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Thread: Students, governor want U.Va. student arrest investigated

  1. #81
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    Re: Students, governor want U.Va. student arrest investigated

    Quote Originally Posted by JasperL View Post
    But if the stories are even close to accurate, the 'encounter' went from 0 to 100 very quickly. It takes a little while to recognize that something is getting out of hand, pull out your phone, hit camera, switch to video, and hit start recording. It's irrational and unfair to assume with no evidence someone is hiding a recording that exonerates the officers.

    I can just as easily assume the reason the ABC cops don't wear body cameras is so they'll leave no video trace of acting like jack booted thugs.
    Actually it takes about 5 seconds to do that. I just tried it.

    By the way, it's also irrational and unfair to assume with no evidence that someone is hiding a recording that shows the officers delivering a beating on him.
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    Re: Students, governor want U.Va. student arrest investigated

    Quote Originally Posted by faithful_servant View Post
    You don't know the whole story, so your conclusions can be wrong. Why not wait until we know the whole story before jumping to a conclusion?? I can put together a lot of scenarios where what happened to him was entirely justified. If he was pulled off to the side because he wouldn't step away from the door and when the officers pulled him aside, he yanked his arm back, got loud and belligerent and started calling the officers "******* racists", the officers asked him to stop and he kept doing it, so the officers took him to the ground and in the ensuing scuffle, he scraped his head against a sharp edge of part of the officer's equipment. I've got the EXACT same amount of backing for scenario as you do for yours. The difference is that I don't think that mine is the absolute truth, while you think yours is.
    I'm just curious why you think even in that scenario that taking him to the ground is appropriate use of force.

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    Re: Students, governor want U.Va. student arrest investigated

    Quote Originally Posted by tres borrachos View Post
    Actually it takes about 5 seconds to do that. I just tried it.
    I'm not sure what this proves. The working theory is now, in an era of cell phones, that if the entire encounter with police isn't released, someone is hiding a recording of it, because we can assume that some kid will ALWAYS record something like this?

    By the way, it's also irrational and unfair to assume with no evidence that someone is hiding a recording that shows the officers delivering a beating on him.
    Yes, it is irrational, which is why I'm not making such an assumption.

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    Re: Students, governor want U.Va. student arrest investigated

    What does one wish to remain unexposed by opposing an investigation. Obviously if there has been no wrong doing, it will be dropped (that's assuming a fair and independent investigation was conducted). And if wrong doing is found, then there's a problem that needs to be addressed and someone needs to be held accountable. What reasonable person would oppose that. Seems that an investigation is a win win.
    Killing one person is murder, killing 100,000 is foreign policy

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    Re: Students, governor want U.Va. student arrest investigated

    Quote Originally Posted by faithful_servant View Post
    You don't spend much time around this age group, do you? I've seen kids whip out cell phone and have it recording in a couple of seconds. Most people in the age group that was there live for that moment when they can get a video like this. To think that no one there was able to get a video of the whole incident just sounds wrong to me. Maybe I'm wrong, but this just doesn't add up....
    But the kids have to assume that the encounter is going to end very badly before they throw him to the ground, and anticipate that, and start recording as soon as the cops or ABC agents approach him. The safe assumption is he'll be escorted out, told to go on about his night, but not in that bar. Who would EXPECT that he'd be thrown to the ground, bloodied, and arrested, and they'd NEED video evidence of that? He wasn't even doing anything wrong - he showed a valid ID and was denied entry. The reasonable expectation is that's the end of it.

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    Re: Students, governor want U.Va. student arrest investigated

    Quote Originally Posted by JasperL View Post
    I'm not sure what this proves. The working theory is now, in an era of cell phones, that if the entire encounter with police isn't released, someone is hiding a recording of it, because we can assume that some kid will ALWAYS record something like this?



    Yes, it is irrational, which is why I'm not making such an assumption.
    It doesn't prove anything except that the idea that there is no video of the actual police brutality because it takes time to capture it on video is ridiculous. For all we know the bouncer did that to him. Or his roommate. Or he tripped and fell and hit his head on a railing. But unlike other people, I haven't decided anything is true without proof.

    But you are determined to say that the cops DID brutalize him because you don't need video or anything else to prove it. His word is good enough for you.
    Horse sense is the thing a horse has which keeps it from betting on people. ~W.C. Fields

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    Re: Students, governor want U.Va. student arrest investigated

    Quote Originally Posted by faithful_servant View Post
    So what?? Sometimes nice people act like jerks.
    And sometimes cops act like jerks. The ABC agents have a history of going overboard. This kid doesn't - just the opposite.

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    Re: Students, governor want U.Va. student arrest investigated

    Quote Originally Posted by Gaius46 View Post
    First I think the kid was of age and had a valid ID. Even if he didn't underage kids sneaking into bars is as old as drinking age laws. BFD. There's no reason it should have escalated. There's no reason for the heavy hand of the law here.




    You guys make so many assumptions. WHAT HAPPENED BEFORE that we didn't see in the video?


    Are drunk people never violent and/or belligerent?
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    Re: Students, governor want U.Va. student arrest investigated

    Quote Originally Posted by tres borrachos View Post
    It doesn't prove anything except that the idea that there is no video of the actual police brutality because it takes time to capture it on video is ridiculous.
    It's not ridiculous at all. Are you suggesting that almost all encounters with cops and teens are recorded from start to finish?

    For all we know the bouncer did that to him. Or his roommate. Or he tripped and fell and hit his head on a railing. But unlike other people, I haven't decided anything is true without proof.
    But there is no witnesses alleging any of that. They do allege two officers took him to the ground - not the bouncer, not his roommate. But If you want to make up scenarios, it's also possible the officers used a billy club on his head - same number of witnesses allege that as it was the bouncer or a roommate, or he tripped and fell and hit his head.....

    But you are determined to say that the cops DID brutalize him because you don't need video or anything else to prove it. His word is good enough for you.
    It's his word and the word of bystanders. Should I assume they're lying. The kid was on the honor committee. He knows lying can get him expelled - that's what the honor committee does as a matter of fact...

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    Re: Students, governor want U.Va. student arrest investigated

    Quote Originally Posted by ReverendHellh0und View Post
    You guys make so many assumptions. WHAT HAPPENED BEFORE that we didn't see in the video?

    Are drunk people never violent and/or belligerent?
    Several articles have reported he passed a breathalyzer test. We're not even sure he was drunk.

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