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Gov. Scott Walker: Don't Rule Out 'Boots on the Ground' Against ISIS

Fearandloathing said:
I once read an historian offer that Anthony Eden and his appeasement cost millions of lives......

The trouble started when Obama apologized to the Arab world, then tried to play 'liberator' and affect regime change thinking that because they're the new guys and he said "sorry" they would like him and be in his club house. Egypt, Libya et al....

So now we this new offshoot of some old offshoot of Islamic terror and he's afraid to call it Islamic terror...

So tell me, we have Obama at the other end of the ice and all this hand wringing and the highest paid players, and me and my hockey team at this end....

.....are we going to respect him as an opponent?

**** no.....
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He can't call it, "Islamic terror", because to do so would be an admission that it isn't all America's fault.
 
apdst said:
He can't call it, "Islamic terror", because to do so would be an admission that it isn't all America's fault.
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I suspect there are darker reasons why this sudden shift to not identify what has been identified for 15 years.

Obama is nothing is he is not underhanded and dishonest
 
Fearandloathing said:
I suspect there are darker reasons why this sudden shift to not identify what has been identified for 15 years.

Obama is nothing is he is not underhanded and dishonest
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He sees the jihadists as freedom fighters, not terrorists
 
US Conservative said:
If they do or if they dont-none have a meaningful capacity to do anything about it.
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So we should risk OUR lives for them?

If they don't care enough to do something about it, **** em.


But of course.... this is team America world police...

Bringin' you FREEDOM... whether you want us or not!!!!!

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US Conservative said:
We aren't simply droning weddings by fighting ISIS. You dont win wars by walking on eggshells like you appear to want to.
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You don't seem to understand.

There isn't a "war" for us. This is up to Iraq.

We have to stop being the world police. Putting our assets and lives on the line for other people... and for what?

What is there to gain from this? Iraq will never be an "Ally" in the typical sense of the word.

That area of the world is too confused right now to have a permanent identity.....
 
Caine said:
So we should risk OUR lives for them?

If they don't care enough to do something about it, **** em.


But of course.... this is team America world police...

Bringin' you FREEDOM... whether you want us or not!!!!!

6327a399cfd6e3a620585ab05834d841be60d27e98ea78cb60680bc46584057c.jpg
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There is a difference between not caring and not being able.
 
US Conservative said:
You appear to forget-Obama wants to destroy Assads govt. Red lines and such. :2wave:
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You don't seem to understand.

I don't give a **** what you think Obama wants to do.

I think about America. America is NOT Obama... Or Bush.... or Clinton.

All your partisan hackery in this thread is lost on me... Im not going to sit here and bitch back and forth between "Well Obama did this and Bush did that and wah wah wah" like you petty mongrels.

Regardless of who the President happens to be at the time.... America should not be meddling in the affairs of Middle Eastern nations. Period.
 
US Conservative said:
There we are with that mindless "forever war" meme again.

You fight wars to win them, not to fit a calendar.
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And what grand prize does one win for meddling in the affairs of the Middle East?
 
Gill said:
Is that the reason ISIS killed the judge that sentenced Saddam to hang??

Your theory doesn't hold water.
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Because they saw him as colluding with the United States. It isn't my theory, its history. Look them up on Wikipedia, the Council of Foreign Relations, or any mainstream outlet since 2003.
 
Jack Hays said:
There is a difference between not caring and not being able.
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If they aren't able.... then so be it.

There is also a difference between the people wanting our help, and the government wanting our help.

The government would obviously want our help..... it keeps them in power.

But do the people really want our help? And if so... why are so many of them joining ISIS?
 
SouthernDemocrat said:
Because they saw him as colluding with the United States. It isn't my theory, its history. Look them up on Wikipedia, the Council of Foreign Relations, or any mainstream outlet since 2003.
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They were defeated by 2009. Abdication in Iraq and lassitude in Syria enabled their reemergence.
 
Caine said:
If they aren't able.... then so be it.

There is also a difference between the people wanting our help, and the government wanting our help.

The government would obviously want our help..... it keeps them in power.

But do the people really want our help? And if so... why are so many of them joining ISIS?
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Because hope is attractive and death is not.
 
Jack Hays said:
They were defeated by 2009. Abdication in Iraq and lassitude in Syria enabled their reemergence.
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Oh for crying out loud. Thats the whole problem with this neo-conservative world view. You can't defeat them. They just scatter to the shadows like roaches and grow in numbers until you leave. We hit one terrorist group and it just splits into two. The only way you keep them under control is to do what we did for decades in the Middle East, support brutal dictators that kept them in check.
 
SouthernDemocrat said:
Oh for crying out loud. Thats the whole problem with this neo-conservative world view. You can't defeat them. They just scatter to the shadows like roaches and grow in numbers until you leave. We hit one terrorist group and it just splits into two. The only way you keep them under control is to do what we did for decades in the Middle East, support brutal dictators that kept them in check.
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Both BHO and Biden proclaimed it a victory. I don't think they're neocons.
 
Jack Hays said:
Because hope is attractive and death is not.
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If death is not attractive..... then why do you pine so badly for war?

What do we gain from our American dead while Meddling in the Middle East?

Do you honestly think spending more billions and more decades will somehow make a dent in the instability of that region of the world?

We've already spend over 13 years between Afganistan and Iraq meddling in their affairs........ You can make all the partisan claims you want about, "Well everything would be peaches and cherries if Obama had just done this, or that, or the other thing" but face the goddamned facts.... That area would still be what it is.... Maybe ISIS wouldn't be around... maybe they would still be covertly waiting for the eventual day in which we did finally leave, unless of course you think it is prudent to stay there for over a century to ensure they don't wait us out.... meanwhile our nation goes Bankrupt attempting to keep this thing financed and we still aren't any closer to stability in the middle east.

You cannot stabilize this volatile area of the world by occupying them. It is against the very nature of their culture and it will never work.
 
Jack Hays said:
Both BHO and Biden proclaimed it a victory. I don't think they're neocons.
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It was a "victory" in that we left Iraq with an elected government and a large defense force. It is not our fault that the government of Iraq is so corrupt and ineffectual that they cannot defeat ISIS with an Iraqi defense force numbering in the hundreds of thousands. We could stay there a hundred years spending a hundred billion a year and the government would no less corrupt than it is today.
 
Caine said:
If death is not attractive..... then why do you pine so badly for war?

What do we gain from our American dead while Meddling in the Middle East?

Do you honestly think spending more billions and more decades will somehow make a dent in the instability of that region of the world?

We've already spend over 13 years between Afganistan and Iraq meddling in their affairs........ You can make all the partisan claims you want about, "Well everything would be peaches and cherries if Obama had just done this, or that, or the other thing" but face the goddamned facts.... That area would still be what it is.... Maybe ISIS wouldn't be around... maybe they would still be covertly waiting for the eventual day in which we did finally leave, unless of course you think it is prudent to stay there for over a century to ensure they don't wait us out.... meanwhile our nation goes Bankrupt attempting to keep this thing financed and we still aren't any closer to stability in the middle east.

You cannot stabilize this volatile area of the world by occupying them. It is against the very nature of their culture and it will never work.
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Why do you think I pine for war?
 
Jack Hays said:
Why do you think I pine for war?
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Maybe you don't.

It would appear your only posts in this thread outside of replying to me to disagree with me have been nothing but a partisan hackery jerkfest.

If you want to continue being a partisan, by all means, but we won't have anything to discuss...

Im not here to talk about what Obama or Bush or Clinton or Bush or Reagan or Carter or Ford or Nixon or Johnson or Kennedy or Eisenhower or Truman did......

Don't give a ****....

I care about what America is doing.
 
SouthernDemocrat said:
It was a "victory" in that we left Iraq with an elected government and a large defense force. It is not our fault that the government of Iraq is so corrupt and ineffectual that they cannot defeat ISIS with an Iraqi defense force numbering in the hundreds of thousands. We could stay there a hundred years spending a hundred billion a year and the government would no less corrupt than it is today.
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And yet they proclaimed victory. That would have been true had they done what all planners expected and left a residual training and special operations force behind.
 
Jack Hays said:
And yet they proclaimed victory. That would have been true had they done what all planners expected and left a residual training and special operations force behind.
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And yet they did not want us to do so while providing the customary legal protections given in all other situations of similar nature.

But... I guess we should have said **** you, we're going to force it upon you.... because....

Serious-democracy1.jpg
 
Caine said:
Maybe you don't.

It would appear your only posts in this thread outside of replying to me to disagree with me have been nothing but a partisan hackery jerkfest.

If you want to continue being a partisan, by all means, but we won't have anything to discuss...

Im not here to talk about what Obama or Bush or Clinton or Bush or Reagan or Carter or Ford or Nixon or Johnson or Kennedy or Eisenhower or Truman did......

Don't give a ****....

I care about what America is doing.
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I have no party, but I know the sure way to make a bad situation worse is to ignore it.
 
Jack Hays said:
And yet they proclaimed victory. That would have been true had they done what all planners expected and left a residual training and special operations force behind.
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Sure that would have kept ISIS from taking over so much of the country... Had we just left a couple of thousand of our soldiers walled off in the green zone. That way not only would ISIS be taking over the county, they would use are presence as propaganda arguing they are liberating Iraq from the western imperialists. At which point we would either have to have another huge buildup for another surge to tamp down the Islamists in the country again, or just pack up and leave under worse circumstances than what we left under.
 
Caine said:
And yet they did not want us to do so while providing the customary legal protections given in all other situations of similar nature.

But... I guess we should have said **** you, we're going to force it upon you.... because....

Serious-democracy1.jpg
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There was a deal to be done. We didn't try.
 
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