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ISIS reportedly burns 45 people alive

MMC said:
No you can save all your dishonesty BS. 40 years brought us up to BO peep and he has increased the threat vastly. All due to his misunderstanding and vision of reality and the world. I know that's hard for you to figure out in the here and now. But that's just the way it is.
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As I said, you're part of the problem, and along with the rest of the partisans will make sure that things only get worse.
 
Dittohead not! said:
Yes, so have I.

And, supporting the forces fighting ISIS is the thing to do.

Now, let's ask ourselves: Does ISIS want the US to fight them directly? If so, why?
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ISIS wants to fight everybody not just us......they declared War on Rome first outside of the ME. Italy, Russia, France, Britain, Germany and a few others they named. Plus they definitely want to fight and kill Shia.

They declared on us and our way of life. Already have killed our people and are constantly trying to do so.
 
MMC said:
ISIS wants to fight everybody not just us......they declared War on Rome first outside of the ME. Italy, Russia, France, Britain, Germany and a few others they named. Plus they definitely want to fight and kill Shia.

They declared on us and our way of life. Already have killed our people and are constantly trying to do so.
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Right, and they're saying those things, why again? Do they really think they can take on the entire rest of the world and win?

or do they have a different agenda?
 
Montecresto said:
As I said, you're part of the problem, and along with the rest of the partisans will make sure that things only get worse.
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Well its not like you are any solution or even have one.....as you tend to avoid talking about when others start chaos. Only look to blame the US. For everything since its beginning.

Like you did with Russia.....knowin Putin was in the wrong. Who did you blame.....the US. Who did you blame for Iran.....the US. Iraq the US. Japan and WWII the US.

No talk from Monte about what the sponsors of terrorism are doing and giving them any credit. Just back to your usual.....blame the US. Oh and not much talk from Monte and about what the Saud is doing. Especially with you being there and all, huh?
 
Dittohead not! said:
Right, and they're saying those things, why again? Do they really think they can take on the entire rest of the world and win?

or do they have a different agenda?
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If you read what they want.....they think it will fulfill their prophecy. Even if they are not the power structure in the end.




We have misunderstood the nature of the Islamic State in at least two ways. First, we tend to see jihadism as monolithic, and to apply the logic of al‑Qaeda to an organization that has decisively eclipsed it. The Islamic State supporters I spoke with still refer to Osama bin Laden as “Sheikh Osama,” a title of honor. But jihadism has evolved since al-Qaeda’s heyday, from about 1998 to 2003, and many jihadists disdain the group’s priorities and current leadership.

We are misled in a second way, by a well-intentioned but dishonest campaign to deny the Islamic State’s medieval religious nature. Peter Bergen, who produced the first interview with bin Laden in 1997, titled his first book Holy War, Inc. in part to acknowledge bin Laden as a creature of the modern secular world. Bin Laden corporatized terror and franchised it out. He requested specific political concessions, such as the withdrawal of U.S. forces from Saudi Arabia. His foot soldiers navigated the modern world confidently. On Mohammad Atta’s last full day of life, he shopped at Walmart and ate dinner at Pizza Hut.....snip~

What ISIS Really Wants - The Atlantic
 
MMC said:
If you read what they want.....they think it will fulfill their prophecy. Even if they are not the power structure in the end.




We have misunderstood the nature of the Islamic State in at least two ways. First, we tend to see jihadism as monolithic, and to apply the logic of al‑Qaeda to an organization that has decisively eclipsed it. The Islamic State supporters I spoke with still refer to Osama bin Laden as “Sheikh Osama,” a title of honor. But jihadism has evolved since al-Qaeda’s heyday, from about 1998 to 2003, and many jihadists disdain the group’s priorities and current leadership.

We are misled in a second way, by a well-intentioned but dishonest campaign to deny the Islamic State’s medieval religious nature. Peter Bergen, who produced the first interview with bin Laden in 1997, titled his first book Holy War, Inc. in part to acknowledge bin Laden as a creature of the modern secular world. Bin Laden corporatized terror and franchised it out. He requested specific political concessions, such as the withdrawal of U.S. forces from Saudi Arabia. His foot soldiers navigated the modern world confidently. On Mohammad Atta’s last full day of life, he shopped at Walmart and ate dinner at Pizza Hut.....snip~

What ISIS Really Wants - The Atlantic
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There is a temptation to rehearse this observation—that jihadists are modern secular people, with modern political concerns, wearing medieval religious disguise—and make it fit the Islamic State. In fact, much of what the group does looks nonsensical except in light of a sincere, carefully considered commitment to returning civilization to a seventh-century legal environment, and ultimately to bringing about the apocalypse.
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They think they can bring about the apocalypse, and the return of the 12th. Imam. That is their real goal. Engaging the west in battle is a part of that plan.
 
Dittohead not! said:
Right, and they're saying those things, why again? Do they really think they can take on the entire rest of the world and win?

or do they have a different agenda?
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Or do they use it as a recruiting tool to demonstrate their toughness and ambition?
 
Dittohead not! said:
They think they can bring about the apocalypse, and the return of the 12th. Imam. That is their real goal. Engaging the west in battle is a part of that plan.
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Yeah and it correlates with the 12vers of Iran/Shia and their vision that the government they have now.....will be the one that takes the reins from the Sunni. As this was what the Sunni would do.




The reality is that the Islamic State is Islamic. Very Islamic. Yes, it has attracted psychopaths and adventure seekers, drawn largely from the disaffected populations of the Middle East and Europe. But the religion preached by its most ardent followers derives from coherent and even learned interpretations of Islam.

Virtually every major decision and law promulgated by the Islamic State adheres to what it calls, in its press and pronouncements, and on its billboards, license plates, stationery, and coins, “the Prophetic methodology,” which means following the prophecy and example of Muhammad, in punctilious detail. Muslims can reject the Islamic State; nearly all do. But pretending that it isn’t actually a religious, millenarian group, with theology that must be understood to be combatted, has already led the United States to underestimate it and back foolish schemes to counter it. We’ll need to get acquainted with the Islamic State’s intellectual genealogy if we are to react in a way that will not strengthen it, but instead help it self-immolate in its own excessive zeal......snip~

What ISIS Really Wants - The Atlantic
 
Dittohead not! said:
They think they can bring about the apocalypse, and the return of the 12th. Imam. That is their real goal. Engaging the west in battle is a part of that plan.
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We should have been thinking how the West could and should respond. But a problem is that 'the west' of today is not the west of a couple of generations ago. This generation has no idea of real bad guys, real war, or real death and rapes to real people. They only see it on movies or video games and none of it is genuinely real to them.

The Islamists have a better grip on reality and what it takes to fight a Superpower and their far better equipped military opponents. The stumbling western giants just bump into each, dazed and confused and wait for the next attack.
 
Grant said:
We should have been thinking how the West could and should respond. But a problem is that 'the west' of today is not the west of a couple of generations ago. This generation has no idea of real bad guys, real war, or real death and rapes to real people. They only see it on movies or video games and none of it is genuinely real to them.

The Islamists have a better grip on reality and what it takes to fight a Superpower and their far better equipped military opponents. The stumbling western giants just bump into each, dazed and confused and wait for the next attack.
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Heya Grant. :2wave: How many times have I said our people have been played. Outwitted and to involved with the prestige and the cameras and themselves. Both sides of the aisle has.....only Department heads and chairs changed. People in with both sides of our aisle and been there for 10 years or more not counting the younger generation just brought in.

Even with our own allies. From Diplomats sent to the UN and from Ambassador titles given to actors for countries. Things need to start changing and we need people who know what they are doing and for what reasons.
 
Dittohead not! said:
Right, and they're saying those things, why again? Do they really think they can take on the entire rest of the world and win?

or do they have a different agenda?
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Why ask?

First, that would require taking some time to understand how this new grotesque has been formed, the frustrations of history and the root of the rabid hate that drives them.

That would first require identifying how this aberration of Islam came into being in the first place and that would mean using the words "terrorist" and "Islam" in the same sentence.

And it appears that's out of the question.

I'd say what they really want is to strike so much fear in the Western world we simply cave. So far it seems its working
 
MMC said:
Well its not like you are any solution or even have one.....as you tend to avoid talking about when others start chaos. Only look to blame the US. For everything since its beginning.

Like you did with Russia.....knowin Putin was in the wrong. Who did you blame.....the US. Who did you blame for Iran.....the US. Iraq the US. Japan and WWII the US.

No talk from Monte about what the sponsors of terrorism are doing and giving them any credit. Just back to your usual.....blame the US. Oh and not much talk from Monte and about what the Saud is doing. Especially with you being there and all, huh?
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No, actually, on the issue of Ukraine, I do not know Putin is in the wrong, I don't even think it. Now then, as to Iraq, yes wholly and completely a US failure. Iraq was not complicit in 9/11, had no ties to AQ or OBL. To Japan well, Japan was an aggressor in the Far East and West Pacific. They were not however threatening the US. After prolonged provocations by FDR, Japan attacked the US, so you see, FDR asked for and wanted involvement in that war. And why are you still lying about my position on terrorism, all terrorism, not just that perpetrated by brown people, hmm? Why do you continue to ignore my criticisms of SA, hmm? I've pointed out that the Saudis helped fund 9/11 and supplied 15 of the 19 terrorists. That Saudi Arabia has as big a history, bigger, of support of terrorism as Iran, Libya, the US, Israel or the UK. Speak to that MMC!!!!
 
Grant said:
Or do they use it as a recruiting tool to demonstrate their toughness and ambition?
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No, I don't think that's it. I think that, in their twisted belief system, they think that they'll win even if they're destroyed in the process of bringing about the apocalypse and the coming of the 12th. Imam to establish a worldwide caliphate.
 
MMC said:
If you read what they want.....they think it will fulfill their prophecy. Even if they are not the power structure in the end.




We have misunderstood the nature of the Islamic State in at least two ways. First, we tend to see jihadism as monolithic, and to apply the logic of al‑Qaeda to an organization that has decisively eclipsed it. The Islamic State supporters I spoke with still refer to Osama bin Laden as “Sheikh Osama,” a title of honor. But jihadism has evolved since al-Qaeda’s heyday, from about 1998 to 2003, and many jihadists disdain the group’s priorities and current leadership.

We are misled in a second way, by a well-intentioned but dishonest campaign to deny the Islamic State’s medieval religious nature. Peter Bergen, who produced the first interview with bin Laden in 1997, titled his first book Holy War, Inc. in part to acknowledge bin Laden as a creature of the modern secular world. Bin Laden corporatized terror and franchised it out. He requested specific political concessions, such as the withdrawal of U.S. forces from Saudi Arabia. His foot soldiers navigated the modern world confidently. On Mohammad Atta’s last full day of life, he shopped at Walmart and ate dinner at Pizza Hut.....snip~

What ISIS Really Wants - The Atlantic
Click to expand...

To the bolded, in red! Since when are we listening to what they say they want. Every time I point out what they say they want, I'm told we shouldn't be listening to what the terrorists say, they can't be trusted, lol.
 
Grant said:
We should have been thinking how the West could and should respond. But a problem is that 'the west' of today is not the west of a couple of generations ago. This generation has no idea of real bad guys, real war, or real death and rapes to real people. They only see it on movies or video games and none of it is genuinely real to them.

The Islamists have a better grip on reality and what it takes to fight a Superpower and their far better equipped military opponents. The stumbling western giants just bump into each, dazed and confused and wait for the next attack.
Click to expand...
I don't think we can understand the mindset of ISIS from the point of view of the culture of western society.

And I disagree that they have a grip on reality at all.

They're living in a fantasy land where they can, through helping ancient prophecies to be fulfilled, bring about a world wide Islamic caliphate. That's their reality, not that they actually think they can defeat the rest of he world militarily.

In their minds, even if we kill them all, they will still win.
 
Dittohead not! said:
They think they can bring about the apocalypse, and the return of the 12th. Imam. That is their real goal. Engaging the west in battle is a part of that plan.
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And as this nightmare progresses, how many Western Christians are going to see this as the fulfilment of their end time prophecies as well, and play right along? In the meantime, there are those who think both are fantasies and don't fancy being caught in between it!!
 
Montecresto said:
And as this nightmare progresses, how many Western Christians are going to see this as the fulfilment of their end time prophecies as well, and play right along? In the meantime, there are those who think both are fantasies and don't fancy being caught in between it!!
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I could be wrong, but I really don't believe there are many Western Christians who are willing to die in the effort to bring about the end times. There may be a few, but not enough to actually carry out their wishes.
 
Montecresto said:
No, actually, on the issue of Ukraine, I do not know Putin is in the wrong, I don't even think it. Now then, as to Iraq, yes wholly and completely a US failure. Iraq was not complicit in 9/11, had no ties to AQ or OBL. To Japan well, Japan was an aggressor in the Far East and West Pacific. They were not however threatening the US. After prolonged provocations by FDR, Japan attacked the US, so you see, FDR asked for and wanted involvement in that war. And why are you still lying about my position on terrorism, all terrorism, not just that perpetrated by brown people, hmm? Why do you continue to ignore my criticisms of SA, hmm? I've pointed out that the Saudis helped fund 9/11 and supplied 15 of the 19 terrorists. That Saudi Arabia has as big a history, bigger, of support of terrorism as Iran, Libya, the US, Israel or the UK. Speak to that MMC!!!!
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Naturally you admit it.....but really Monte. You rarely bring it up unless it is related to that event. Otherwise its like all see how it comes off from you. Nothing but how the US is at fault. Like you said going back forty years or at least until Japan, Right.
 
Dittohead not! said:
I could be wrong, but I really don't believe there are many Western Christians who are willing to die in the effort to bring about the end times. There may be a few, but not enough to actually carry out their wishes.
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I like the positive attitude, but the more things started to look like it, the more inclined people could be to embrace it.
 
MMC said:
Naturally you admit it.....but really Monte. You rarely bring it up unless it is related to that event. Otherwise its like all see how it comes off from you. Nothing but how the US is at fault. Like you said going back forty years or at least until Japan, Right.
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Rarely bring what up?
 
Montecresto said:
I like the positive attitude, but the more things started to look like it, the more inclined people could be to embrace it.
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One thing is obvious: The nutters of ISIS are embracing it whole heartedly.
 
Montecresto said:
To the bolded, in red! Since when are we listening to what they say they want. Every time I point out what they say they want, I'm told we shouldn't be listening to what the terrorists say, they can't be trusted, lol.
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Well some are listening and noticing.....I get told the same. More are listening now since the Terrorists seem to follow thru with what they say they are going to do.
 
Dittohead not! said:
One thing is obvious: The nutters of ISIS are embracing it whole heartedly.
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That is obvious, but I'm telling you that they are not alone.

In 2003 while lobbying leaders to put together the Coalition of the Willing, President Bush spoke to France’s President Jacques Chirac. Bush wove a story about how the Biblical creatures Gog and Magog were at work in the Middle East and how they must be defeated.

In Genesis and Ezekiel Gog and Magog are forces of the Apocalypse who are prophesied to come out of the north and destroy Israel unless stopped. The Book of Revelation took up the Old Testament prophesy:

“And when the thousand years are expired, Satan shall be loosed out of his prison, And shall go out to deceive the nations which are in the four quarters of the earth, Gog and Magog, to gather them together to battle … and fire came down from God out of heaven, and devoured them.”

Bush believed the time had now come for that battle, telling Chirac:

“This confrontation is willed by God, who wants to use this conflict to erase his people’s enemies before a New Age begins”.
 
MMC said:
Well some are listening and noticing.....I get told the same. More are listening now since the Terrorists seem to follow thru with what they say they are going to do.
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True, but they've been doing that all along. OBL wrote us all a very clear and precise if lengthy letter articulating both his grievances, and his plan of response if they are not addressed. And those grievances that everybody wants to dismiss, are not the ones that Bush and now Obama want us to believe they are!
 
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