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Thread: Obama vetoes Keystone XL pipeline, leaving it in limbo

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    Re: Obama vetoes Keystone XL pipeline, leaving it in limbo

    Quote Originally Posted by iguanaman View Post
    It is Republicans that made this an "issue". Doing international projects like this are not part of Congress's job. What did the GOP offer Obama in exchange for XL? Nothing. That is how important it really is to them.
    As already mentioned, this wasn't started under a "republican", it was aimed at decreasing our oil independence. Obama is not an emperor, nor does he get to hold things as "hostage" for a cut.

    Its no worry, this will only serve as another political wedge issue for 2016 (where its quite popular with Americans), and thats only if the veto isn't overturned next month. Either way, the dems take a hit.

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    Re: Obama vetoes Keystone XL pipeline, leaving it in limbo

    Quote Originally Posted by Montecresto View Post
    Awesome.
    See you on the flip side!

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    Re: Obama vetoes Keystone XL pipeline, leaving it in limbo

    Quote Originally Posted by Grant View Post
    You're right but I'm a Continentalist, to perhaps coin a word, and would like to see prosperity throughout the North American continent with resource sharing here first. This decision is so short-sighted, not to say irrational, that it cannot be easily explained using ordinary common sense. Certainly excuses were made but it seems BHO is actually working against an energy independent America..
    yeah, that kind of sums it up. You can hardly come hat in hand to Ottawa and say "please can we have more oil" when you just cost the industry billions and went back on your word. Neighbors can be neighbors or they can be neighbors and friends. Obama does not see us a friends, but then again neither did Bush who would be tarred and fathered here, perhaps the most hated president since Nixon who was attacked by a knife wielding Canadian on his one and only visit here.
    ""You know, when we sell to other countries, even if they're allies -- you never know about an ally. An ally can turn."
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    Re: Obama vetoes Keystone XL pipeline, leaving it in limbo

    Quote Originally Posted by Fearandloathing View Post
    there is no "Indian land" in Canada. India is a half a world away. LOL We have a higher "Indian" population than we do native in many areas

    It is part of the process. Since land claims are still unsettled, First Nations have lain claim to 3.7 times the land mass of this province, with overlap. because of that you can't build anything without attracting drums, chants and protests, always settled with nice fat leases.

    The problem is the ecos, or was. The last election here the NDP leader, similar to a Democrat there, said he would veto a pipeline that hadn't been officially proposed yet. Let's play Obamagod!
    He forgot that much of his base were unionized truckers, machinists, roughnecks and so forth who stood to make upward of $150,000 a year would object to not having jobs. That leader has since [one year] disappeared from the universe as we know it and the NDP is, well, meeting as we speak in a phone booth.

    But they can delay things, hearings etc., which have already started, the first phase is done.....

    As to the first part, Canada is one tenth the size of the US. Where you have might, Canada must use tact and patience and something you yanks never hear about: "linking". You want to talk about salmon rights etc., let's talk water usage. You want to talk about guaranteed supply? Let's talk about Keystone.

    Also, we have no idea what Obama has been telling Harper. You must remember reports here when Obama was running the first time, him telling Ohio and Michigan audiences he would rip up NAFTA, then telling the Foreign Office that it was campaign rhetoric. So we have no idea whether the dog is barking or whining.

    Also, until the 08 melt down the US represented up to 80% of our trade, which leaves us vulnerable; today it is about 40% or less and most of that is "must have" Like Auto Trade Pact, resources, power etc. So we have less and less to lose, which I don't think Obama has figured out yet.
    At one time Canada relied on over 90% of its trade with the US but it was recognized a couple of decades ago that this dependence was potentially harmful for Canada and this latest deal demonstrates what can happen when ideology trumps common sense.

    Canada's Free Trade Agreements

    Certainly Canada will sell its oil elsewhere but I would have preferred it go to our long time neighbors.

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    Re: Obama vetoes Keystone XL pipeline, leaving it in limbo

    Quote Originally Posted by Fearandloathing View Post
    there is no "Indian land" in Canada. India is a half a world away. LOL We have a higher "Indian" population than we do native in many areas

    It is part of the process. Since land claims are still unsettled, First Nations have lain claim to 3.7 times the land mass of this province, with overlap. because of that you can't build anything without attracting drums, chants and protests, always settled with nice fat leases.

    The problem is the ecos, or was. The last election here the NDP leader, similar to a Democrat there, said he would veto a pipeline that hadn't been officially proposed yet. Let's play Obamagod!
    He forgot that much of his base were unionized truckers, machinists, roughnecks and so forth who stood to make upward of $150,000 a year would object to not having jobs. That leader has since [one year] disappeared from the universe as we know it and the NDP is, well, meeting as we speak in a phone booth.

    But they can delay things, hearings etc., which have already started, the first phase is done.....

    As to the first part, Canada is one tenth the size of the US. Where you have might, Canada must use tact and patience and something you yanks never hear about: "linking". You want to talk about salmon rights etc., let's talk water usage. You want to talk about guaranteed supply? Let's talk about Keystone.

    Also, we have no idea what Obama has been telling Harper. You must remember reports here when Obama was running the first time, him telling Ohio and Michigan audiences he would rip up NAFTA, then telling the Foreign Office that it was campaign rhetoric. So we have no idea whether the dog is barking or whining.

    Also, until the 08 melt down the US represented up to 80% of our trade, which leaves us vulnerable; today it is about 40% or less and most of that is "must have" Like Auto Trade Pact, resources, power etc. So we have less and less to lose, which I don't think Obama has figured out yet.
    Thanks for the great, informative response.

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    Re: Obama vetoes Keystone XL pipeline, leaving it in limbo

    Fifty permanent jobs, gone! Fifty jobs! Noooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo!

    What's gonna happen next, hundreds of thousands of new jobs get created this month?! Damn this president and his recovery!
    "A man you can bait with a tweet is not a man we can trust with nuclear weapons." --Hillary Rodham Clinton
    "Innocent until proven guilty is for criminal convictions, not elections." --Mitt Romney

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    Re: Obama vetoes Keystone XL pipeline, leaving it in limbo

    Who cares about jobs? Honestly. It's not like the pipelines employ millions of people in crucial positions. They're all temporary jobs as long as oil stays above a certain price. Once it drops, as we've seen recently, people get laid off in the thousands. That's what's been happening in Alberta. I wish the economists - who are pseudoscientists, by the way - would stop talking about such minuscule job creation as if it's the best thing since sliced bread. The keystone pipeline only benefits the usual suspects, and most of that oil is being exported anyway. It's not like it will make one iota of difference to domestic prices.

    World demand for oil jumps by 1 million barrels per day. At this rate we will have to drill every last piece of ecosystem to get at diminishing supplies.

    Obama's veto won't last. Once the pendulum swings back to the GOP being in power, as it inevitably will, we will see the wholesale destruction of all common sense again. I guess it's a temporary victory for... somebody?

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    Re: Obama vetoes Keystone XL pipeline, leaving it in limbo

    Quote Originally Posted by Fearandloathing View Post
    yeah, that kind of sums it up. You can hardly come hat in hand to Ottawa and say "please can we have more oil" when you just cost the industry billions and went back on your word. Neighbors can be neighbors or they can be neighbors and friends. Obama does not see us a friends, but then again neither did Bush who would be tarred and fathered here, perhaps the most hated president since Nixon who was attacked by a knife wielding Canadian on his one and only visit here.
    I agree with your trades points but don't believe Canadians, apart from the far left, hate any Americans. The Canadian left is much like the American left in that they can both hate rather easily. Also Obama doesn't see any of America's former Allies as friends.

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    Re: Obama vetoes Keystone XL pipeline, leaving it in limbo

    Quote Originally Posted by Northern Light View Post
    Who cares about jobs? Honestly. It's not like the pipelines employ millions of people in crucial positions. They're all temporary jobs as long as oil stays above a certain price. Once it drops, as we've seen recently, people get laid off in the thousands. That's what's been happening in Alberta. I wish the economists - who are pseudoscientists, by the way - would stop talking about such minuscule job creation as if it's the best thing since sliced bread. The keystone pipeline only benefits the usual suspects, and most of that oil is being exported anyway. It's not like it will make one iota of difference to domestic prices.

    World demand for oil jumps by 1 million barrels per day. At this rate we will have to drill every last piece of ecosystem to get at diminishing supplies.

    Obama's veto won't last. Once the pendulum swings back to the GOP being in power, as it inevitably will, we will see the wholesale destruction of all common sense again. I guess it's a temporary victory for... somebody?
    Nah lets make obama prezzy fer lifey. maybe he can push the welfare rolls higher.

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    Re: Obama vetoes Keystone XL pipeline, leaving it in limbo

    Quote Originally Posted by Phys251 View Post
    Fifty permanent jobs, gone! Fifty jobs! Noooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo!

    What's gonna happen next, hundreds of thousands of new jobs get created this month?! Damn this president and his recovery!
    Nearly every infrastructure job is temporary. So I guess you are against the president's request for this spending is bogus.

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