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George W. Bush Is Intervening in Iraq—Again

Fenton said:
His naivete is perpetuated by a generic hatred of this Country and a deep and unnatural obsession with our last President.
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Lol. Apparently you've missed my criticisms of the current president that you and your buddy both have a deep and unnatural obsession with.
 
MMC said:
They Beheaded 21 of them today V.....Sisi of Egypt will kill as many of them as he can, but then ISIS flapped their gums outloud again about conquering Rome. They have a habit of calling all Crusaders now. Wonder when they will start crying about the Godless and then the Djinnn that's going to be coming for their ass.

We really do need some out there messing with their heads and in the worse way.




A video purporting to show the mass beheading of Coptic Christian hostages has been released by militants in Libya claiming loyalty to the Islamic State group. The killings raise the possibility that the Islamic militant group — which controls about a third of Syria and Iraq in a self-declared caliphate — has established a direct affiliate less than 500 miles from the southern tip of Italy. One of the militants in the video, speaking English, makes direct reference to that possibility, saying the group now plans to "conquer Rome."

The Associated Press could not immediately independently verify the video. But the Egyptian government and the Coptic Church, which is based in Egypt, both declared it authentic.....snip~

Video purports to show IS militants beheading hostages

Oh, note the Associated Press came up with the thought of a raised possibility of ISIS having a direct affiliate in Libya? Just a mere possibility after 3 months of declaring themselves and Emirate and pledging an entire City to ISIS.

Just where has the ASSofCitation Been recently? Alternate Universe or something, huh?
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The Copts are one of the oldest Christian groups on earth. They have long been persecuted by Muslims, in fact in since the Muslim conquests. I noticed ISIS referred to Christians as crusaders-its clear what kind of war they believe they are fighting.

In retrospect, Obama's decision to mention the crusades a few weeks back seems particularly unwise-but then so does everything he does.

We need to kill ISIS. Thats the only way this nightmare ends.
 
Fenton said:
Oh really ??

" Saturday, at his impromptu press confrence before leaving for a family vacation on Martha’s Vineyard, President Barack Obama claimed that no U.S. troops were left in Iraq to help keep the peace because Iraq’s refusal to sign a status of forces agreement.

In October 2012 during the presidential debate, GOP candidate former Gov. Mitt Romney (R-MA) pushed the president on his decision to remove all troops.

Romney said, “There should have been a status of forces agreement,” Obama replied, “That’s not true, no.”

Obama added, “What I would not have done is left 10,000 Troops in Iraq that would tie us down.”

Obama 2012: No Troops In Iraq, No Status of Forces Agreement - Breitbart


It would seem he never had any intention of negotiating a status forces agreement
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According to government NIE's produced while Bush was still advancing his failed policies, he was exacerbating the terrorism problem and making the US less safe. So your ideas can be shelved.
 
Fearandloathing said:
Come on, be fair. The AP was there for the Benghazi hearings that 'cleared all that up'.

MMC, could this be people who maybe had some connection to the spontaneous demonstrators that killed four Americans? The people Hillary "liberated"?
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Every day there are more cases of Islamic violence. Every day the left pretends they dont exist.
 
Dittohead not! said:
and negotiated a troop withdrawal that Obama carried out.
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It was not to be a troop withdrawal. No planner believed US forces would depart altogether in 2011. GWB left office on 20 January 2009. The end point of treaty presence in Iraq was placed more than two years in the future in order to enable the next POTUS to negotiate his own terms. DoD's initial thought was 20,000 US personnel. (That was likely GWB's thought as well.) Over time, as BHO repeatedly signaled his lack of enthusiasm, that number was whittled down until, at the end, the Iraqis deemed the offer not worth the political risk. BHO then used Iraqi indifference as an excuse to leave; that was perhaps his objective from the beginning. BHO (and Biden) proclaimed victory and then abdicated their responsibility, and began the chain of events that has given rise to ISIS.
 
Fenton said:
Oh really ??

" Saturday, at his impromptu press confrence before leaving for a family vacation on Martha’s Vineyard, President Barack Obama claimed that no U.S. troops were left in Iraq to help keep the peace because Iraq’s refusal to sign a status of forces agreement.

In October 2012 during the presidential debate, GOP candidate former Gov. Mitt Romney (R-MA) pushed the president on his decision to remove all troops.

Romney said, “There should have been a status of forces agreement,” Obama replied, “That’s not true, no.”

Obama added, “What I would not have done is left 10,000 Troops in Iraq that would tie us down.”

Obama 2012: No Troops In Iraq, No Status of Forces Agreement - Breitbart


It would seem he never had any intention of negotiating a status forces agreement
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Yes, really:

The Obama administration originally "wanted 10,000 troops to remain in Iraq -- not combat troops, but military advisers, special operations forces, to watch the counterterrorism effort."
— Martha Raddatz on Sunday, August 24th, 2014 in comments on ABC's "This Week"
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Our ruling

Raddatz said the Obama administration originally "wanted 10,000 troops to remain in Iraq -- not combat troops, but military advisers, special operations forces, to watch the counterterrorism effort."

For a period, at least, the Obama administration did envision leaving 10,000 troops in Iraq past the Dec. 31, 2011, pullout of forces. That number went down to about 5,000 before negotiations stalled amid a legal snare over immunity of American forces in Iraqi courts.

Her claim is accurate but needs additional information. We rate her claim Mostly True.
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Once again, Obama carried out Bush's plan to withdraw. He then claimed credit for the troop withdrawal, and was roundly and justly criticized for having taken credit for Bush's accomplishment.

Of course, now that the troop withdrawal is seen in hindsight as a bad idea, it was all Obama's idea.
 
vesper said:
Oh dear Lord, how horrible. All because they were Arab Christians. The Coptic Church of Alexandria is the official name of the church in Egypt. It was founded by St Mark in 42 AD. The Muslim disdain for Christians in Egypt started in 620 AD when Mohammed waged war on Alexandria. 1,393 years later and the hatred still rages on.
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They are Christian but they don't consider themselves arabs. And the hatred and violence of Islam never stops. Even when the "moderate" Muslim brotherhood was in control, Copts were being persecuted and ancient churches were destroyed.
 
US Conservative said:
Every day there are more cases of Islamic violence. Every day the left pretends they dont exist.
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wtf, I've seen plenty on the left and right as well as policy papers by various foreign policy organisations, and the governments own NIE that point out that US policies in the ME for the past dozen years have exacerbated terrorist activities and Islamic extremism, and made the US less safe. What orbit are you in?
 
Montecresto said:
wtf, I've seen plenty on the left and right as well as policy papers by various foreign policy organisations, and the governments own NIE that point out that US policies in the ME for the past dozen years have exacerbated terrorist activities and Islamic extremism, and made the US less safe. What orbit are you in?
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That is, at best, a misleadingly oversimplified description. At worst it is a falsified description.
 
Fearandloathing said:
Is the Obama economy so bad people are without running water?
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Absolutely not. Plenty of streams are still running. However, the EPA and local health departments won't let anyone use streams for potable water anymore. It's better that you should die of thirst than a possible pathogen, however unlikely. Besides, you can get beer with an EBT card.
 
US Conservative said:
Every day there are more cases of Islamic violence. Every day the left pretends they dont exist.
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WASHINGTON, Sept. 23 — A stark assessment of terrorism trends by American intelligence agencies has found that the American invasion and occupation of Iraq has helped spawn a new generation of Islamic radicalism and that the overall terrorist threat has grown since the Sept. 11 attacks.

http://www.nytimes.com/2006/09/24/world/middleeast/24terror.html?pagewanted=all&_r=0


The war in Iraq has become a primary recruitment vehicle for violent Islamic extremists, motivating a new generation of potential terrorists around the world whose numbers may be increasing faster than the United States and its allies can reduce the threat, U.S. intelligence analysts have concluded.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2006/09/23/AR2006092301130.html
 
Montecresto said:
WASHINGTON, Sept. 23 — A stark assessment of terrorism trends by American intelligence agencies has found that the American invasion and occupation of Iraq has helped spawn a new generation of Islamic radicalism and that the overall terrorist threat has grown since the Sept. 11 attacks.

http://www.nytimes.com/2006/09/24/world/middleeast/24terror.html?pagewanted=all&_r=0


The war in Iraq has become a primary recruitment vehicle for violent Islamic extremists, motivating a new generation of potential terrorists around the world whose numbers may be increasing faster than the United States and its allies can reduce the threat, U.S. intelligence analysts have concluded.

Spy Agencies Say Iraq War Hurting U.S. Terror Fight
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From your link: ". . . Officials with knowledge of the intelligence estimate said it avoided specific judgments about the likelihood that terrorists would once again strike on United States soil. . . ."

1. No NIE can ever estimate how safe the US is because that would require assessment of US countermeasures -- out of bounds for an NIE.
2. By 2009 those terrorists in Iraq had been defeated.
 
Fearandloathing said:
If anything, Obama has shown a downright obsession with remaining on the right side of an issue. He will not change even when it is to his advantage.

You are correct. He cannot ever be seen in a negative light or having been wrong. On top of that he is way thin skinned...look at the dust up over Netanyahu...it's all about a two year old perceived insult.

This guy does not get over resentments.
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He's far too immature and spiteful to get over things and actually lead his nation.
Just what we need in a POTUS. :doh
 
US Conservative said:
They are Christian but they don't consider themselves arabs. And the hatred and violence of Islam never stops. Even when the "moderate" Muslim brotherhood was in control, Copts were being persecuted and ancient churches were destroyed.
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Yes the hatred of Christians and Jews in Egypt is nothing new. They would be found murdered, their homes, businesses and places of worship torched. And no one seemed to know who did it. As far as we know this group of Christians that were kidnapped in Libya could have been on a mission journey for all we know. It really isn't safe for any Western or Christian, Jew or a person from a country who is friends with the West to be traveling in that part of the world because they have a target on their backs. These people are sheer evil.
 
vesper said:
Yes the hatred of Christians and Jews in Egypt is nothing new. They would be found murdered, their homes, businesses and places of worship torched. And no one seemed to know who did it. As far as we know this group of Christians that were kidnapped in Libya could have been on a mission journey for all we know. It really isn't safe for any Western or Christian, Jew or a person from a country who is friends with the West to be traveling in that part of the world because they have a target on their backs. These people are sheer evil.
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This is why I want them dead-ISIS isn't something that can be reasoned with-their ideology is fundamentally at odds with western values, and life is cheap to them.

I dont want to see anyone killed-but they need to be.
 
Montecresto said:
I don't think there was ever any doubt that you'd disagree with anything less then military intervention in the ME. but you asked me for specifics, and you got some.
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I got one laughably naive argument-burying your head in the sand. Ironically ISIS also wants to bury your head in the sand.
 
US Conservative said:
This is why I want them dead-ISIS isn't something that can be reasoned with-their ideology is fundamentally at odds with western values, and life is cheap to them.

I dont want to see anyone killed-but they need to be.
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Well Jordan seems to be stepping up its game and I read where we are helping them with weaponry. At least that's something. But everywhere this administration has been involved in regard to terrorism, it has been a total disaster. Whether it be Libya, Egypt, Lebanon, Yemen, Pakistan, Iraq, Syria, Iran, Northern Africa, it has been nothing but total FAIL.
 
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