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Tribal leader: Iraqi troops in Anbar province could 'collapse within hours'

Hamster Buddha

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Tribal leader: Iraqi troops in Anbar province could 'collapse within hours'

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Exert: An Iraqi tribal leader said Saturday that ISIS militants are gaining ground in Anbar province, predicting a "collapse within hours" of Iraqi army forces there if tribal forces withdraw.

So about all that progress that's been made defeating ISIS that the WH was championing a short while ago...
 
Tribal leader: Iraqi troops in Anbar province could 'collapse within hours'

Exert: An Iraqi tribal leader said Saturday that ISIS militants are gaining ground in Anbar province, predicting a "collapse within hours" of Iraqi army forces there if tribal forces withdraw.

So about all that progress that's been made defeating ISIS that the WH was championing a short while ago...

The WH, and policies emanating from it in these last dozen years has been the Islamic states biggest benefactor.
 
The WH, and policies emanating from it in these last dozen years has been the Islamic states biggest benefactor.

I'll admit, that I doubt that we'd be in this present position with Iran were Saddam to still be in power. But regardless of your opinions of the Iraq conflict, that book was closed when the last combat troops left the country and the future of Iraq was handed over to it's people. Besides, one could easily argue that the Arab Spring has a larger part to play in attributing to ISIS, or even the failure of the Iraqi Government to work with it's Sunni brethren as had they of done so we wouldn't be in this position in the first place. Neither of those situations had one thing to do with American involvement. So you can stop with the American bashing, as it's no longer relevant to this equation.
 
Well, the Tribal leader might be Right.




Between 20 and 25 ISIS fighters wearing Iraqi Army uniforms infiltrated al-Asad airbase Friday -- the sprawling western Iraqi base where 400 American forces are training Iraqi troops -- and tried to enter the base, military officials said. The ISIS fighters were killed as Iraqi forces repelled the attack, officials said, and no U.S. military service members were affected by the attack. A statement released by Combined Joint Task Force-Operation Inherent Resolve confirmed the attack.

Kirby confirmed that on Thursday ISIS fighters had taken over al-Baghdadi, a town located less than 10 miles from the base at al-Asad. ISIS fighters who had been besieging the town for months were able to make into the town on Thursday and take over the local Iraqi police station. The taking of al-Baghdadi was the first time in months that ISIS had gained ground in Iraq, where it has been in a defensive posture.....snip~

ISIS Fighters Attack Iraqi Base Wearing Iraqi Army Uniforms - ABC News
 
I'll admit, that I doubt that we'd be in this present position with Iran were Saddam to still be in power. But regardless of your opinions of the Iraq conflict, that book was closed when the last combat troops left the country and the future of Iraq was handed over to it's people. Besides, one could easily argue that the Arab Spring has a larger part to play in attributing to ISIS, or even the failure of the Iraqi Government to work with it's Sunni brethren as had they of done so we wouldn't be in this position in the first place. Neither of those situations had one thing to do with American involvement. So you can stop with the American bashing, as it's no longer relevant to this equation.

As long as the US continues to advance destructive foreign policy, the book is wide open. And those citizens that have and are suffering because of it, would be offended by your dismissal, and suggestion that the book is closed.
 
As long as the US continues to advance destructive foreign policy, the book is wide open. And those citizens that have and are suffering because of it, would be offended by your dismissal, and suggestion that the book is closed.

The United States didn't create ISIS.
 
The United States didn't create ISIS.

Myself included, I can't think of anybody that has suggested that. Now, if you'd like to follow along, what has been pointed out is that the leaders that US foreign policy has removed, contained Islamic extremism. See how that works, it really is elementary.
 
As long as the US continues to advance destructive foreign policy, the book is wide open. And those citizens that have and are suffering because of it, would be offended by your dismissal, and suggestion that the book is closed.

People who are dying in Iraq and Syria right now, aren't doing so not because of US Foreign policy, but because of ISIS, which was an organization that sprung out of the Arab Spring. And despite what we can say about the situation in Iraq, it's not like we've been bombing Syria prior to the rise of ISIS so some of the blame also rests with Assad and his military's capabilities. Come to think about it, there's no real guarantee Saddam could of handled things as well had the Shia in the South decide to launch an insurrection. I *think* he could of, based on the fact that he did do a good job of handling the problem in the aftermath of the First Gulf War, but then you never really know for sure about these things.
 
People who are dying in Iraq and Syria right now, aren't doing so not because of US Foreign policy, but because of ISIS, which was an organization that sprung out of the Arab Spring. And despite what we can say about the situation in Iraq, it's not like we've been bombing Syria prior to the rise of ISIS so some of the blame also rests with Assad and his military's capabilities. Come to think about it, there's no real guarantee Saddam could of handled things as well had the Shia in the South decide to launch an insurrection. I *think* he could of, based on the fact that he did do a good job of handling the problem in the aftermath of the First Gulf War, but then you never really know for sure about these things.

That's ridiculous. Had the US and other Western powers not interfered with president Assad's war on terror from the beginning, he would have crushed the terrorists operating in his country early on. But regime change in Syria, as with Libya, has been a long term US foreign policy ambition. Stop being gullible and patronising. US policy in the ME is destroying it. And the ideology of radical Islamic extremism, far predates the Arab Spring. Again, don't pedal such propaganda. The leaders that have been removed/neutralised in the region contained it however, and US policy has let that genie out of the bottle. Have fun putting it back in.
 
That's ridiculous. Had the US and other Western powers not interfered with president Assad's war on terror from the beginning, he would have crushed the terrorists operating in his country early on. But regime change in Syria, as with Libya, has been a long term US foreign policy ambition. Stop being gullible and patronising. US policy in the ME is destroying it. And the ideology of radical Islamic extremism, far predates the Arab Spring. Again, don't pedal such propaganda. The leaders that have been removed/neutralised in the region contained it however, and US policy has let that genie out of the bottle. Have fun putting it back in.


Mornin Monte. :2wave: I don't think they consider the Syrian MB a western power, nor are the Saud and those who follow them. Are they not responsible for the Civil uprisings and then the forcible change of removing Assad from power? Did they not use the US to get involved with aid and soft power. Plus have been influencing the US and others to keep up the pressure on Assad?

Didn't Clinton hold her Friends of Syria's Meetings in the Abu Dhabi and some more of the lavish establishments of the ME, to begin that process. While Johnny Quest McCain took pics with terrorists in the Free Syrian Army Rebels?
 
Mornin Monte. :2wave: I don't think they consider the Syrian MB a western power, nor are the Saud and those who follow them. Are they not responsible for the Civil uprisings and then the forcible change of removing Assad from power? Did they not use the US to get involved with aid and soft power. Plus have been influencing the US and others to keep up the pressure on Assad?

Didn't Clinton hold her Friends of Syria's Meetings in the Abu Dhabi and some more of the lavish establishments of the ME, to begin that process. While Johnny Quest McCain took pics with terrorists in the Free Syrian Army Rebels?

Neither do I, and they certainly were/are contributing to the rise of Islamic extremism. I've yet to figure out what its advantage is to them. And good morning to you as well MMC
 
That's ridiculous. Had the US and other Western powers not interfered with president Assad's war on terror from the beginning, he would have crushed the terrorists operating in his country early on. But regime change in Syria, as with Libya, has been a long term US foreign policy ambition. Stop being gullible and patronising. US policy in the ME is destroying it. And the ideology of radical Islamic extremism, far predates the Arab Spring. Again, don't pedal such propaganda. The leaders that have been removed/neutralised in the region contained it however, and US policy has let that genie out of the bottle. Have fun putting it back in.

Kind of denigrating the position of "president" when you refer to him as such don't you think? I don't recall the last time he was elected come to think about it. Also, the US didn't take the aggressive posture in the beginning. If you recall, one of the first big moves was that the EU voted to place an embargo on Syria.

Putting that side, I'm not gullible, I realize that it's been an aspiration of US Foreign Policy to remove guys like Hussein, Qaddafi, and Assad, and I've never tried to hide that fact. The issue at hand though is that you believe (as do many others so this isn't just you) that American Foreign Policy has always been about gaining more power and it's not. Best case scenario for the US isn't that we have a Soviet-style puppet, but that the people have the ability to determine the direction of their society. I should know, I use to believe as such. Because for the longest times I believed that if the people were granted power, real say in the direction of their governments, we'd have a more peaceful and prosperous world. Sadly, it's only after I've seen time after time where the people of the Middle East haven't gravitated toward secular or moderate governments (the lone exception being Tunisia I believe), but the more radical and dangerous ones. You can blame US Foreign Policy for being naive to be sure, but not for being malicious or evil.
 
Neither do I, and they certainly were/are contributing to the rise of Islamic extremism. I've yet to figure out what its advantage is to them. And good morning to you as well MMC

Its looking more and more like the sectarian divide.....even with Yemen going into civil war.

What I don't understand, was the giving of Hellfire Missiles and Heavy Equipment to Lebanon and Hizbollah. To me that is a major mistake. Even with ISIS opening up a front there.
 
Kind of denigrating the position of "president" when you refer to him as such don't you think? I don't recall the last time he was elected come to think about it. Also, the US didn't take the aggressive posture in the beginning. If you recall, one of the first big moves was that the EU voted to place an embargo on Syria.

Putting that side, I'm not gullible, I realize that it's been an aspiration of US Foreign Policy to remove guys like Hussein, Qaddafi, and Assad, and I've never tried to hide that fact. The issue at hand though is that you believe (as do many others so this isn't just you) that American Foreign Policy has always been about gaining more power and it's not. Best case scenario for the US isn't that we have a Soviet-style puppet, but that the people have the ability to determine the direction of their society. I should know, I use to believe as such. Because for the longest times I believed that if the people were granted power, real say in the direction of their governments, we'd have a more peaceful and prosperous world. Sadly, it's only after I've seen time after time where the people of the Middle East haven't gravitated toward secular or moderate governments (the lone exception being Tunisia I believe), but the more radical and dangerous ones. You can blame US Foreign Policy for being naive to be sure, but not for being malicious or

Why Quitting Is Sometimes the Right Thing to Do. From tiny Buddha
 
Its looking more and more like the sectarian divide.....even with Yemen going into civil war.

What I don't understand, was the giving of Hellfire Missiles and Heavy Equipment to Lebanon and Hizbollah. To me that is a major mistake. Even with ISIS opening up a front there.

It should be obvious that there are plenty of states and non states alike that are benefitting from a destabilised Middle East.
 

YOU FOUND MY BLOG!!!!

I don't think I've been able to get a bead on this but do you consider ISIS a long term strategic threat to the US if it continues to exist? And if so, do you really think that the current political actors in the region can accomplish defeating the outfit at this point without US cooperation?
 
It should be obvious that there are plenty of states and non states alike that are benefitting from a destabilised Middle East.

Well, just the other day someone was talking about the Kurds taking Mosul. That's not happening.

Plus, AQAP in Yemen has already upped their game and are going directly after the Shia. Which that does help the Saud and the Sunni. Doesn't it?
 
We've seem this type of sensationalism before. I wouldn't assume that just because "a tribal leader" said something, that it's true.

These people desperately want the US to fight their war for them, and they don't care about American lives or costs to the American taxpayer.
 
Well, the Tribal leader might be Right.




Between 20 and 25 ISIS fighters wearing Iraqi Army uniforms infiltrated al-Asad airbase Friday -- the sprawling western Iraqi base where 400 American forces are training Iraqi troops -- and tried to enter the base, military officials said. The ISIS fighters were killed as Iraqi forces repelled the attack, officials said, and no U.S. military service members were affected by the attack. A statement released by Combined Joint Task Force-Operation Inherent Resolve confirmed the attack.

Kirby confirmed that on Thursday ISIS fighters had taken over al-Baghdadi, a town located less than 10 miles from the base at al-Asad. ISIS fighters who had been besieging the town for months were able to make into the town on Thursday and take over the local Iraqi police station. The taking of al-Baghdadi was the first time in months that ISIS had gained ground in Iraq, where it has been in a defensive posture.....snip~

ISIS Fighters Attack Iraqi Base Wearing Iraqi Army Uniforms - ABC News

And the Shia Militias are a force of their own. Still on a Sunni killing rampage. Iraq will eventually split into 3 separate entities.
 
And the Shia Militias are a force of their own. Still on a Sunni killing rampage. Iraq will eventually split into 3 separate entities.

Mornin Janfu. :2wave: Iraq and Syria. I don't see how they will be able to stay together. Although I don't mind the Kurds getting their own piece of the ground out of it.
 
Mornin Janfu. :2wave: Iraq and Syria. I don't see how they will be able to stay together. Although I don't mind the Kurds getting their own piece of the ground out of it.
A great place for a NATO base. Right on top of the Stans and Iran.
And they have a good relationship with Turkey- and for now the Peshmerga do not get along to well with the PKK.

Here's A Map Of The Kurdish Nation - Business Insider
The Kurds in Iraq have actually expanded the total territory they control by 40% since ISIS took over Mosul. This has fueled fears in Iraq that Iraqi Kurdistan may declare itself a fully independent state.

Iraqi Kurdistan already runs itself in much the same way an independent nation would. It has its own armed forces, and it has been selling its own oil for half the price of what the rest of Iraq charges through a pipeline to the Turkish port of Ceyhan. It is estimated that the Kurdish region contains a quarter of all of Iraq's oil. That figure is likely an understatement now that the Kurds control Kirkuk — a key oil hub.

KRG, PKK make unlikely allies as they battle IS together - Al-Monitor: the Pulse of the Middle East
In the past three years, there have been political conflicts between the two biggest Kurdish political parties, the Kurdistan Workers Party (PKK), led by Abdulla Ocalan, and the Kurdistan Democratic Party (KDP), led by Masoud Barzani, over ruling Rojava and sharing power between their two affiliated parties; the pro-PKK Democratic Union Party (PYD) and the pro-KDP Kurdistan Democratic Party-Syria (KDP-S).
 
A great place for a NATO base. Right on top of the Stans and Iran.
And they have a good relationship with Turkey- and for now the Peshmerga do not get along to well with the PKK.

Here's A Map Of The Kurdish Nation - Business Insider
The Kurds in Iraq have actually expanded the total territory they control by 40% since ISIS took over Mosul. This has fueled fears in Iraq that Iraqi Kurdistan may declare itself a fully independent state.

Iraqi Kurdistan already runs itself in much the same way an independent nation would. It has its own armed forces, and it has been selling its own oil for half the price of what the rest of Iraq charges through a pipeline to the Turkish port of Ceyhan. It is estimated that the Kurdish region contains a quarter of all of Iraq's oil. That figure is likely an understatement now that the Kurds control Kirkuk — a key oil hub.

KRG, PKK make unlikely allies as they battle IS together - Al-Monitor: the Pulse of the Middle East
In the past three years, there have been political conflicts between the two biggest Kurdish political parties, the Kurdistan Workers Party (PKK), led by Abdulla Ocalan, and the Kurdistan Democratic Party (KDP), led by Masoud Barzani, over ruling Rojava and sharing power between their two affiliated parties; the pro-PKK Democratic Union Party (PYD) and the pro-KDP Kurdistan Democratic Party-Syria (KDP-S).



I don't know about a good relationship with Turkey.....but we wouldn't have to worry about getting stabbed in the back by them. If we did the Right thing and support them.
 
People who are dying in Iraq and Syria right now, aren't doing so not because of US Foreign policy, but because of ISIS, which was an organization that sprung out of the Arab Spring. And despite what we can say about the situation in Iraq, it's not like we've been bombing Syria prior to the rise of ISIS so some of the blame also rests with Assad and his military's capabilities. Come to think about it, there's no real guarantee Saddam could of handled things as well had the Shia in the South decide to launch an insurrection. I *think* he could of, based on the fact that he did do a good job of handling the problem in the aftermath of the First Gulf War, but then you never really know for sure about these things.
with due respect, ISIS came directly from AQI (a l-Qaeda in Iraq ) Baghdadi was even a part of AQI/AQIS..
I support going after ISIL or Da 'ish to use the derogatory Arabic term - But I find it difficult to pin the Arab Spring on this.
The Arab Spring started the protests in Syria, which "started"the Syrian Civil War, but not Da'ish..

Anyways.. we need another Awakening by the Sunni tribes to combat ISIL,
because they are stuck between Shia militias, and the Iraqi Army ,or giving comfort to ISIL..

Syria? I don't know how to solve it, except getting Iraq straightened out first..
and that looks worse every day - except for the Peshmerga
 
That's ridiculous. Had the US and other Western powers not interfered with president Assad's war on terror from the beginning, he would have crushed the terrorists operating in his country early on. But regime change in Syria, as with Libya, has been a long term US foreign policy ambition. Stop being gullible and patronising. US policy in the ME is destroying it. And the ideology of radical Islamic extremism, far predates the Arab Spring. Again, don't pedal such propaganda. The leaders that have been removed/neutralised in the region contained it however, and US policy has let that genie out of the bottle. Have fun putting it back in.
Libya is a "jihadist wonderland" ( Rand Paul) and NATO ( specifically France and Obama) decided on
"Gaddafi must go" which brought the unholy tribal and regional conflicts along with the Islamist, and the current 2 governments,and the
stopping of almost all oil ...etc.. (I won't go on in a longer run on sentence)..

If you want to track Libya -I keep a thread going here Libyan civil war? -the other board I post on
...that shows the constant devolving into that "jihadist wonderland"

Honestly I don't think the western influence in Syria was that great a deal though, in that Syria was going to happen
once the 'al-Nusra types' decide to try and go after Damascus..Hillary's "Friends of Syria" & Obama's "Assad must go" stupidity aside

It's a lot more complex in how it started in Syria then Libya at least.
 
I don't know about a good relationship with Turkey.....but we wouldn't have to worry about getting stabbed in the back by them. If we did the Right thing and support them.

They have a better relationship than the PKK does. Turkey wants oil- cheaper the better - And yes Turkey under their current Govt is being driven down the road to a Muslim / Religious State.
The press have been hounded, locked up, charged, found guilty in show trials.
Those that disagree with the Govt line, well not pretty.
There is presently no chance Turkey will be admitted to the EU due to the Govts actions. It is a one leader state. This fellow, Recep Tayyip Erdoğan served as PM, now as President. Normally a cermonial post, but he rules from there.

https://freedomhouse.org/report/freedom-press/2013/turkey
The Turkish authorities continued to use the penal code and an antiterrorism law to crack down on journalists and media outlets in 2012, leading Turkey to imprison more journalists than any other country in the world. According to the Committee to Protect Journalists (CPJ), 49 were behind bars as of December.

BBC News - Turkey arrests: Raids target Gulen-linked critics of Erdogan
Turkish police have made at least 23 arrests during raids on a newspaper and TV station with close ties to US-based Islamic cleric Fethullah Gulen.

Those detained are accused of forming an illegal organisation and trying to seize control of the state.
 
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