically put on their heels as the DoJ and State legislatures as well as the standard NAACP and other organization dog pile on. In this particular case the cops did right and it looks to me, at this point, like it was a perfectly legal restraint of this individual.

Surely you don't mean that the way it's stated. We don't need to be "happy" when cops don't act like jack booted thugs - that's what we should expect. And 10 stitches is "scuffed him up a bit."???

And unless we get some video of what happened to cause cuts needing 10 stitches, it's hard to say it was appropriate use of force ("legal" is another matter I suppose).
 
He was not underage, the guy denind him entry because he looked young. He showed his schools Id which stated he was of age to enter said bar. Remember that girl that was aressted over bottled water by the same law enforcement officials.
 
So a few thoughts:

The facts are 1.) Martese Johnson was not of age to get into the bar 2.) ABC and Police were correct in pulling him aside after the bouncer rejected his entry. 3.) That Johnson was restrained is not a surprise. 4.) ABC in Va. and especially with U Va. students have had a "heavy handed" method in the past (see the article). 5.) The police did not use a taser or shoot Johnson as has been shown in similar types of arrests around the country. 6.) Johnson is black.

The country is in quite a tizzy about race - when and if a black person is arrested now, it has a good chance of becoming national news and if they are bloody ("if it bleeds, it leads") the media will jump all over it, giving activists quite a forum and echo chamber to vent their frustrations adding to the anti-police weight. In this particular case, it's unfortunate that Johnson hit his head and required stitches - it's not clear if the police were the cause of that or if during the restraint, he simply slipped or lost balance. There is a difference between the cops slamming his head repeatedly (I'm making this part up) into the concrete vs. Johnson accidentally getting the cut. Does this mean every time a black man is arrested it becomes national news? Should that be the case? In NJ just this past week, a black man with 4 others in a car was pulled over on Rt. 206 and refused to provide the cop his credentials and refuses to exit the car.



**** racism..

Ten stitches for TRYING to get into a pub is NOT defensible.
 
If underage drinking (assuming that is what he was doing) warrants having your head busted against the pavement, what should be the punishment for white collar crimes?
It does when the individual resists yes.

We don't need any judges and juries--we just need some God Fearing Police Officers to punish people with thousands in medical bills because the $25 fines are not keeping those people in their places.
Johnson could have paid the fine, stayed calm and all would be well. If he escalates the issue the police have no choice. As I said - Johnson should be happy he wasn't tazed or shot given how police are apparently trained. Johnson lucked out and got cops who actually didn't permanently injure him.

You know some people just like to go to where the other people are without some nefarious intent.
No one is attributing nefarious intent.
How dare a college student in a college town want to go into an Irish themed pub with St. Patty's Day upon us and all....
Agreed. However, stupid underage college students on one of the biggest drinking days of the college year attempts to get into a bar which is on high alert for underage drinkers AND ABC knowing this, is out in full force making money for the state. Said stupid college student then gets belligerent and gets bloody resisting the $25 fine. Johnson escalated, he got arrested and stitches for his stupidity. A very good teachable moment for him... .of course everyone else hears his "You ****ing racist" comment and dog piles on. How did Forrest Gump state it? Oh yeah... "Stupid is as stupid does." :mrgreen:
 
Surely you don't mean that the way it's stated. We don't need to be "happy" when cops don't act like jack booted thugs - that's what we should expect. And 10 stitches is "scuffed him up a bit."???
Actually I do mean it the way it was stated. Every day cops are using their tazers and guns instead of physically restraining people and cuffing them. There are numerous posts on DP where I have stated my opinion that cops today are either poorly trained or poorly execute their duty by shooting first regardless of the situation. Police are not trained well and are too apt to shoot first - in THIS case these police actually did what they were supposed to do which is restrain the person. Yes, Johnson is lucky he wasn't shot and these officers actually were apparently trained well and did not use excessive force, compared to other police stories that show the direct opposite.

And unless we get some video of what happened to cause cuts needing 10 stitches, it's hard to say it was appropriate use of force ("legal" is another matter I suppose).
Not really. People who are belligerent sometimes, due to that belligerence resist arrest. Johnson will still be charged. The police in this case will be investigated as they should, but I am sure will be exonerate of any wrong doing. I'd be interested to know if Johnson after he was arrested had a blood alcohol test. He seemed drunk which may explain why he was resisting the police in the first place and may be a contributing factor in his injury.
 
ABC has been known too go overboard on arrests, so you think it was alright for him too get beaten for being denind entry for looking young? So much for personal liberty the no unusual pushiment frack the Constitution and the boy rights to due process.
 
**** racism..

Ten stitches for TRYING to get into a pub is NOT defensible.

How did the injury occur? Was Johnson drunk at the time of arrest? Why did Johnson get belligerent with the ABC officers? When exactly did the injury occur and was Johnson blood alcohol level contribute to the injury? All questions that need to be answered that are not necessarily answered by the video.
 
So a few thoughts:

The facts are 1.) Martese Johnson was not of age to get into the bar 2.) ABC and Police were correct in pulling him aside after the bouncer rejected his entry. 3.) That Johnson was restrained is not a surprise. 4.) ABC in Va. and especially with U Va. students have had a "heavy handed" method in the past (see the article). 5.) The police did not use a taser or shoot Johnson as has been shown in similar types of arrests around the country. 6.) Johnson is black.

The country is in quite a tizzy about race - when and if a black person is arrested now, it has a good chance of becoming national news and if they are bloody ("if it bleeds, it leads") the media will jump all over it, giving activists quite a forum and echo chamber to vent their frustrations adding to the anti-police weight. In this particular case, it's unfortunate that Johnson hit his head and required stitches - it's not clear if the police were the cause of that or if during the restraint, he simply slipped or lost balance. There is a difference between the cops slamming his head repeatedly (I'm making this part up) into the concrete vs. Johnson accidentally getting the cut. Does this mean every time a black man is arrested it becomes national news? Should that be the case? In NJ just this past week, a black man with 4 others in a car was pulled over on Rt. 206 and refused to provide the cop his credentials and refuses to exit the car.
I'm going to need more information.

But it certainly seems overly forceful to have caused injuries including one needing 10 stitches for "obstruction of justice without force, and public swearing or intoxication".

Now, if he had fought the police in any way, it would be slightly more understandable, but it seems clear from the charges that he did not...because you know damn well if he did resist forcefully that would totally be in the charges...
 
I belive those two girls were white that were aressted by ABC officals last year over bottled water were white it was reported by the news
 
ABC has been known too go overboard on arrests, so you think it was alright for him too get beaten for being denind entry for looking young?
There is no evidence he was "beaten" so that's misinformation. Yes ABC has past issues when they have gone overboard on arrests ... however you must make the case that because they have had past issues that in THIS case, it also was overboard. You have not done so.

So much for personal liberty the no unusual pushiment frack the Constitution and the boy rights to due process.
He is getting due process and will get that due process in court. What he should NOT be getting is a free pass based on fictional accusations of "racism" which did not occur. The facts are the facts as I laid out in the OP. His injury was of his own making unless otherwise proven and that hasn't happened yet.

Please post the video of the ABC officers "beating" him. It's not in the video nor the OP story which was posted so far.
 
How did the injury occur? Was Johnson drunk at the time of arrest? Why did Johnson get belligerent with the ABC officers? When exactly did the injury occur and was Johnson blood alcohol level contribute to the injury? All questions that need to be answered that are not necessarily answered by the video.



I really don't give a ****.


Frankly I'm tired of hearing justifications for beating the **** out of people, constant race arguments and then having my country slagged...

Our police don't beat people up for trying to get into a pub, or for words spoken. We may be a third world **** pile in the minds of Americans but we at least live without fear of being beaten up by cops.
 
I'm going to need more information.

But it certainly seems overly forceful to have caused injuries including one needing 10 stitches for "obstruction of justice without force, and public swearing or intoxication".

Now, if he had fought the police in any way, it would be slightly more understandable, but it seems clear from the charges that he did not...because you know damn well if he did resist forcefully that would totally be in the charges...
Agree that more information is needed - but there are already charges of "racism" and "beating" in this very thread where no facts exist of such things. The injury may have occurred due to Johnson's intoxication level and if he fought the police, they may or may not have initially charged him with resisting arrest as the DA can add charges well after initial arrest. I'm sure they are being cautious due to the national publicity and charges of "racism" by Johnson himself.
 
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