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Thread: Ceasefire agreed for eastern Ukraine after Minsk summit

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    Re: Ceasefire agreed for eastern Ukraine after Minsk summit

    Quote Originally Posted by face, your View Post
    Are your freaking serious? It was Russia that invaded the Ukraine and then backed mass murdering terrorists who turned Donetsk and Luhansk (which both have majority ethnic Ukrainian populations) into armed camps ruled by murder, kidnapping, rape, torture, and numerous other atrocities and pogroms against non-Russians.
    As far as I undertsand, the people of Donbass disagree with you.

    I've already posted the video here. Ukrainian journalists not so often dare to visit warzone in Donbass, but when they do some bad things happen.



    F*ing Ukrainians, f*ing "united Ukraine", we'll kill you right here and so on - all these words the journalists had to listen about themselves.

    In the beginning of the reportage journalists explains that as the locals find out they represent Ukrainian TV they were attacked immediately.

    https://www.youtube.com/results?sear...BD%D0%B8%D0%B5

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    Re: Ceasefire agreed for eastern Ukraine after Minsk summit

    Poroshenko calls for UN peacekeepers

    BBC
    18 February 2015

    President Petro Poroshenko has called for UN peacekeepers to be deployed to eastern Ukraine to enforce a ceasefire.
    Since the Minsk II ceasefire accord commenced on 14 February 2015, rebel forces have denied OSCE monitors access to the Debaltseve cauldron. The OSCE is the international agency tasked with monitoring compliance of the Minsk II Accord. Poroshenko actually would prefer to not make such a request, because a UN peacekeeping force could in theory include Russian or Russia-allied troops.

    At any rate, such a possibility is remote because Russia would probably veto any such UN action. The Russian ambassador to the UN, Vitaly Churkin, intimated that Ukraine appears to suffer from a “lack of determination” to fulfill the specifics of the Minsk II Accord. However, Mr. Churkin failed to address the issue of how the Minsk II Accord can be fulfilled when rebel forces deny access to the OSCE international monitors.


    Be polite, be professional, but have a plan to kill everybody you meet. -- Marine Corps General James 'Chaos' Mattis

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    Re: Ceasefire agreed for eastern Ukraine after Minsk summit

    "Send it to Poroshenko and his backers".

    British TV from Debaltsevo.


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    Re: Ceasefire agreed for eastern Ukraine after Minsk summit

    Right on cue...

    Russia rejects Ukraine UN peacekeeper plan

    February 19, 2015

    Russia and separatist rebels have rejected Ukraine's call for UN peacekeepers to monitor the tattered ceasefire, saying it would violate the Minsk accord. They argued the appeal, made late on Wednesday by Ukrainian President Petro Poroshenko, sought to "destroy" the UN-backed truce agreed under European mediation last week in the Belarus capital Minsk. But four days after coming into effect, that truce was already in tatters.

    This week, the rebels ignored it to storm a strategic town they had surrounded, Debaltseve, forcing thousands of government troops there to flee. The co-leader of the rebel's self-styled Donetsk republic, Denis Pushilin, flatly told the Interfax news agency that the appeal "is a violation ... of the Minsk agreements".
    The heights of hypocrisy ... do as I say, not as I do...

    Ukraine rebels disavow ceasefire at encircled town

    Reuters
    February 16, 2015

    Ukraine's rebels disavowed a new truce on Sunday hours after it took effect, saying it did not apply to the town where most fighting has taken place in recent weeks. The Organization for Security and Cooperation in Europe, responsible for monitoring the ceasefire, said rebels had denied its observers access to Debaltseve.


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    Re: Ceasefire agreed for eastern Ukraine after Minsk summit

    Drone footage published on 18 February 2015 of the Debaltseve cauldron showing the widespread destruction from heavy rebel artillery and Grad rocket barrages. There is no video commentary. The yellow letters on the screen are Ukrainian for ARMY SOS (a Ukrainian volunteer organization that raises funds for the ill-equipped Ukrainian forces). The town has been without electricity, gas, and running water for three weeks. 5,000 people remain, 21,000 fled or were evacuated to government-held towns to the north. The rebels violated the Minsk II Accord in order to capture Debaltseve yesterday.



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    Re: Ceasefire agreed for eastern Ukraine after Minsk summit

    Quote Originally Posted by Simpleχity View Post
    Drone footage published on 18 February 2015 of the Debaltseve cauldron showing the widespread destruction from heavy rebel artillery and Grad rocket barrages. There is no video commentary. The yellow letters on the screen are Ukrainian for ARMY SOS (a Ukrainian volunteer organization that raises funds for the ill-equipped Ukrainian forces). The town has been without electricity, gas, and running water for three weeks. 5,000 people remain, 21,000 fled or were evacuated to government-held towns to the north. The rebels violated the Minsk II Accord in order to capture Debaltseve yesterday.

    Ah, yes. You finally acknowledge that the Ukrainian troops were surrounded and in a "cauldron" and that was what the rebels told them at Minsk. Surrounded means that territory was under rebel control. The rebels offerred to allow the Ukrainian troops to retreat through a corridor without their arms. That would have been a good time for Poroshenko to say, "Good Idea, get the boys back to their mothers alive." Instead, he told them to fight. Poroshenko will personally bear the blame for the additional deaths resulting from his ignorance. This was stated on this board a week ago, so it is not a surprise to anyone. Only an unthinking, thoughtless, emotionless stooge could defend Poroshenko's actions.

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    Re: Ceasefire agreed for eastern Ukraine after Minsk summit

    Quote Originally Posted by Simpleχity View Post
    The town has been without electricity, gas, and running water for three weeks. 5,000 people remain, 21,000 fled or were evacuated to government-held towns to the north. The rebels violated the Minsk II Accord in order to capture Debaltseve yesterday.
    This highlights the tactic being employed in this region by the Russians. The numbers demographic doesn't currently doesn't work in their favour so no valid referendum can be staged until most of the majority ethnic Ukrainian populations are forced to flee either through terror or by making life so wretched for them that they leave of their own accord. We see the US use the very same tactic against the Palestinians via its Israeli proxies in the West bank. It takes time but it certainly works

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    Re: Ceasefire agreed for eastern Ukraine after Minsk summit

    Quote Originally Posted by flogger View Post
    This highlights the tactic being employed in this region by the Russians. The numbers demographic doesn't currently doesn't work in their favour so no valid referendum can be staged until most of the majority ethnic Ukrainian populations are forced to flee either through terror or by making life so wretched for them that they leave of their own accord. We see the US use the very same tactic against the Palestinians via its Israeli proxies in the West bank. It takes time but it certainly works
    Your comments about Donbass remain silly and ignorant. Unfortunatly you simply do not understand what you are talking about. It's impossible to force "ethnic Ukrainian population" to flee because noone can distinct Russians and Ukrainians, this is mixed in cultural and language sense population. If you know Russian (what I really doubt about) you would hear the words of old woman in the video above from Avdeyevka. She cries at Ukrainian journalists: "You say there are Russians (Russian troops) here! What Russians?! It's our children! Half of ours are in DPR (militia)!"

    Dear Flogger, Russians and Ukrainians are not the same as Israelis and Palestinians. I realise it's hard to understand for people who don't know anything about Russia and Ukraine, but just try to learn it.

    Here one more typical video from Donetsk. People are angry after one more shelling. First one man wishes Poroshenko and his son to die. Then a woman applies to Ukrainians and in Ukrainian language asks them to stop Ukrainian government. She says - they kill us, they kill out kids, stop them please and so on. Then another woman cries: "Let Zakharchenko kill all these bastards in the cauldron! Let them die!"

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-uA5pRNPwEg

    And I can easily find hundreds of such videos.

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    Re: Ceasefire agreed for eastern Ukraine after Minsk summit

    Quote Originally Posted by MrFirst View Post
    Your comments about Donbass remain silly and ignorant. Unfortunatly you simply do not understand what you are talking about. It's impossible to force "ethnic Ukrainian population" to flee because noone can distinct Russians and Ukrainians, this is mixed in cultural and language sense population. If you know Russian (what I really doubt about) you would hear the words of old woman in the video above from Avdeyevka. She cries at Ukrainian journalists: "You say there are Russians (Russian troops) here! What Russians?! It's our children! Half of ours are in DPR (militia)!"

    Dear Flogger, Russians and Ukrainians are not the same as Israelis and Palestinians. I realise it's hard to understand for people who don't know anything about Russia and Ukraine, but just try to learn it.

    Here one more typical video from Donetsk. People are angry after one more shelling. First one man wishes Poroshenko and his son to die. Then a woman applies to Ukrainians and in Ukrainian language asks them to stop Ukrainian government. She says - they kill us, they kill out kids, stop them please and so on. Then another woman cries: "Let Zakharchenko kill all these bastards in the cauldron! Let them die!"

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-uA5pRNPwEg

    And I can easily find hundreds of such videos.
    I've little to add to my previous post. You guys know what you are doing and nobody from either side would be screaming at anybody in videos were it not for Russian interference in Ukrainian internal affairs

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    Re: Ceasefire agreed for eastern Ukraine after Minsk summit

    Quote Originally Posted by flogger View Post
    This highlights the tactic being employed in this region by the Russians. The numbers demographic doesn't currently doesn't work in their favour so no valid referendum can be staged until most of the majority ethnic Ukrainian populations are forced to flee either through terror or by making life so wretched for them that they leave of their own accord. We see the US use the very same tactic against the Palestinians via its Israeli proxies in the West bank. It takes time but it certainly works
    Very good points, and a valid comparison. I would not be surprised if Russia or their proxies siezes the vacated homes and offers them to Russian cossack "settlers" as part of a veterans benefits package.

    Various reble groups in Donetsk have toyed with the idea after most of the university staff sided with Kiev and left. (Some did so early on. Others did so only after armed rebels entered the campus demanded that they be awarded "law degrees"), but did not actually sieze the vacated homes- yet.

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