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Obama Blasts Republicans Over Letter to Iranian Leadership [W:251]

Re: Obama Blasts Republicans Over Letter to Iranian Leadership

If you are a supporter of President Pinocchio, you might want to be a little less free to accuse his opponents of dishonesty. Mr. Obama, in the best commie tradition, is a shameless, habitual liar.

Thanks for the rant. Would not read again
 
Re: Obama Blasts Republicans Over Letter to Iranian Leadership

Was this letter sent with Obama's knowledge? Or was it done behind his back in an attempt to let Iran know that if they enter into an agreement with Obama that after he leaves office it's very possible that Congress will void the deal completely?

As far as I know, it was an open letter - meaning the media got it before anyone else got it. The Iranians didn't know about it before Obama and the White House did. As many have argued, it was likely a political move for domestic consumption as it was for the Iranians. By doing it in this manner, the Republicans ensured that the media would cover it and by extension the American people would know what Obama was up to and that Senate Republicans weren't going to go along based on the information (leaks) they'd had to date.
 
Re: Obama Blasts Republicans Over Letter to Iranian Leadership

As far as I know, it was an open letter - meaning the media got it before anyone else got it. The Iranians didn't know about it before Obama and the White House did. As many have argued, it was likely a political move for domestic consumption as it was for the Iranians. By doing it in this manner, the Republicans ensured that the media would cover it and by extension the American people would know what Obama was up to and that Senate Republicans weren't going to go along based on the information (leaks) they'd had to date.

Stop it......exposing the truth is extremely painful to bear.
 
Re: Obama Blasts Republicans Over Letter to Iranian Leadership

Hmm, see there is the problem. You made up your mind about Obama before he even started and decided he was a worthless president. Obama has changed a lot since the very beginning, but you're very blind to this because you've hated him from the beginning. When he first started he was very willing to work with everyone. If your eyes had been open and you had paid attention to anything other than FOX News you would have seen that. It's very, very obvious that his interest in going round and round with Republicans in his last four years has changed. He's a completely different person at this point.

The whole point of democracy is to work together, back and forth, to come up with an agreement that benefits as many people as possible. So let's say Obama says, "Let's open the borders to allow anyone and everyone to come in without question, what do you think?" The Republicans come back with, "No, we should actually kill every Mexican and Muslim in this country without question because they're all terrorists that are spreading measles and trying to force us into Sharia Law." Clearly, even you can see, that both sides are too extreme. The problem is that because Obama doesn't just say, "Okay, you're right, let's just kill all Mexicans and Muslims," suddenly he "is refusing to work with them. Instead he says, "Okay, well no, that's not going to work. How about we [do this instead]." Now he is a dictator that isn't working with Republicans. This has been happening the whole time he has been president and so yes, he has changed significantly because why keep screaming and battling and fighting with people who don't actually want to come to a neutral agreement? What the hell is the point anymore?



He made up his mind?

How long have you known Ockham, long enough to know what he was thing eight years ago?

This is the problem with socialists like you, so blind by your own biases, you cannot conceive that others may have had an open mind at some point in their lives.

And this, this amounts to the absurd, wrapped in a lie and lying in Obama****..

""No, we should actually kill every Mexican and Muslim in this country....."

You are the one needs to look at preconceptions, biases, rumor mongering and slander...
 
Re: Obama Blasts Republicans Over Letter to Iranian Leadership

It is wrong, it's very wrong. It's purpose is to undermine the President in the negotiation and it has resulted in Iran stating that the US is untrustworthy. It gives hardliners in Iran that don't want a deal more fuel to say "see....no matter what we agree to there will be sanctions...we told you negotiations were worthless." It's borderline a violation of the Logan Act. There's a reason diplomacy should be done through one voice in the international scene...there's a reason the Logan Act was passed.


it's a mix of legislation and executive orders.

It's not wrong, legally, although you may disagree with the action or the motive as you perceive it. That just makes it controversial, which I agree it is. The Republicans in the Senate who signed the letter, however, aren't the only people who want to see more out of these negotiations and if that undermines Obama's weak position, so be it.

As for the sanctions - we agree - which should also enforce that the Senate Republicans are right and if Obama is in any way promising that all US sanctions will be dropped, the Iranians are wise to be wary that the US, through Obama, isn't trustworthy. It's not unlike Obama to promise something he knows is literally false and not his to grant.
 
Re: Obama Blasts Republicans Over Letter to Iranian Leadership

As I've read this thread today and seen others' comments, I've been starting to think that the Republicans, through their letter, may actually have given President Obama a boost in that he can now go to the Iranians and say, "See, I told you that I can only go so far with the legal abilities I have and the resistance I have in Congress to go further. If you want a deal, we're going to have to get it soon and under more reasonable terms or my hands will be tied and we may be headed to war."

Wouldn't it be a stroke of genius if both Obama and Senate Republicans worked some behind the scenes magic to pull this off?

I know, I'm dreaming, but it would be a good plot line, no?
 
Re: Obama Blasts Republicans Over Letter to Iranian Leadership

Hmm, see there is the problem. You made up your mind about Obama before he even started and decided he was a worthless president.

He has amply confirmed the opinion of everyone who thought he was a worthless president. He has assured his place among the very worst in U.S. history. His habitual lawlessness and contempt for the Constitution provide more than enough reason to impeach him, and if it were not for his race he would have been impeached by now.

If your eyes had been open and you had paid attention to anything other than FOX News you would have seen that.

Yes, I am sure you consult the Economist and Foreign Affairs regularly, but good ole Fox News suits my limited, provincial mind much better. That's why it's all I pay attention to--well, that and all the pretty conservative women. Those of us who are clinging to our guns and Bibles can't hope to aspire to your cosmopolitan wisdom and profound insight.

It's very, very obvious that his interest in going round and round with Republicans in his last four years has changed. He's a completely different person at this point.

My goodness--how wonderful. If only it were true. The leopard cannot change its spots, and President Pinocchio is just as much a damned un-American liar as he always was.

Now he is a dictator

That part you have right. Like any other Red who resents this country, B. Hussein Obama has very much the instincts of a dictator. Leftists are at heart intolerant brownshirts, a fact they try to hide by pretending to be "liberal." They are the very opposite of liberal.

This has been happening the whole time he has been president and so yes, he has changed significantly because why keep screaming and battling and fighting with people who don't actually want to come to a neutral agreement? What the hell is the point anymore?

In other words, we who do not share B. Hussein Obama's ill will toward America should just sit down, shut up, and let The Man Who Would Be King dictate how things will be. I think that is much closer to what you really think "the whole point of democracy is."
 
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Re: Obama Blasts Republicans Over Letter to Iranian Leadership

It's not wrong, legally, although you may disagree with the action or the motive as you perceive it. That just makes it controversial, which I agree it is. The Republicans in the Senate who signed the letter, however, aren't the only people who want to see more out of these negotiations and if that undermines Obama's weak position, so be it.

As for the sanctions - we agree - which should also enforce that the Senate Republicans are right and if Obama is in any way promising that all US sanctions will be dropped, the Iranians are wise to be wary that the US, through Obama, isn't trustworthy. It's not unlike Obama to promise something he knows is literally false and not his to grant.

Actually IMO it strengthen Obama negotiations stance towards the Iranians. He needs to take advantage of it. ;)

As I've read this thread today and seen others' comments, I've been starting to think that the Republicans, through their letter, may actually have given President Obama a boost in that he can now go to the Iranians and say, "See, I told you that I can only go so far with the legal abilities I have and the resistance I have in Congress to go further. If you want a deal, we're going to have to get it soon and under more reasonable terms or my hands will be tied and we may be headed to war."

Wouldn't it be a stroke of genius if both Obama and Senate Republicans worked some behind the scenes magic to pull this off?

I know, I'm dreaming, but it would be a good plot line, no?

Ahh....you nailed it.
 
Re: Obama Blasts Republicans Over Letter to Iranian Leadership

It's not wrong, legally, although you may disagree with the action or the motive as you perceive it. That just makes it controversial, which I agree it is. The Republicans in the Senate who signed the letter, however, aren't the only people who want to see more out of these negotiations and if that undermines Obama's weak position, so be it.

As for the sanctions - we agree - which should also enforce that the Senate Republicans are right and if Obama is in any way promising that all US sanctions will be dropped, the Iranians are wise to be wary that the US, through Obama, isn't trustworthy. It's not unlike Obama to promise something he knows is literally false and not his to grant.

Are you sure that it's not legally wrong? The President is the only one authorized to negotiate agreements with foreign powers. The Senate is certainly not authorized to conduct these negotiations. Under the Logan Act, any direct communication to a foreign government which intends to interfere with official negotiations is illegal.

In 1975 two senators were investigated for violating the Logan act because they visited Cuba. They were later found to be not in violation because they disclosed their intent to the administration, made the purpose of their visit clear to both the Cuban and American government, and were issued an official passport. The administration didn't give its blessing, but it was given the opportunity to object and chose not to.

This letter did none of those things.
 
Re: Obama Blasts Republicans Over Letter to Iranian Leadership

Are you sure that it's not legally wrong? The President is the only one authorized to negotiate agreements with foreign powers. The Senate is certainly not authorized to conduct these negotiations. Under the Logan Act, any direct communication to a foreign government which intends to interfere with official negotiations is illegal.

In 1975 two senators were investigated for violating the Logan act because they visited Cuba. They were later found to be not in violation because they disclosed their intent to the administration, made the purpose of their visit clear to both the Cuban and American government, and were issued an official passport. The administration didn't give its blessing, but it was given the opportunity to object and chose not to.

This letter did none of those things.

Well then you need to get this administration to carry out it's duties and prosecute them for treason.
 
Re: Obama Blasts Republicans Over Letter to Iranian Leadership

There was just another post similar to this posted.

I'll summarize what I posted in that thread: Obama has gone out of his way to thumb his nose at Congress and Republicans in general. "I won" and "I have a pen and phone" are just a sample of those astoundingly arrogant statements. Now Congress shows they have a pen and phone as well. Obama could have invited Congress to oversee (which is Congress' duty by the way) such international deals but he cut them out. Now he gets the slap of a cold fish in the face and doesn't like it. The moral of the story to Obama: Actions have consequences. Are you surprised? Really?

Well said!!

This is exactly my reaction and I'm glad to see that the second post in this thread is what I would have posted if I had seen it earlier.

I haven't read the rest of this thread yet (12 pages...I don't know if I will), but as far as I'm concerned, there's really nothing more to be said except...what comes around, goes around.
 
Re: Obama Blasts Republicans Over Letter to Iranian Leadership

As I've read this thread today and seen others' comments, I've been starting to think that the Republicans, through their letter, may actually have given President Obama a boost in that he can now go to the Iranians and say, "See, I told you that I can only go so far with the legal abilities I have and the resistance I have in Congress to go further. If you want a deal, we're going to have to get it soon and under more reasonable terms or my hands will be tied and we may be headed to war."

Wouldn't it be a stroke of genius if both Obama and Senate Republicans worked some behind the scenes magic to pull this off?

I know, I'm dreaming, but it would be a good plot line, no?

The problem is that the jihadists who rule Iran know very well that Limpwrist will never order any military action against them. He can make any agreement to sell out this country and Israel that he wants, but the next president can also ignore it--and should. What no one seems to mention is that the more weakness Obama shows, the more likely he makes it that Israel will launch a desperate attack on the Iranian nuclear facilities which may not work. At least as long as Mr. Netanyahu heads Israel's government, I am sure it will do anything necessary to prevent Iran from making an atom bomb. It is not even out of the question that Israel would use nuclear weapons to attack the underground facilities at Fordoz and Natanz. That is what this appeasement of Iran is inviting.
 
Re: Obama Blasts Republicans Over Letter to Iranian Leadership

Did anyone expect Congress, especially a Republican Congress, not to act like very evil children after anon a hundred years of doing the same?
 
Re: Obama Blasts Republicans Over Letter to Iranian Leadership

Well then you need to get this administration to carry out it's duties and prosecute them for treason.

Treason?

The Logan Act was passed to prevent congress from interfering in negotiations with the French government in 1799. It's pretty analogous to what the Senators did, and it's a law passed by our founding fathers.

But violating the Logan act is not the same thing as treason. The punishment for treason can be death. The punishment for violating the Logan act varies from fines to no more than three years in prison. I think a fine or censure is called for.
 
Re: Obama Blasts Republicans Over Letter to Iranian Leadership

Are you sure that it's not legally wrong? The President is the only one authorized to negotiate agreements with foreign powers. The Senate is certainly not authorized to conduct these negotiations. Under the Logan Act, any direct communication to a foreign government which intends to interfere with official negotiations is illegal.

In 1975 two senators were investigated for violating the Logan act because they visited Cuba. They were later found to be not in violation because they disclosed their intent to the administration, made the purpose of their visit clear to both the Cuban and American government, and were issued an official passport. The administration didn't give its blessing, but it was given the opportunity to object and chose not to.

This letter did none of those things.

Clear it up for me - what, specifically, in the letter is the Senate "conducting negotiations"?
 
Re: Obama Blasts Republicans Over Letter to Iranian Leadership

Treason?

The Logan Act was passed to prevent congress from interfering in negotiations with the French government in 1799. It's pretty analogous to what the Senators did, and it's a law passed by our founding fathers.

But violating the Logan act is not the same thing as treason. The punishment for treason can be death. The punishment for violating the Logan act varies from fines to no more than three years in prison. I think a fine or censure is called for.

yeah, sorry, the Logan act does not apply to Congressmen acting on their authority.
Any citizen of the United States, wherever he may be, who, without authority of the United States, directly or indirectly commences or carries on any correspondence or intercourse with any foreign government or any officer or agent thereof, with intent to influence the measures or conduct of any foreign government or of any officer or agent thereof, in relation to any disputes or controversies with the United States, or to defeat the measures of the United States, shall be fined under this title or imprisoned not more than three years, or both.
This section shall not abridge the right of a citizen to apply himself, or his agent, to any foreign government, or the agents thereof, for redress of any injury which he may have sustained from such government or any of its agents or subjects.
1 Stat. 613, January 30, 1799, codified at 18 U.S.C. § 953 (2004).

are you going to argue that US Senators acting in their official capacity do not have the authority of the United States?... I'd rethink that premise, if i were you.


the Logan act was meant to prevent private citizens, without authority of the united states, from undermining negotiations
 
Re: Obama Blasts Republicans Over Letter to Iranian Leadership

Treason?

The Logan Act was passed to prevent congress from interfering in negotiations with the French government in 1799. It's pretty analogous to what the Senators did, and it's a law passed by our founding fathers.

But violating the Logan act is not the same thing as treason. The punishment for treason can be death. The punishment for violating the Logan act varies from fines to no more than three years in prison. I think a fine or censure is called for.

Either way the democrats needs to get on it and punish those that dare to challenge their King.
 
Re: Obama Blasts Republicans Over Letter to Iranian Leadership

yeah, sorry, the Logan act does not apply to Congressmen acting on their authority.


are you going to argue that US Senators acting in their official capacity do not have the authority of the United States?... I'd rethink that premise, if i were you.


the Logan act was meant to prevent private citizens, without authority of the united states, from undermining negotiations

Only their King has sole authority......all others do not apply.
 
Re: Obama Blasts Republicans Over Letter to Iranian Leadership

Did anyone expect Congress, especially a Republican Congress, not to act like very evil children after anon a hundred years of doing the same?

I have come to expect the leftist members of the lumpenproletariat who serve as President Pinocchio's rear guard to act like very witless children. And I'm seldom disappointed.
 
Re: Obama Blasts Republicans Over Letter to Iranian Leadership

"Turnabout is fair play" is a game for children. Arriving at a deal with Iran, however unpleasant, has serious consequences and is important.

No its not.. No deal is the BEST DEAL... and back to hardline snactions...

your posts are LOL worthy...

Karma is about to bite John FAIL Kerry.. and Barry Soetero
 
Re: Obama Blasts Republicans Over Letter to Iranian Leadership

Clear it up for me - what, specifically, in the letter is the Senate "conducting negotiations"?

They don't have to conduct negotiations. Carrying out direct contact with a foreign government with intent to influence official negotiations violates the Logan act. The Logan act was passed in 1799 to prevent a similar occurrence where the opposition party attempted to influence negotiations with the French Government.
Any citizen of the United States, wherever he may be, who, without authority of the United States, directly or indirectly commences or carries on any correspondence or intercourse with any foreign government or any officer or agent thereof, with intent to influence the measures or conduct of any foreign government or of any officer or agent thereof, in relation to any disputes or controversies with the United States, or to defeat the measures of the United States, shall be fined under this title or imprisoned not more than three years, or both.

This section shall not abridge the right of a citizen to apply himself, or his agent, to any foreign government, or the agents thereof, for redress of any injury which he may have sustained from such government or any of its agents or subjects.
 
Re: Obama Blasts Republicans Over Letter to Iranian Leadership

Only their King has sole authority......all others do not apply.

sadly, that's is becoming more clear by the day.

a few years ago, i would have said bull****.... but not so much anymore.
 
Re: Obama Blasts Republicans Over Letter to Iranian Leadership

I have come to expect the leftist members of the lumpenproletariat who serve as President Pinocchio's rear guard to act like very witless children. And I'm seldom disappointed.

First principle of government in democracy is that if you can't follow, you can't rule. Period. The end.

I'm a bit weary of hearing Republicans ranting about why they don't have to adhere to simple virtues like that when they fully expect Democrats to abide by them during Republican Administrations.
 
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