Page 69 of 87 FirstFirst ... 1959676869707179 ... LastLast
Results 681 to 690 of 869

Thread: Ala Chief Justice Tells Judges: Refuse Gay Marriage Licenses[W:344,535,718]

  1. #681
    Sage
    roguenuke's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Location
    Raleigh, NC
    Last Seen
    Yesterday @ 06:42 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Moderate
    Posts
    29,054

    Re: Ala Chief Justice Tells Judges: Refuse Gay Marriage Licenses

    Quote Originally Posted by Anthony60 View Post
    I don't see it that way at all. Recognize my rights or not, I still have them, no one can truly take them away. They can oppress them, stifle them, and abridge them, but you can't ever take them. Because you didn't give them to me.
    No one gives them to you. They are a concept humans invented based mainly on what we as a collective view as fair. This is why they are recognized and can be different for different groups of people depending on what governs those people.
    "A woman is like a teabag, you never know how strong she is until she gets in hot water." - Eleanor Roosevelt

    Keep your religion out of other people's marriages.

  2. #682
    Sage
    Taylor's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2009
    Location
    US
    Last Seen
    Yesterday @ 10:39 PM
    Lean
    Undisclosed
    Posts
    6,170

    Re: Ala Chief Justice Tells Judges: Refuse Gay Marriage Licenses

    Quote Originally Posted by roguenuke View Post
    They should have the right to get married recognized because they have a right to equal protection of the laws.
    But that is (currently) not recognized in most of Alabama.

  3. #683
    I'm kind of a big deal

    AGENT J's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2010
    Location
    Pittsburgh
    Last Seen
    Today @ 01:38 AM
    Gender
    Lean
    Independent
    Posts
    44,835

    Re: Ala Chief Justice Tells Judges: Refuse Gay Marriage Licenses

    Quote Originally Posted by Gaius46 View Post
    Actually the reason libertarians like states' rights is because it pushes the decision making closer to those who have to live with the consequences of those decisions and allows people to set up communities that accord with their beliefs and desires - within the bounds of the Constitution.

    Additionally we like states rights because it allows for variability and allows us to "vote with our feet" if we happen to not like the society that the laws of the state we're living in create. It essentially fosters competition.
    states rights/powers are awesome by me as long as they stay in that bolded part . . . .
    when it comes to banning gay rights they overstepped and now the fed is fixing it, protecting the constitution and individual rights
    This space is currently owned by The Great Winchester, stay tuned for future messages!
    Make America Great Again!
    Pro-Equal Rights / Pro-Gun Rights / Pro-Human Rights / Pro-Choice

  4. #684
    Bat Chain Puller
    beefheart's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2013
    Location
    The burning sands of the desert southwest.
    Last Seen
    Today @ 01:37 AM
    Gender
    Lean
    Moderate
    Posts
    19,371

    Re: Ala Chief Justice Tells Judges: Refuse Gay Marriage Licenses

    Quote Originally Posted by Anthony60 View Post
    Well, let's cut to the chase. Why do you need proof, and what would this proof be?

    And why don't you try and support your position, in some small way, by clarifying where my rights come from? Who is giving me my rights, why do they have them, and do I get to give them rights too?

    I guess you disagree with this quote...

    “We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness.--That to secure these rights, Governments are instituted among Men, deriving their just powers from the consent of the governed…”

    Is that familiar to you? Please go ahead and tell us why these people were wrong.
    Why? Because guys like Roy Moore seem to want to structure the government around the so called god given rights.

    You really can't address this can you? How do you know that we have rights granted to us by god?

    Yeah, it is in the Declaration of Independence. But......proof. It is so easy to say that we have god given rights....but that is just a person saying it.

    Get the big guy upstairs to clarify, otherwise it is just words.

    BTW, when that was written, were slaves part of that "all men created equal" language?
    Last edited by beefheart; 02-13-15 at 06:54 PM.
    "Those who do not remember the past are condemned to repeat it." George Santayana

  5. #685
    Sage
    Hicup's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Location
    Rochester, NY
    Last Seen
    12-07-17 @ 03:18 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Very Conservative
    Posts
    7,846

    Re: Ala Chief Justice Tells Judges: Refuse Gay Marriage Licenses

    Quote Originally Posted by roguenuke View Post
    In our country the US Constitution is the. Main law of the land. It limits government from being able to limit what we can do by requiring that laws that are challenged claiming a violation of our rights for the most part have to be shown by the government to further some state interest.

    Plus, you need to recheck your information. Four states voted on same sex marriage with different results, three voting it in, and the fourth voting down a state amendment, which allowed the states legislature to enact it.
    Ok, but here's where you run into trouble for your statement. The 14th isn't just some one size fits all amendment, there are degrees of what the government must show. In this case, it has been established, even by Walker that SSM requires rational basis, and it has been shown, regardless of whether you agree, that by states amending their constitutions to place limits on marriage, they are by definition rational on their face. Walker didn't like that, even though he knew it, so what he did was invent gender as the basis for SSM, not sexuality. The lawyers in opposition, and since in many court cases have followed the Prop 8 guide and have argued rational basis. How this reflects upon your statement that people are afforded rights by collective compromise seems to be inconsistent with the way this is all playing out. It doesn't seem like there's any compromising going on, instead we have judges changing laws, laws voted on by the people, not because of tyranny of the will of the people, but because they simply don't like them.

    Judges are writing law in America today, and to do so, they're changing the perception of the argument, by ignoring that the petitioners are petitioning not based on their gender, but on the basis of their sexual orientation. By invoking gender (Of which those against Prop 8 did not even argue in any of their briefs but Walker gifted them) Walker created a distinction without a distinction for the sake of raising the level of scrutiny to be considered by the court. That is NOT compromise, it isn't a collective, in fact, what Walker and seemingly every single judge thereafter has done, is effectively ignore the process by which rights are afforded, and or limited in the US, by manipulating the level of review. The real question that needs to be answered is: What is the nature of the SSM debate, and how should it be reviewed, and viewed by not only our judges, but by its citizens, and leaders?


    Tim-
    “When buying and selling are controlled by legislation, the first things to be bought and sold are legislators.” - P. J. O’Rourke
    “Socialism is great until you run out of someone elses money” Margaret Thatcher

  6. #686
    Guru

    Join Date
    Jul 2013
    Last Seen
    07-04-15 @ 04:17 PM
    Lean
    Undisclosed
    Posts
    3,032

    Re: Ala Chief Justice Tells Judges: Refuse Gay Marriage Licenses

    what Walker found was the state had no compelling interest to ban same sex marriage. There was no argument against it that held up. And thus, equal protection kicks in.

  7. #687
    Sage
    chromium's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2013
    Location
    A2
    Last Seen
    06-05-17 @ 10:53 AM
    Gender
    Lean
    Undisclosed
    Posts
    16,968

    Re: Ala Chief Justice Tells Judges: Refuse Gay Marriage Licenses

    Quote Originally Posted by Taylor View Post
    I wasn't asking about equality as a principle, I asked specifically about the issue at hand, state recognition of marriage.
    One follows from the other

  8. #688
    Sage
    chromium's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2013
    Location
    A2
    Last Seen
    06-05-17 @ 10:53 AM
    Gender
    Lean
    Undisclosed
    Posts
    16,968

    re: Ala Chief Justice Tells Judges: Refuse Gay Marriage Licenses[W:344,535,718]

    Quote Originally Posted by Taylor View Post
    What does an order forcing a single judge working in an executive role in issuing a marriage license to a single couple have to do with showing that "federal court rulings are not binding on state courts?"
    It's what he said. Stop pretending that he didn't say that the federal judge and indeed the supreme court has no authority over the state's marriage laws

  9. #689
    Sage
    chromium's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2013
    Location
    A2
    Last Seen
    06-05-17 @ 10:53 AM
    Gender
    Lean
    Undisclosed
    Posts
    16,968

    re: Ala Chief Justice Tells Judges: Refuse Gay Marriage Licenses[W:344,535,718]

    Quote Originally Posted by Taylor View Post
    My bad, the order only forces a single judge to issue marriage licenses to four couples.
    Could you possibly be more dense

    "It is ORDERED and DECLARED that ALA CONST ART. I, § 36.03 (2006) and ALA . CODE 1975 § 30-1-19 are unconstitutional because they violate the Due Process Clause and the Equal Protection Clause of the Fourteenth Amendment. "

    Yes, the law is unconstitutional, therefore any judge or state legislator violating that law is doing so illegally and will be held accountable. That's it!

  10. #690
    Sage
    chromium's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2013
    Location
    A2
    Last Seen
    06-05-17 @ 10:53 AM
    Gender
    Lean
    Undisclosed
    Posts
    16,968

    Re: Ala Chief Justice Tells Judges: Refuse Gay Marriage Licenses

    Quote Originally Posted by Hicup View Post
    Interesting, and I agree, however, who gets to recognize them, and why do they get to do so? It's hard, given your position on gay rights, to deny that in every state that has voted on gay rights specifically, they have been denied the privilege of equal marriage. Yet, it puzzles me how you reconcile the decision of one, or maybe a three person panel of other opinions, over that of an entire collective people? What we have here in Alabama, and in every other state where SSM is now recognized, when it all comes down to it, is a small percentage of people deciding the fate of a very large number of people that oppose their opinions. Doesn't sound like compromise to me, does it to you? Some say, well the will of the majority should not oppress the will of the minority, however, we both know that this really is a play-on-words for the mostly uneducated among us. We have a foundation ingrained in our society we call the constitution which affords states the right, and responsibility to govern themselves. We have a challenge by a small minority to attain special, otherwise previously unrealized rights that are not specifically enumerated within the context of the constitution. It appears we have contradicting amendments, and a disagreement about the kind of rights being sought and how they apply.

    Seems one Federal judge is telling everyone what their rights now are.

    Again, how do YOU, Rogue reconcile what you just said quoted above, with this current brush up?

    Tim-
    Dude like 60% of the country now approves of SSM being legal *nationwide*. Stop hiding behind voter ballots from 2008 or pretending that alabama has more in common with NY than it does with russia. It may be a part of the US, but this is the land of "segregation forever", after all. Jumping to their defense, especially when they violate that constitution, does not impress anyone worth impressing

Page 69 of 87 FirstFirst ... 1959676869707179 ... LastLast

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •