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Toddler wounds both parents with 1 shot from handgun

Yet they seem to be a favourite amongst those with a lot of massacring to do dont they ?
You had referenced the Newtown shooting earlier....the rifle Adam Lansa used is not used by the US military.
 
Fair enough. When the next legally armed high school massacre occurs using just such weapons then your conscience will be clear.
Adam Lansa was not the legal owner of the rifle he used to commit those crimes. He had in fact killed the legal owner before going to the school.

Once at the school, the police were notified very early on in the encounter and still took 20 minutes to show up. When Lansa was finished, he had a lot of ammunition left over.
 
According to your own FBI just under 1% of all firearm fatalities are civilian defensive shootings. The other 99% pay a very high price indeed for such 'security'

about 80% involve people not legally able to own a firearm (felony convictions, age etc) killing people who as a group are also about 80% disqualified from owning a firearm. however, a majority of firearms deaths are self inflicted

so good people being murdered is bad but its not nearly the amount you'd want us to believe
 
According to your own FBI just under 1% of all firearm fatalities are civilian defensive shootings.
Fatalities.

You are actually not very likely to die from a gun shot given modern medicine. I note that you didn't include injuries or instances where the criminal stopped when the gun was merely displayed.
 
Fatalities.

You are actually not very likely to die from a gun shot given modern medicine. I note that you didn't include injuries or instances where the criminal stopped when the gun was merely displayed.

I didn't for the other 99% either
 
about 80% involve people not legally able to own a firearm (felony convictions, age etc) killing people who as a group are also about 80% disqualified from owning a firearm. however, a majority of firearms deaths are self inflicted

Yet it was still so easy for them to get them nonetheless. Blaming the symptoms for the problem again

so good people being murdered is bad but its not nearly the amount you'd want us to believe

Anybody being murdered is bad. Its the expedient lethality of firearms that makes it far easier and more prevelent in the States
 
Adam Lansa was not the legal owner of the rifle he used to commit those crimes. He had in fact killed the legal owner before going to the school.

And very possibly the next guy could do the same next time. And while gun extremists are allowed to indulge their fetishes there will of course be many next times :(
 
:lamo:lamo

THAT ISN'T A COUNTER TO MY ARGUMENT!!!!!!! HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!!!

I wasn't talking about JUST mass shootings. You weren't either. Trying to change the goalposts here? Why don't you try again?

I love the use of a Blog though lol. Especially since the blogger can give the inaccurate representation of what the FBI study would show lol.

Yes he does that. He cant manage to twist the data to fit his spiel and then keeps changing the goal posts, like between intentional (criminal) and accidental shootings.
 
Fair enough. When the next legally armed high school massacre occurs using just such weapons then your conscience will be clear.

So I live in a rural area. What do I do when multiple intruders (unfortunately it happens weekly in the Seattle metro area) break into my place at night? They dont even need guns to be a lethal threat to me. The cops are 15 minutes away, best case scenario.

How should I defend myself? I have training and preparations to try and do so. How do you suggest I do so?

Or any family in the same situation, of which there are millions across America?
 
So I live in a rural area. What do I do when multiple intruders (unfortunately it happens weekly in the Seattle metro area) break into my place at night? They dont even need guns to be a lethal threat to me. The cops are 15 minutes away, best case scenario.

How should I defend myself? I have training and preparations to try and do so. How do you suggest I do so?

Or any family in the same situation, of which there are millions across America?

Not massively exaggerate the threat in order to validate your fetish perhaps :cool:

First its supposed to be just the deprived inner city ghettos now its rural areas getting multiple intruders, and all this in a country thats supposed to be much less violent and more law abiding than the UK because of its guns ! :lol:
 
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Yes he does that. He cant manage to twist the data to fit his spiel and then keeps changing the goal posts, like between intentional (criminal) and accidental shootings.

I've done nothing of the sort. I've simply presented the data and you've then rejected it out of hand so your wilful blindness is your own fault

Moving on ...... :roll:
 
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I've done nothing of the sort. I've simply presented the data and you've then rejected it out of hand so your wilful blindness is your own fault

Moving on ...... :roll:

You keep moving on when you cant answer. Like when you punted instead of telling me which you were going to focus on...or focus on separately...intentional or accidental data. I nailed you to the wall on intentional when you posted your 'overall' stats for the UK.

I should go back and get that quote.....
 
You keep moving on when you cant answer. Like when you punted instead of telling me which you were going to focus on...or focus on separately...intentional or accidental data. I nailed you to the wall on intentional when you posted your 'overall' stats for the UK.

It was you decided that accidental and intentional meant the same thing not me. Basically everything after that has been your attempt to shoot the messenger
 
Yet it was still so easy for them to get them nonetheless. Blaming the symptoms for the problem again



Anybody being murdered is bad. Its the expedient lethality of firearms that makes it far easier and more prevelent in the States

then why does the group with the highest rate of legal gun ownership has the lowest rate of gun violence?
 
And very possibly the next guy could do the same next time.
Most guns used in crime are illegally possessed, yes, even in the UK.

And while gun extremists are allowed to indulge their fetishes there will of course be many next times :(
This thread isn't about extremists, just your regular joe who happens to own a handgun. In fact if you consider OP, the gun owner this story is about hardly gave a thought about her gun at all. I don't think you know what "fetish" actually means.
 
Not massively exaggerate the threat in order to validate your fetish perhaps :cool:

First its supposed to be just the deprived inner city ghettos now its rural areas getting multiple intruders, and all this in a country thats supposed to be much less violent and more law abiding than the UK because of its guns ! :lol:

Well I dont live in the inner city, do I?

There's a difference between crime and self defense, or dont you recognize that? Innocent people would be better off dead rather than use a firearm to save themselves? Feel free to own that. I also notice you didnt answer.

And I have no gun fetish. I dont love guns. I have guns for specific purposes and not one extra. I dont love my guns anymore than I love my car or truck. They are tools that enable different things, that's all.
 
It was you decided that accidental and intentional meant the same thing not me. Basically everything after that has been your attempt to shoot the messenger

No, I have been telling you that you have been incapable of interpreting the statistics from the first...and you have denied it. And proved yourself wrong as well. I'll go find that quote. But you are the one that has waffled back and forth between intentional and accidental as you tried, ineffectually, to prove an unprovable point.

here we go, where you are more than happy to use 'overall' stats to prove your point when ignoring them here in the US.

Most violent in Europe ? Have you ever visited it ? On the contrary our overall official crime stats are the lowest since 1981 so it looks like all those gun bans have been helping

http://www.theguardian.com/uk/2013/apr/25/uk-crime-falls-official-figures

Our overall gun deaths in the US are extremely low when compared to total gun ownership. As you've been told many times, gun deaths are mainly focused on criminals, gang members, and socio-economically challenged areas.

But *overall* the rest of America is at little risk, esp. when you consider how many guns the rest of us law-abiding citizens own.

Like I said, your interpretation is a giant fail. (odd since you seem to understand the difference for your 'overall crime rates' which are affected by the exact same things...criminals, gangs, socio-economically challenged areas...NOT the same all over the country.)
 
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Well I dont live in the inner city, do I?

There's a difference between crime and self defense, or dont you recognize that? Innocent people would be better off dead rather than use a firearm to save themselves? Feel free to own that. I also notice you didnt answer.

And I have no gun fetish. I dont love guns. I have guns for specific purposes and not one extra. I dont love my guns anymore than I love my car or truck. They are tools that enable different things, that's all.
I have more keys than guns so I guess I'm a key/lock fetishist.

...oh crap, just realized I have more passwords than keys....
 
I have more keys than guns so I guess I'm a key/lock fetishist.

...oh crap, just realized I have more passwords than keys....

I have more pets than guns...am I a pet fetishist?
 
then why does the group with the highest rate of legal gun ownership has the lowest rate of gun violence?

Switzerland has a very high rate of legal gun ownership (almost certainly higher than in the even most legal US state) yet you are still 17 times more likely to be killed by a gun there than in the UK
 
Most guns used in crime are illegally possessed, yes, even in the UK.

That he so easily acquired it from a perfectly legal source is the point you are choosing to miss. Doubtless the next one will too

This thread isn't about extremists,
Reading through some of the input here thats arguable
 
Well I dont live in the inner city, do I?

There's a difference between crime and self defense, or dont you recognize that? Innocent people would be better off dead rather than use a firearm to save themselves? Feel free to own that. I also notice you didnt answer.

And I have no gun fetish. I dont love guns. I have guns for specific purposes and not one extra. I dont love my guns anymore than I love my car or truck. They are tools that enable different things, that's all.

As a female at home concerned with personal safety consider this. In 2010, nearly 6 times more women were shot by husbands, boyfriends, and ex-partners than murdered by male strangers.
A woman's chances of being killed by her abuser increase more than 7 times if he has access to a gun.
One study found that women in states with higher gun ownership rates were 4.9 times more likely to be murdered by a gun than women in states with lower gun ownership rates.

http://www.vpc.org/studies/wmmw2012.pdf
Risk Factors for Femicide in Abusive Relationships: Results From a Multisite Case Control Study
Firearm availability and suicide, homicide, and unintentional firearm deaths among women
 
That he so easily acquired it from a perfectly legal source is the point you are choosing to miss.
Are you suggesting that the laws requiring a backround check, registration, and baning of military arms had no impact on a criminal's ability to carry out a mass murder?

The people of Connecticut will not be happy to hear you speak against gun control like that, especially after the Newtown shooting.

There are no extremists present on this thread. Not even you, though you lend yourself to emotive language. An extremist is someone who's views are far outside the mainstream opinion of the general sociaty. The American general view on gun ownership is that having a handgun for personal protection is perfectly fine. You, however, want all guns banned, and that view is more removed from the American mainstream than is general approval of owning a handgun.
 
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