Page 35 of 87 FirstFirst ... 2533343536374585 ... LastLast
Results 341 to 350 of 869

Thread: Ala Chief Justice Tells Judges: Refuse Gay Marriage Licenses[W:344,535,718]

  1. #341
    Sage

    Join Date
    Jun 2011
    Last Seen
    10-28-17 @ 06:19 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Slightly Liberal
    Posts
    15,248

    Re: Ala Chief Justice Tells Judges: Refuse Gay Marriage Licenses

    Quote Originally Posted by Sherman123 View Post
    On what basis do you think a US District Court's ruling on a federal question, that has been exhausted through the appellate process, is not binding?
    I'm anxiously awaiting the answer to this one. It should be a doozy.
    "Groups with guitars are on the way out, Mr. Epstein"

    Dick Rowe, A & R man
    Decca Records
    London, 1962

  2. #342
    Guru
    WorldWatcher's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2013
    Last Seen
    Today @ 11:37 AM
    Gender
    Lean
    Independent
    Posts
    3,041

    Re: Ala Chief Justice Tells Judges: Refuse Gay Marriage Licenses

    Quote Originally Posted by Taylor View Post
    Nobody has claimed otherwise.



    Yes, I mentioned this above. Probate judges are not currently required to issue licenses to same-sex couples (in fact, the opposite) but that could change starting Thursday.

    Judges have to be named individually as defendents and an order made. But... there's still the possibility that the law will differ across the state because Justice Granade's decision is non-binding.

    Actually no. In the original order the Constitutiona amendment was invalidated, therefore there is no basis for selective issuing of licenses. (https://docs.google.com/viewer?url=h...-and-order.pdf)

    Then in the clarifying order issued just a couple of days later Judge Granade reiterates from Judge Hinkle's ruling: "And a clerk who chooses not to follow the ruling should take note: the governing statutes and rules of procedure allow individuals to intervene as plaintiffs in pending actions, allow certification of plaintiff and defendant classes, allow issuance of successive preliminary injunctions, and allow successful plaintiffs to recover costs and attorney's fees." (1:14-cv-00208 #65 Order Clarifying Judgment)

    Judge Granade has already granted the motion to amend the original proceeding to add three new same-sex couples to the complaint and add Probate Judge Don Davis in his official capacity as a defendant. (https://www.documentcloud.org/docume...r-2-10-15.html) So not only will a writ of mandamus require him to issue the licenses (hearing Thursday, expect a ruling Friday on the emergency action) he could be required to pay costs and attorneys fees for those needing to bring the action.


    >>>>

  3. #343
    Guru
    WorldWatcher's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2013
    Last Seen
    Today @ 11:37 AM
    Gender
    Lean
    Independent
    Posts
    3,041

    Re: Ala Chief Justice Tells Judges: Refuse Gay Marriage Licenses

    Quote Originally Posted by Sherman123 View Post
    On what basis do you think a US District Court's ruling on a federal question, that has been exhausted through the appellate process, is not binding?

    Technically speaking the appellate process hasn't been exhausted.

    Both the 11th Circuit and the SCOTUS declined a stay, but the appellate process (i.e. a ruling on the merits of the case) is actually being held in abeyance at the 11th Circuit pending a ruling by the SCOTUS on the case from the 6th Circuit.


    >>>>

  4. #344
    Global Moderator
    Moderator

    Gina's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2010
    Last Seen
    Today @ 01:46 AM
    Gender
    Lean
    Liberal
    Posts
    31,892

    Re: Ala Chief Justice Tells Judges: Refuse Gay Marriage Licenses

    Moderator's Warning:
    Ala Chief Justice Tells Judges: Refuse Gay Marriage Licenses[W:344,535,718]Getting a little hot in here. Please chill out and refrain from making personal comments, baiting and flaming. The topic is not each other or other posters.
    I don't attack my constituents. Bob is my constituent now.
    This is the important stuff. We canít get lost in discrimination. We canít get lost in B.S. We canít get lost tearing each other down. I want to make a point here that no matter what you look like, where you come from, how you worship, who you love, how you identify, and yeah, how you run, that if you have good public policy ideas, if you are well qualified for office, bring those ideas to the table, because this is your America, too. This is our commonwealth of Virginia, too.
    Danica Roem - The nation's first openly transgender person elected to serve in a U.S. state legislature.

  5. #345
    Sage
    Taylor's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2009
    Location
    US
    Last Seen
    Today @ 09:15 AM
    Lean
    Undisclosed
    Posts
    6,170

    Re: Ala Chief Justice Tells Judges: Refuse Gay Marriage Licenses

    Quote Originally Posted by Sherman123 View Post
    Roy Moore is advancing a pseudo form of legal departmentalism that has been a discredited and dead theory for at least a half century if not much longer. The notion that the Alabama state courts are just as competent to interpret the Constitution (the point Moore rests his position on) has been a dead letter since Brown v. Board.
    That's just wrong. Last I read, the vast majority of states have existing law that differs from the federal precedent. This continues to occur as recently as a couple of years ago.


    Quote Originally Posted by Sherman123 View Post
    This was a federal question which a Federal court clearly had subject matter jurisdiction over, that district court made a ruling on which is absolutely binding, all appellate attempts by the state were exhausted without the order being overturned.
    District court rulings are not binding. Sorry. Higher courts did not consider whether or not to overturn the ruling, just whether or not to stay.

    Quote Originally Posted by Sherman123 View Post
    only question left is whether or not the district court by virtue of binding the 'attorney general' left an opening for Moore to assert his authority over the probate judges and deny the issuance of licenses. He will almost certainly lose this fight--federal courts do not take challenges to their authority lightly.
    Moore has that right regardless of what happens. Had the governor not refused to enforce Moore's order to not issuelicenses to same sex couples, probate judges would have been in a "damned if you do, rammed if you don't" position that could only be resolved by the Supreme Court.

  6. #346
    Sage
    Sherman123's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2012
    Location
    Northeast US
    Last Seen
    11-23-17 @ 11:12 AM
    Gender
    Lean
    Undisclosed
    Posts
    7,774

    Re: Ala Chief Justice Tells Judges: Refuse Gay Marriage Licenses

    Quote Originally Posted by WorldWatcher View Post
    Technically speaking the appellate process hasn't been exhausted.

    Both the 11th Circuit and the SCOTUS declined a stay, but the appellate process (i.e. a ruling on the merits of the case) is actually being held in abeyance at the 11th Circuit pending a ruling by the SCOTUS on the case from the 6th Circuit.


    >>>>
    You haven't answered my question. Secondly by the 'appellate process' I clearly meant the possible avenues for stopping the enforcement of the ruling. Those avenues have been exhausted. Refusing to stay the decision specifically thwarts the state from 'waiting' until the Supreme Court makes its ruling this spring.

  7. #347
    Politically Correct

    Join Date
    Oct 2010
    Last Seen
    Today @ 11:33 AM
    Lean
    Other
    Posts
    2,850
    Blog Entries
    8

    Re: Ala Chief Justice Tells Judges: Refuse Gay Marriage Licenses

    Quote Originally Posted by chromium View Post
    It's the same RR extremist who got ****canned after putting the "10 commandments" statue in the courthouse way back in 2001. Despite that, alabama voters elected him to the *same position* in 2013, and he will be ****canned yet again for this.
    How has he not been disbarred? That's what I want to know.
    (avatar by Thomas Nast)

  8. #348
    Sage
    Taylor's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2009
    Location
    US
    Last Seen
    Today @ 09:15 AM
    Lean
    Undisclosed
    Posts
    6,170

    Re: Ala Chief Justice Tells Judges: Refuse Gay Marriage Licenses

    Quote Originally Posted by Wiggen View Post
    I'm anxiously awaiting the answer to this one. It should be a doozy.
    Already answered, and hardly a "doozy" - it's just a simple fact that district court decisions are not binding on state courts.

  9. #349
    Sage
    Taylor's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2009
    Location
    US
    Last Seen
    Today @ 09:15 AM
    Lean
    Undisclosed
    Posts
    6,170

    Re: Ala Chief Justice Tells Judges: Refuse Gay Marriage Licenses

    Quote Originally Posted by WorldWatcher View Post
    Actually no. In the original order the Constitutiona amendment was invalidated, therefore there is no basis for selective issuing of licenses. (https://docs.google.com/viewer?url=h...-and-order.pdf)

    Then in the clarifying order issued just a couple of days later Judge Granade reiterates from Judge Hinkle's ruling: "And a clerk who chooses not to follow the ruling should take note: the governing statutes and rules of procedure allow individuals to intervene as plaintiffs in pending actions, allow certification of plaintiff and defendant classes, allow issuance of successive preliminary injunctions, and allow successful plaintiffs to recover costs and attorney's fees." (1:14-cv-00208 #65 Order Clarifying Judgment)

    Judge Granade has already granted the motion to amend the original proceeding to add three new same-sex couples to the complaint and add Probate Judge Don Davis in his official capacity as a defendant. (https://www.documentcloud.org/docume...r-2-10-15.html) So not only will a writ of mandamus require him to issue the licenses (hearing Thursday, expect a ruling Friday on the emergency action) he could be required to pay costs and attorneys fees for those needing to bring the action.


    >>>>
    This is a district court case. There is more than one district in the state. Justices in other districts need not comply with this ruling as it is non-binding.

  10. #350
    Sage
    Taylor's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2009
    Location
    US
    Last Seen
    Today @ 09:15 AM
    Lean
    Undisclosed
    Posts
    6,170

    Re: Ala Chief Justice Tells Judges: Refuse Gay Marriage Licenses

    Quote Originally Posted by Sherman123 View Post
    On what basis do you think a US District Court's ruling on a federal question, that has been exhausted through the appellate process, is not binding?
    The case hasn't been "exhausted through the appellate process" - I don't think you understand what's going on.

Page 35 of 87 FirstFirst ... 2533343536374585 ... LastLast

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •