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Thread: Clinton had no official State Dept. email address

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    Re: Clinton had no official State Dept. email address

    Quote Originally Posted by TheDemSocialist View Post
    Hilary Clinton stepped down from Secretary of State in 2013. The Federal Records Act amendment that requires personal emails to be preserved on department servers did not become law until late November 2014...
    Bet you're happy as **** about that.
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    Re: Clinton had no official State Dept. email address

    Quote Originally Posted by American View Post
    Bet you're happy as **** about that.
    Cant say I'm not. She was a war hawk, and I'm not one of those "ready for Hilary" people....


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    Re: Clinton had no official State Dept. email address

    Quote Originally Posted by paddymcdougall View Post
    I have no need to "excuse" her behavior. Why do you?

    How about getting back on topic? in my opinion, this is a meaningless flareup, since everyone who emailed her while she was SOS - or who got an email from her - knew she was using a non-gov email address. So bringing it up now makes no sense. Oh - unless you're playing "gotcha politics"

    What is your comment?
    Holy sh1t, the issue is not that people she emailed knew she was using the private system, the issue is documenting official US business communications. So based on your justification, there is NO NEED for government employees to use the government system to archive their communications???

    PS, so what if your husband cheated on you over and over and over again etc etc. Would you, or any feminist or woman of self-respect allow that?
    The Gruber-crat is strong in this one!

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    Re: Clinton had no official State Dept. email address

    Quote Originally Posted by TheDemSocialist View Post
    Maybe you should.
    First, read the definition section of the orginial bill not with the recent amendments. Look to what it defines records as. Then go to the power it gives the archivist. Does it use the word records?
    Second, red the definition section of the amendments. Read what it defines as "records" and "records recorded". Then go the section where it gives power to the archviist. Does it use the words "records recorded"?

    Need more help? See post #56
    Nah. Don't need any help. The law is somewhat unclear according to scholars. You aren't one of them. I'll take their word for it that Hillary has played games with what she knew was required. Hell, even Gibbs said it was a departure from standard practice. If YOU need help, just let me know and I'll provide links to all.

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    Re: Clinton had no official State Dept. email address

    Quote Originally Posted by humbolt View Post
    Nah. Don't need any help. The law is somewhat unclear according to scholars. You aren't one of them. I'll take their word for it that Hillary has played games with what she knew was required. Hell, even Gibbs said it was a departure from standard practice. If YOU need help, just let me know and I'll provide links to all.
    Its actually perfectly clear.


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    Re: Clinton had no official State Dept. email address

    Quote Originally Posted by TheDemSocialist View Post
    Its actually perfectly clear.
    I bet. I worked for the State Department back in the 1980"s. We were required to record all of our communication even back then. You're out of your depth here, but don't let that dissuade you. Carry on and post away.

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    Re: Clinton had no official State Dept. email address

    Quote Originally Posted by humbolt View Post
    I bet. I worked for the State Department back in the 1980"s. We were required to record all of our communication even back then. You're out of your depth here, but don't let that dissuade you. Carry on and post away.
    So tell me what is unclear about it? First you claimed she broke it, then it was unclear? The powers given in the 1950 bill does not use the word "records", and it strictly limits what can be collected. The amendment passed in 2014 broadens the powers to the words "records defined" which gives a much broader amount of power.

    But none the less I guess it was just "unclear" in my pasts posts. Maybe this will make it a bit more clear: "Finally, like the amendments to the PRA, the amendments to the FRA also include language that would provide that an employee of an executive agency may not create or send a record from a nonofficial electronic messaging account without ensuring such record was submitted to an official electronic messaging account.". http://www.gpo.gov/fdsys/pkg/CRPT-11...113srpt218.pdf I mean, I thought it was pretty clear before... Is it still "false" or "unclear"? Or has it been made clear yet?


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    Re: Clinton had no official State Dept. email address

    Quote Originally Posted by TheDemSocialist View Post
    no it doesnt, especially when you only responded to half of my post.
    1.)That defines what a record is. Ok. Thats great. That simply just a definition. Now what can be done with that definition? The answer to that question, which actually gives the act power is the powers it gives.
    2.)The powers it gives is what you left out:
    Under the original act:
    "§ 2111. Material accepted for deposit
    When the Archivist considers it to be in the public interest he may accept for deposit—
    (1) the papers and other historical materials of a President or former President of the United States, or other official or former official of the Government, and other papers relating to and contemporary with a President or former President of the United States, subject to restrictions agreeable to the Archivist as to their use; and
    (2) documents, including motion-picture films, still pictures, and sound recordings, from private sources that are appropriate for preservation by the Government as evidence of its organization, functions, policies, decisions, procedures, and transactions."

    --This is what key right here is "(2)". No where does it state the archivist has the power to acuqisit if its "regardless of physical form or characteristics". Why does it not state that? Because no where in either of those sections does it use the world "records". Nowhere does it give the archivist any power to acquisit all public documents, be them done on a private source or a public source. It just give the archivist the power to acquist papers, docs, motion picture fils, photos, sound recordings from private source. Thats it.

    Now we go to the revised amendment:
    "§ 2111. Material accepted for deposit
    (a) IN GENERAL.—When the Archivist considers it to be in the public interest the Archivist may accept for deposit—
    (1) the papers and other historical materials of a President or former President of the United States, or other official or former official of the Government, and other papers relating to and contemporary with a President or former President of the United States, subject to restrictions agreeable to the Archivist as to their use; and
    (2) recorded information (as such term is defined in section 3301(a)(2) of this title) from private sources that are appropriate for preservation by the Government as evidence of its organization, functions, policies, decisions, procedures, and transactions.
    --The key here is in "(2)" of the amended section above. What does it say? Essentially the Archivist has the power to obtain all traditional forms of records, regardless of physical form or characteristics, including information created, manipulated, communicated, or stored in digital or electronic form.". Why does it say that? Because (2) uses the word "recorded information". And what does the definition section of the bill tell us: "(2) RECORDED INFORMATION DEFINED.—For purposes of paragraph (1), the term ‘recorded information’ includes all traditional forms of records, regardless of physical form or characteristics, including information created, manipulated, communicated, or stored in digital or electronic form." .
    http://www.gpo.gov/fdsys/pkg/CRPT-11...113srpt218.pdf



    No indication she did: State: No Indication that Clinton Used E-mail for Classified Purposes - Bloomberg Politics




    But I'm still interested in this Clinton amendment you said gave credence to your claims, especially when it came to emails. Can you point to this amendment Bill Clinton signed into law?
    You're completely wrong. At her level, nearly everything she says regarding the state department is a record. The "in any form" covers every form of communication possible so long as it leaves a physical trace. It's that simple, specially when she goes on to say that she was observing the "letter and spirit" of the law.
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    Re: Clinton had no official State Dept. email address

    Quote Originally Posted by Chainsaw View Post
    Holy sh1t, the issue is not that people she emailed knew she was using the private system, the issue is documenting official US business communications. So based on your justification, there is NO NEED for government employees to use the government system to archive their communications???

    PS, so what if your husband cheated on you over and over and over again etc etc. Would you, or any feminist or woman of self-respect allow that?
    I agree. Hillary should have been strong enough to leave a cheater like Marianne Gingrich did.


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    Re: Clinton had no official State Dept. email address

    Quote Originally Posted by TheDemSocialist View Post
    So tell me what is unclear about it? First you claimed she broke it, then it was unclear? The powers given in the 1950 bill does not use the word "records", and it strictly limits what can be collected. The amendment passed in 2014 broadens the powers to the words "records defined" which gives a much broader amount of power.
    No, I didn't say it's sketchy - legal scholars say it's sketchy. Nothing in the 1950 Act excludes emails or any other record. They just aren't specifically included.

    But none the less I guess it was just "unclear" in my pasts posts. Maybe this will make it a bit more clear: "Finally, like the amendments to the PRA, the amendments to the FRA also include language that would provide that an employee of an executive agency may not create or send a record from a nonofficial electronic messaging account without ensuring such record was submitted to an official electronic messaging account.". http://www.gpo.gov/fdsys/pkg/CRPT-11...113srpt218.pdf I mean, I thought it was pretty clear before... Is it still "false" or "unclear"? Or has it been made clear yet?
    You aren't capable of making clear something that already was. Describing a method and penalties doesn't change the fact that records were to be preserved. Perhaps you should read a bit more.

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