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Vaccine Critics Turn Defensive Over Measles [W:1210]

Deuce said:
Why only the focus on the death rates?

This isn't chicken pox. It's not just being itchy for a week.
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FYI, even the chicken pox vaccine is now mandatory to school is many states.

IMO, this mandatory crap has gone too far.

I'm sure in a few years, chicken pox will be called a deadly disease.
 
jmotivator said:
The nice thing about a secure boarder is you can limit immigration to only people who have been vaccinated.

Just sayin'.

The idea that a bunch of unvaccinated progressive Californians could have contracted measles from an illegal alien at Disneyland is... intriguing.
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Just sayin' Vectors or Victims? Docs Slam Rumors That Migrants Carry Disease - NBC News

World Bank statistics indicate that some of the countries that the kids are traveling from actually have higher vaccination rates than the United States. The U.S. has a 92 percent vaccination rate for measles. Mexico vaccinates 99 percent of its children; Guatemala, El Salvador and Honduras all have a 93 percent vaccination rate.
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And there are a lot of California communities with far lower vaccination rates than the national average and it's in these communities where the outbreaks are happening....
 
Tettsuo said:
FYI, even the chicken pox vaccine is now mandatory to school is many states.

IMO, this mandatory crap has gone too far.

I'm sure in a few years, chicken pox will be called a deadly disease.
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While chicken pox very seldom has complications that would lead to death, the viris lies domate and can reappear in later years as very painful/itchy disease that sometimes settles in the eye and can cause vision loss and others sometimes have severe pain lasting for years as a side effect of shingles.

Shingles is caused by the varicella zoster virus, the same virus that causes chicken pox. Anyone who battled the childhood virus is at risk for shingles since the virus lays dormant in nerve cells for years. ...

It presents with the same red, hot, sore blisters as chicken pox, not body wide but in the territory of the nerve where the virus is reactivating, often in a band on the chest or abdomen."...

About 10 to 25 percent of people who get shingles will have it in the face and eye, said Dr. Erik Chotiner, ophthalmologist with Memorial Eye Institute in Lower Paxton Township....



While shingles on the skin can include swelling of the eyelid and conjunctivitis, shingles on the eye itself, called herpes zoster ophthalmicus, can cause something much worse – scarring that can lead to vision loss,

"Skin lesions can be painful, but when you are talking about potential loss of vision, shingles become scarier," Chotiner said.
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Not just a painful rash: Shingles can damage the eyes | PennLive.com
 
Deuce said:
Why only the focus on the death rates?

This isn't chicken pox. It's not just being itchy for a week.
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Because in the quote I applied, it was an answer to something based on whether a person died. It was implied that measles was relatively deadly.

But even if we look at complications, they are almost always temporary (even if they take a while to overcome). There are a few cases where measles can cause some permanent damage to a person, which is as sad as death, but even this is pretty uncommon, even rare in the US and other developed countries with strong healthcare systems. So long as the person actually sees a doctor and gets certain antibiotics and vitamins to help reduce their likelihood of getting things like encephalitis or problems with their eyes.
 
minnie616 said:
While chicken pox very seldom has complications that would lead to death, the viris lies domate and can reappear in later years as very painful/itchy disease that sometimes settles in the eye and can cause vision loss and others sometimes have severe pain lasting for years as a side effect of shingles.

Not just a painful rash: Shingles can damage the eyes | PennLive.com
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Shingles does not affect children (normally, if ever). It is found in those who have had chicken pox and the virus attacks once more after the immune system degrades with age. It is also not contagious. Shingles doesn't really occur in outbreaks.
 
minnie616 said:
While chicken pox very seldom has complications that would lead to death, the viris lies domate and can reappear in later years as very painful/itchy disease that sometimes settles in the eye and can cause vision loss and others sometimes have severe pain lasting for years as a side effect of shingles.



Not just a painful rash: Shingles can damage the eyes | PennLive.com
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See what I mean.

Just like measles, chicken pox will soon be seen as a serious disease that all must be vaccinated for.

The fear is unfounded.
 
Deuce said:
Based on an incorrect assumption that you have a right to attend public school while endangering others with your choice.
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That anyone is endangering anyone is an incorrect assumption. You seem to confuse possibility and certainty.
 
paddymcdougall said:
Welcome to this site, Troll.
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You know, I only read the posts, who quote me. I don't bother to read the other 500 posts that precede mine. What I am making is a simple request. When you use an acronym, please bother to define in parentheses what it means out of courtesy to other posters.
 
paddymcdougall said:
You want to have the benefits of society -i.e. public school - you follow the rules - vaccinate your kids.
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False premise. Attendance at school is required.

Nothing in the constitution about public schools, as far as I know. I happen to think they are very important and part of what makes our country great; but they didn't really become big until the 1800s.
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It doesn't need to be in the constitution, so long as all the acts passed regarding education are in keeping with the constitution. Which they have been.

Mississippi has a 99+% vaccination rate for kids in kindergarten because they only allow medical exemptions, and few of those. Parents who don't like it can home school or go to private schools.
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In keeping with how laws work in the states, Constitutionally speaking, Mississippi would either have to provide another option or waive the requirement to attend school.
 
Lakryte said:
This link might help.
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I shouldn't have to Google it. If you insist on the use of acronyms, try spelling out the acronym as a courtesy to other posters, who don't want to read 500 or so other posts preceding this discussion.
 
Gimmesometruth said:
And then he proceeds to list deaths caused by measles....DERP!
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Yes, but no deaths in the 1930's on up to 1963 when the vaccine was first introduced. Amazing isn't that. To think, I grew up in an era when measles was a thing of the past. Has the vaccine caused all these deaths, or was it Bush's fault?
 
JasperL said:
Just sayin' Vectors or Victims? Docs Slam Rumors That Migrants Carry Disease - NBC News

And there are a lot of California communities with far lower vaccination rates than the national average and it's in these communities where the outbreaks are happening....
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It is not a "slam" to argue it MIGHT have been something else and that SOME Central American countries report higher vaccination rates.

I would venture a guess that the vaccination rate in the abject poor who flee Mexico for the US is someone lower than Mexico as a whole. It would be nice to know for sure but that would require controlling the border...
 
bicycleman said:
I shouldn't have to Google it. If you insist on the use of acronyms, try spelling out the acronym as a courtesy to other posters, who don't want to read 500 or so other posts preceding this discussion.
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Oh please. If you don't know common acronyms, just look them up. You shouldn't expect people to hold your hand and coddle you.
 
Are you guys that are for vaccines, for all of the mandated vaccines?

For example - HepB and tetanus
 
bicycleman said:
Yes, but no deaths in the 1930's on up to 1963 when the vaccine was first introduced. Amazing isn't that. To think, I grew up in an era when measles was a thing of the past. Has the vaccine caused all these deaths, or was it Bush's fault?
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You have been shown that this is untrue why do you keep repeating a lie?
In 1920, the United States had 469,924 measles cases and 7,575 deaths due to measles. From 1958 to 1962, the United States had an average of 503,282 cases and 432 deaths each year. (Measles reporting began in 1912; prior to this time, no statistics are available.) In large cities, epidemics often occurred every two to five years.
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https://science.education.nih.gov/s...s/activities/activity5_measles-database.htm#6

Globally it is still killing people!
Measles is one of the leading causes of death among young children even though a safe and cost-effective vaccine is available.
In 2013, there were 145 700 measles deaths globally – about 400 deaths every day or 16 deaths every hour.
Measles vaccination resulted in a 75% drop in measles deaths between 2000 and 2013 worldwide.
In 2013, about 84% of the world's children received one dose of measles vaccine by their first birthday through routine health services – up from 73% in 2000.
During 2000-2013, measles vaccination prevented an estimated 15.6 million deaths making measles vaccine one of the best buys in public health.
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WHO | Measles
 
Complications from measles.

Measles is certainly unpleasant, but it can also be quite dangerous.
As many as one in three people with measles develop complications to include pneumonia, miscarriage, brain inflammation, hospitalization and even death.

Infants under one year of age, people who have a weakened immune system and non-immune pregnant women’s are at highest risk of severe illness and complications. One out of 1,000 people with measles will develop inflammation of the brain, and about one out of 1,000 will die.
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http://shotofprevention.com/2014/03/11/measles-outbreaks-are-concerning-even-to-the-vaccinated/
 
bicycleman said:
Yes, but no deaths in the 1930's on up to 1963 when the vaccine was first introduced. Amazing isn't that.
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It is really amazing that just after you posted data showing deaths from measles up to the 60's, now you are trying to ignore the very data you posted, as if you did not post it.
To think, I grew up in an era when measles was a thing of the past.
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It wasn't, it existed in areas not immunized.
Has the vaccine caused all these deaths, or was it Bush's fault?
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What deaths? Since we can now treat those with the disease with modern methods they can survive since the outbreaks occur in small numbers that do not overwhelm our health system, but you get more and more folks with ideas in there heads about not needing to immunize their children, you will overwhelm the system. This doesn't even touch on the economic losses associated with the care required because of such a screwed up idea, as if death is the one and only concern. It is turning the argument into an absolute argument.
 
roguenuke said:
Shingles does not affect children (normally, if ever). It is found in those who have had chicken pox and the virus attacks once more after the immune system degrades with age. It is also not contagious. Shingles doesn't really occur in outbreaks.
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To clarify, a person with shingles can't spread shingles, but can spread the virus that causes chicken pox, so they should keep the sores covered and would be wise to avoid pregnant women, infants, others with compromised immunity, etc.

I only know this because my mom recently got shingles and I looked it up for her.
 
JasperL said:
To clarify, a person with shingles can't spread shingles, but can spread the virus that causes chicken pox, so they should keep the sores covered and would be wise to avoid pregnant women, infants, others with compromised immunity, etc.

I only know this because my mom recently got shingles and I looked it up for her.
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True, but chicken pox is rarely deadly and even has very few longlasting complications.
 
bicycleman said:
Yes, but no deaths in the 1930's on up to 1963 when the vaccine was first introduced. Amazing isn't that. To think, I grew up in an era when measles was a thing of the past. Has the vaccine caused all these deaths, or was it Bush's fault?
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There were deaths from measles in the 1930s.

In fact there was a study in 1930s that found that children hospitalised for measles who were given vitamin A or D or a combination of vitamin A and D did not have a lower death rate than children given the standard treatment.

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC1975452/pdf/archdisch01484-0033.pdf
 
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roguenuke said:
True, but chicken pox is rarely deadly and even has very few longlasting complications.
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Correct, especially for the general population, but it's a large enough risk to pregnant women, infants, and other with compromised immunity that someone with shingles is smart to avoid them for the few days they are contagious.

Chickenpox and pregnancy: What are the concerns? - Mayo Clinic

If you're pregnant and develop chickenpox (varicella) — a highly contagious viral illness that causes an itchy rash — you and your baby face serious health risks.

If you develop chickenpox during pregnancy, you're at high risk of potentially serious complications — such as pneumonia.

For your baby, the risks depend on the timing. If chickenpox develops during the first 20 weeks of pregnancy — particularly between weeks 8 and 20 — the baby faces a slight risk of a rare group of serious birth defects known as congenital varicella syndrome. A baby who has congenital varicella syndrome might develop:

Scars on the skin
Low birth weight
Problems affecting the arms, legs, brain and eyes

If chickenpox develops during the few days before you deliver, the baby might be born with a potentially life-threatening infection.

If you're exposed to chickenpox during pregnancy and you're not immune, contact your health care provider immediately.
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Also, too - http://www.mayoclinic.org/diseases-conditions/chickenpox/basics/complications/con-20019025
 
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roguenuke said:
True, but chicken pox is rarely deadly and even has very few longlasting complications.
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And the vaccine is very quick and has a lot fewer complications. Why not get the vaccine?
 


Does a pretty good job of detailing the main concerns of anti-vaccine parents.
 
You know you're a 90s kid if your vaccines were mandatory and nobody in your school died from 19th century diseases.
 
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paddymcdougall said:
And the vaccine is very quick and has a lot fewer complications. Why not get the vaccine?
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Because some people do not agree with putting foreign substances into their body, and that should be their choice, especially for something like chicken pox.

And shingles doesn't really work like chicken pox, despite being the same virus. Shingles is only contagious through contact with the sores/bumps of an affected person, kind of like after getting the smallpox vaccine. The sore that develops is contagious which is why we had to keep ours covered til it went away and the band aids went into a special trash an.
 
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