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Thread: Obama condemns those who seek to 'hijack religion'

  1. #81
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    Re: Obama condemns those who seek to 'hijack religion'

    Quote Originally Posted by MMC View Post
    Yeah yeah yeah.....read Post 66 then get back to me.
    Post 66 has nothing to do with your stupid, nonsensical, inane, pointless, crappy, silly and retarded comment that Obama doesn't know that ISIS is our enemy and can't say their name. You don't even know what we're talking about?

    Your talking points are growing tired.
    Quote Originally Posted by TurtleDude View Post
    uh that is so small as to be stupid. Do you want registration? given less than 3% of criminals get their guns from private sales, its pretty much a waste of resources
    **Thirty Minutes Later**
    Quote Originally Posted by TurtleDude View Post
    you are confused. I never denied that many criminals get guns in private sales.

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    Re: Obama condemns those who seek to 'hijack religion'

    Quote Originally Posted by Slyfox696 View Post
    That's not what he did. He wasn't excusing the actions of ISIS at all. He was saying the actions of ISIS are not a reflection of a religion and to not erroneously associate the two. said.
    I agree he was in no way excusing actions of ISIS. An I get that he is trying to create a wedge between ISis and more mainstream Islam.
    But the sad a fact of the matter is that the religion of Islam is a big part of the problem. It's naive to think otherwise.

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    Re: Obama condemns those who seek to 'hijack religion'

    Quote Originally Posted by Lutherf View Post
    I don't hate the guy. I've never met him and for all I know he's a blast to hang out with. What I do hate, however, is his politics. Damned near everything the guy does or tries to do flies in the face of everything I hold dear as an American.
    I recall distinctly feeling that way about George Bush, and to a degree share your feelings about Obama. Will be nice if the day ever arises that the independents that out number republicans and democrats, form a new party and begin to advance policies that lift America up, and that promote the same abroad, rather then promoting policies that are injurious to all but the few, both at home and abroad, and let the ass and the elephant set one (a presidential administration) out, and see if that doesn't get their attention. Of course, American politics is not unlike football, you're expected to pick a team and root for it while trying to crush the opponent, so I'm just venting Lutherf, I have small hopes of anything other then the status quo in at least my lifetime.
    Killing one person is murder, killing 100,000 is foreign policy

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    Re: Obama condemns those who seek to 'hijack religion'

    Quote Originally Posted by Montecresto View Post
    Then get over it, or sue/lobby for peace, and an end to aggressions, rather than justifying them only when committed by the US and condemning all others.

    What have I justified? I pointed out your complaining about the US and the US alone seems rather prejudicial at best.
    Let evil swiftly befall those who have wrongly condemned us

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    Re: Obama condemns those who seek to 'hijack religion'

    Quote Originally Posted by roughdraft274 View Post
    Post 66 has nothing to do with your stupid, nonsensical, inane, pointless, crappy, silly and retarded comment that Obama doesn't know that ISIS is our enemy and can't say their name. You don't even know what we're talking about?

    Your talking points are growing tired.


    Sure it does, and if you can't figure out why even Jonah Goldberg would say it also. Then you really shouldn't even try and discuss politics. Nor think you know much about it.

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    Re: Obama condemns those who seek to 'hijack religion'

    Confessing that I have not read the entire thread before posting, apologies if somebody else has posted this. But the Rev. Franklin Graham posted this on Facebook after the President's offensive remarks at the Prayer Breakfast:

    “Today at the National Prayer Breakfast, the president implied that what ISIS is doing is equivalent to what happened over 1,000 years ago during the Crusades and the Inquisition, Rev. Graham wrote. “Mr. President — Many people in history have used the name of Jesus Christ to accomplish evil things for their own desires. But Jesus taught peace, love and forgiveness. He came to give His life for the sins of mankind, not to take life.”

    “Muhammad on the contrary was a warrior and killed many innocent people. True followers of Christ emulate Christ — true followers of Muhammad emulate Muhammad.”

    Even so, nobody would have thought anything about it--he might have gotten a standing "O" in fact--if Obama had said that those who commit such atrocities in the name of Allah dishonor peaceful Muslims everywhere and should merit their contempt and condemnation just as those who committed atrocities under the banner of Christianity deserve the contempt and condemnation of true followers of Christ's teachings.

    The problem he has is that Jesus of Nazareth did teach peace, forgiveness, tolerance, common sense, and love. And he led or sent nobody into battle to kill, maim, or destroy. Nobody can say that of Mohammed, the Qu'ran or the Hadith.
    "I think the best way of doing good to the poor, is not making them easy in poverty, but leading or driving them out of it." --Benjamin Franklin 1776

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    Re: Obama condemns those who seek to 'hijack religion'

    Quote Originally Posted by MMC View Post
    Sure it does, and if you can't figure out why even Jonah Goldberg would say it also. Then you really shouldn't even try and discuss politics. Nor think you know much about it.
    I could wipe my nuts with what Jonah Goldberg says. Why should should I give a crap what his opinion is?

    I consider what was said, not what some moron in national review thinks of it.
    Quote Originally Posted by TurtleDude View Post
    uh that is so small as to be stupid. Do you want registration? given less than 3% of criminals get their guns from private sales, its pretty much a waste of resources
    **Thirty Minutes Later**
    Quote Originally Posted by TurtleDude View Post
    you are confused. I never denied that many criminals get guns in private sales.

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    Re: Obama condemns those who seek to 'hijack religion'

    Quote Originally Posted by roughdraft274 View Post
    I could wipe my nuts with what Jonah Goldberg says. Why should should I give a crap what his opinion is?

    I consider what was said, not what some moron in national review thinks of it.


    Yeah that's what most political pundits strategists and political media types do to.....figure it out or not. I could care less.

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    Re: Obama condemns those who seek to 'hijack religion'

    Quote Originally Posted by MildSteel View Post
    Well I don't think it's wise to mix religion with politics. But it is done anyway.

    That said he did tell the truth, people should not hijack religion or use it as a weapon.
    Quote Originally Posted by Slyfox696 View Post
    That's not what he did. He [Pres. Obama) wasn't excusing the actions of ISIS at all. He was saying the actions of ISIS are not a reflection of a religion and to not erroneously associate the two. As an example, and to keep Americans from climbing up their high horse, he simply reminded us our past is full of evil acts committed in the name of religion, that were not religious at all.

    Take off your "I hate everything Democrat" hat and try to see what's actually being said.
    Quote Originally Posted by Zyphlin View Post
    Because it's a contextually shallow narrative.

    Christianity's use in the Crusades was not significantly different than some of its contemporaries, nor were the actions of the Crusades markedly outside of the cultural norms of what would be considered the developed world at that time. While that in no way excuses the violence that occured or the attrocities committed, the reality is that one must look at it at least in part within the context of the time it occurred.

    This is not the case with regards to ISIS. Their methods and actions are significantly outside the cultural norms of the developed world. Their aggressive attempts to conquerer areas of land and claim them for their own, specifically in the name of their religion, is not in line with rather common actions of other nations/groups in this age.

    While it's accurate to suggest violence has occurred in the name of other religions in the past, attempting to equate radical islam of today to christanity of the crusades as a means of suggesting people should not criticize it by getting on their "high horse", without any defference given to the contextual realities between the two situations, is ridiculous.

    I'd be interested as well to see how many of the liberals/democrats seemingly agreeing with Obama's reasoning are also ones who like to get on their "high horse" about racist elements that align themselves with the Tea Party Movement or with the Republican party...you know, considering that at some point in previous history Democrats had racist elements aligning themselves with their party and groups. Will they or Obama employ the same method of declaring such elements as "not real" Tea partiers or Republicans and condemning those who attempt to conflate the two, even if they're doing so by describing them as a direct subset?
    I'm going to try to speak to the three highlighted points above because they seem to reflect both the intellectual and emotional tone of the thread.

    I've read the transcript of the President's 2015 National Prayer Breakfast and feel confident in saying that the theme of the President's speech can be summed up in the 2nd sentence to paragraph 9:

    ...we've seen professions of faith used both as an instrument of great good, but also twisted and misused in the name of evil.
    Religious faith used for good...religious faith subverted and used for evil. No matter what commentary you've heard about the speech, if after listening to it or reading the transcript yourself you don't walk away with an acute understanding that people and/or groups claiming to be of a particular faith have done evil things in the name of their Holy deity, then you've missed the point entirely!

    While I would agree that one should never mix religion with politics (i.e., "God spoke to me and I was compelled to ask Congress for authority to destroy our nation's enemies showing no mercy"), I don't think it's wrong to ask God for a military victory over those we are at war against (i.e., God, bless our troops as they go into battle against a foreign enemy; may they be victorious.). The trick here is the war must be justified.

    As to the issue of the Crusades (and the Spanish Inquisition), I find it interesting that people would even attempt to gloss over the evil that was done in the name of God and Christ during such times. It did happen! Why the Crusades or the Inquisition began, who started it, whether or not either were benevolent is really irrelevant. Fact is, people did commit murder and other vile acts during such times in the name of God and Christ. They put their own personal ambitions ahead of their religious calling or the humane tenants of their faith. Doesn't matter whether they were during "modern times" or medieval times. The fact remains that even those who believed they were doing "God's will" still committed sinful acts in His name.
    Last edited by Objective Voice; 02-06-15 at 03:36 PM.
    "A fair exchange ain't no robbery." Tupac Shakur w/Digital Underground

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    Re: Obama condemns those who seek to 'hijack religion'

    (Continued from post #89...)

    What President Obama was in essence saying is:

    1) We have to guard against using our faith to commit evil acts that don't conform to peaceful teachings regardless of the religion; and,

    2) Both followers of Christianity and Islam have done some dreadful things (past and present) in the name of "their" God and, in so doing, have twisted their religion to justify their actions.

    Regardless of where you stand on certain portions of the speech, I don't think anyone who really listened to it or read it as I have can come away thinking he didn't condemn ISIL for what its doing in the name of the Muslim faith any more than you can condemn him for telling the truth about the evils Christian believers have done throughout our nation's history if not throughout time also in the name of God.

    I think if people would take a moment to stop trying to find fault in the President about every little thing he says or does and just take a moment to listen and understand particularly in the context of this speech, you'd understand his were words of cautious warning to guard against using one's faith not to do good, but to do evil. Nothing more, nothing less. From the speech:

    ...we should start with some basic humility. I believe that the starting point of faith is some doubt -- not being so full of yourself and so confident that you are right and that God speaks only to us, and doesn’t speak to others, that God only cares about us and doesn’t care about others, that somehow we alone are in possession of the truth.

    Our job is not to ask that God responds to our notion of truth -- our job is to be true to Him, His word, and His commandments. And we should assume humbly that we’re confused and don’t always know what we’re doing and we’re staggering and stumbling towards Him, and have some humility in that process. And that means we have to speak up against those who would misuse His name to justify oppression, or violence, or hatred with that fierce certainty. No God condones terror.
    Last edited by Objective Voice; 02-06-15 at 03:45 PM.
    "A fair exchange ain't no robbery." Tupac Shakur w/Digital Underground

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