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Thread: In unison, Muslim clerics lash out against Islamic State

  1. #141
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    Re: In unison, Muslim clerics lash out against Islamic State

    Quote Originally Posted by apdst View Post
    I don't care what they do there, either. But, they want to take their show on the road and make it international. The only way to stop that, is to kill'em all.
    Or at least kill enough of them so that they stop taking it on the road. But I'm willing to entertain ANY way that effectively keeps their road show from hitting the road.
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    Re: In unison, Muslim clerics lash out against Islamic State

    Quote Originally Posted by Navy Pride View Post
    Its about ****ing time!!!!!!!!


    In unison, Muslim clerics lash out against Islamic State


    BAGHDAD (AP) — The immolation of a Jordanian pilot by the Islamic State group has brought a unified outcry Friday from top religious clerics across the Muslim world — including a prominent jihadi preacher — who insisted the militants have gone too far.
    This has been happening all along, all one ever needed to do was watch the news in your hotel room in Delhi or Rio, for whatever reason, US media hasn't paid much attention to it. Glad to see this making headlines here now.
    Killing one person is murder, killing 100,000 is foreign policy

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    Re: In unison, Muslim clerics lash out against Islamic State

    Quote Originally Posted by eohrnberger View Post
    Or at least kill enough of them so that they stop taking it on the road. But I'm willing to entertain ANY way that effectively keeps their road show from hitting the road.
    No your not. You'd have to stop supporting US military interventions as well as covert interferences. Something you're not willing to do, so watch for more of the "road show"!
    Killing one person is murder, killing 100,000 is foreign policy

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    Re: In unison, Muslim clerics lash out against Islamic State

    Quote Originally Posted by Montecresto View Post
    No your not. You'd have to stop supporting US military interventions as well as covert interferences. Something you're not willing to do, so watch for more of the "road show"!
    We've tried appeasement It didn't ork.
    What military response was there to the first World Trade Center bombing?
    What military response was there to the USS Cole bombing?
    What military response was there when Hezbollah bombed our Marine Baracks in Lebanon?

    No, you are failing to realize and come to grips with the fact that
    "Islamic terrorists do not need an excuse to attack the United States, to attack us is what they do, they attack us for what we are."
    Senator Tom Cotton.

    Instead, it's some sort of law enforcement matter, which is sure to make the Militant Islamic Fundamentalists laugh at us and our silly notions. No, I'm thinking that we need to stand shoulder to shoulder with Jordan and others of similar mind.

    But still. If you've got such a sure fire, guaranteed idea that will stop the Militant Islamic Fundamentalists from attacking the Western peoples for who they are, I'm willing to listen.

    I think you are sadly mistaken to think that US military interventions as well as covert interferences are what motivates the the Militant Islamic Fundamentalists into attacking the West and western peoples. Not when part of their core belief system is to spread their version of Islam across the planet, and enforce Sharia law on all peoples, subjugating them by force.
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    Re: In unison, Muslim clerics lash out against Islamic State

    Quote Originally Posted by eohrnberger View Post
    We've tried appeasement It didn't ork.
    What military response was there to the first World Trade Center bombing?
    What military response was there to the USS Cole bombing?
    What military response was there when Hezbollah bombed our Marine Baracks in Lebanon?

    No, you are failing to realize and come to grips with the fact that
    "Islamic terrorists do not need an excuse to attack the United States, to attack us is what they do, they attack us for what we are."
    Senator Tom Cotton.

    Instead, it's some sort of law enforcement matter, which is sure to make the Militant Islamic Fundamentalists laugh at us and our silly notions. No, I'm thinking that we need to stand shoulder to shoulder with Jordan and others of similar mind.

    But still. If you've got such a sure fire, guaranteed idea that will stop the Militant Islamic Fundamentalists from attacking the Western peoples for who they are, I'm willing to listen.

    I think you are sadly mistaken to think that US military interventions as well as covert interferences are what motivates the the Militant Islamic Fundamentalists into attacking the West and western peoples. Not when part of their core belief system is to spread their version of Islam across the planet, and enforce Sharia law on all peoples, subjugating them by force.
    Mischaracterising my position won't advance our discussion. I'm no supporter of appeasement, so long as our policies don't provoke and encourage bad behavior. Furthermore, there's never been a question of what Islamic extremists ambitions are, at least for me there's not. I readily accept that they would love to see their caliphate and the imposition of sharia globally I suppose and not just in their region. Listen carefully as I articulate for the umpteenth time my concerns. Before the invasion of A-Stan, and the removal of strong figures such as Hussein, Mubarak, Gaddafi and Assad, these extremists kept a very low profile and had no way of ever even hoping to realise those ambitions. Neither of those aforementioned leaders gave any quarters to them. They dwelt in the shadows where it was difficult to galvanise, organise and do that much, with only limited successes. That's all gone now, and in the power vacuums left in the wake, they are operational in the light of day. And the state of affairs in the Middle East, have never been worse in my lifetime. I understand that your not going to accept responsibility for this, but it doesn't change the fact that USFP for decades now has been a failure in the ME. Hopefully someone who thinks like Ron Paul (on FP, before you jump me on that) will win the reigns to the WH some day.
    Killing one person is murder, killing 100,000 is foreign policy

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    Re: In unison, Muslim clerics lash out against Islamic State

    Quote Originally Posted by Montecresto View Post
    Mischaracterising my position won't advance our discussion. I'm no supporter of appeasement, so long as our policies don't provoke and encourage bad behavior. Furthermore, there's never been a question of what Islamic extremists ambitions are, at least for me there's not. I readily accept that they would love to see their caliphate and the imposition of sharia globally I suppose and not just in their region. Listen carefully as I articulate for the umpteenth time my concerns. Before the invasion of A-Stan, and the removal of strong figures such as Hussein, Mubarak, Gaddafi and Assad, these extremists kept a very low profile and had no way of ever even hoping to realise those ambitions. Neither of those aforementioned leaders gave any quarters to them. They dwelt in the shadows where it was difficult to galvanise, organise and do that much, with only limited successes. That's all gone now, and in the power vacuums left in the wake, they are operational in the light of day. And the state of affairs in the Middle East, have never been worse in my lifetime. I understand that your not going to accept responsibility for this, but it doesn't change the fact that USFP for decades now has been a failure in the ME. Hopefully someone who thinks like Ron Paul (on FP, before you jump me on that) will win the reigns to the WH some day.
    OK.

    Would you agree that without US leadership and involvement, the battle against ISIS and Militant Islamic Fundamentalists would be operating at a reduced capacity and a reduced effectiveness?

    Would you agree that without US leadership and involvement, the chances of this aggression against the West would be further emboldened?

    Would you agree that without US leadership and involvement, the chances of ISIS and Militant Islamic Fundamentalism arriving at US shores is increased rather than decreased?

    If not, and I suspect so, why?
    the Fix-is-in Bureau of Investigation

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    Re: In unison, Muslim clerics lash out against Islamic State

    Quote Originally Posted by eohrnberger View Post
    OK.

    Would you agree that without US leadership and involvement, the battle against ISIS and Militant Islamic Fundamentalists would be operating at a reduced capacity and a reduced effectiveness?

    Would you agree that without US leadership and involvement, the chances of this aggression against the West would be further emboldened?

    Would you agree that without US leadership and involvement, the chances of ISIS and Militant Islamic Fundamentalism arriving at US shores is increased rather than decreased?

    If not, and I suspect so, why?
    Dude, do you think that making me repeat myself is how you advance or win debate. The answers to those three questions, are in my post you quoted, I need do no more than repost it to answer you, but why is that necessary. Even a government NIE concludes that US policy in the ME, is EXACERBATING AND RADICALISING ISLAMIC EXTREMISTS. No, hell no, I do not believe US leadership in the Middle East is improving anything, it seems that mostly just gullible Americans in denial think we've been doing a bang up job in the Middle East.
    Killing one person is murder, killing 100,000 is foreign policy

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    Re: In unison, Muslim clerics lash out against Islamic State

    Quote Originally Posted by Montecresto View Post
    Dude, do you think that making me repeat myself is how you advance or win debate. The answers to those three questions, are in my post you quoted, I need do no more than repost it to answer you, but why is that necessary. Even a government NIE concludes that US policy in the ME, is EXACERBATING AND RADICALISING ISLAMIC EXTREMISTS. No, hell no, I do not believe US leadership in the Middle East is improving anything, it seems that mostly just gullible Americans in denial think we've been doing a bang up job in the Middle East.
    A bang up job? No.

    At least not since Obama came to office and all he wanted to do was get out by any means necessary as quickly as possible, regardless of the realities of the situation on the ground, typical 'realities be damned, politics demands it' from Obama.

    At the ending of the Bush administration, there was a reasonably stable Iraq and Afghanistan, now, both are spiraling into chaos.

    So letting the cancer fester even deeper and spread even wider is the best idea from you? Not thinking that's really such a good idea, and you've still not explained WHY, or put forth citations demonstrating and documenting such (or have I missed them? I'm willing to go back if you give me a pointer).

    From where I sit, I'm not seeing very many good options here as to forward progress.
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    Re: In unison, Muslim clerics lash out against Islamic State

    Quote Originally Posted by eohrnberger View Post
    A bang up job? No.

    At least not since Obama came to office and all he wanted to do was get out by any means necessary as quickly as possible, regardless of the realities of the situation on the ground, typical 'realities be damned, politics demands it' from Obama.

    At the ending of the Bush administration, there was a reasonably stable Iraq and Afghanistan, now, both are spiraling into chaos.

    So letting the cancer fester even deeper and spread even wider is the best idea from you? Not thinking that's really such a good idea, and you've still not explained WHY, or put forth citations demonstrating and documenting such (or have I missed them? I'm willing to go back if you give me a pointer).

    From where I sit, I'm not seeing very many good options here as to forward progress.
    I would think that a complete reversal of the policy of intervention, interference and military hostilities is a good place to start.
    Killing one person is murder, killing 100,000 is foreign policy

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    Re: In unison, Muslim clerics lash out against Islamic State

    Quote Originally Posted by Montecresto View Post
    I would think that a complete reversal of the policy of intervention, interference and military hostilities is a good place to start.
    So what would that accomplish? Except to further embolden the Militant Islamic Fundamentalists?
    They predicted that they'd win this fight because the US was soft and lacked political will.
    Wouldn't backing off, such as you are suggesting, be exactly that?

    Maybe it's better if we wait until they start crossing the Southern and Northern boarders en-mass?
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