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Thread: Vaccine Critics Turn Defensive Over Measles [W:1210]

  1. #351
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    re: Vaccine Critics Turn Defensive Over Measles [W:1210]

    Quote Originally Posted by VanceMack View Post
    Your butthurt is noted as is your apparent lack of ability to engage in conversation.
    Coming from the guy who calls people butthurt instead of addressing the actual argument

    Move along.
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    re: Vaccine Critics Turn Defensive Over Measles [W:1210]

    Quote Originally Posted by joko104 View Post
    How does an unvaccinated person put a vaccinated person at risk? Explain it. No one else has. They just keep chanting a nonsensical slogan.
    It has been explained on a number of posts- elderly - those with immune disorders - those receiving cancer treatments - those that are to young for vaccinations - vaccination degrade over time - vaccinations are not 100 % effective.
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    Hillary is the only defense I or anyone else needs.
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    re: Vaccine Critics Turn Defensive Over Measles [W:1210]

    Quote Originally Posted by joko104 View Post
    How does an unvaccinated person put a vaccinated person at risk? Explain it. No one else has. They just keep chanting a nonsensical slogan.
    Well that's been explained multiple times, but to reiterate from other posters here is a link that helps explain it.
    Why Worry About the Unvaccinated? | Shot of Prevention

    Vaccines are not 100% effective. Most routine childhood vaccines are effective for 85% to 95% of recipients. So an unvaccinated person very much puts vaccinated people at risk, because for some vaccinated individuals the vaccine will be ineffective.
    "Give me your tired, your poor, your huddled masses yearning to breathe free."
    "When we live authentically we create an opportunity for others to walk out of their dark prisons of pretend into freedom."

  4. #354
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    re: Vaccine Critics Turn Defensive Over Measles [W:1210]

    Quote Originally Posted by joko104 View Post
    No, the other question is who gets to decide which risk to take?

    Many here say it's the government. Maybe the governments should have people at casinos dictating which bet to place calculating the odds.

    Many people no longer grasp the concept of INDIVIDUAL risk taking, that it's MY risk to decide, not the government's or the collective hive mentality.
    All that's fine, but what you're not admitting here is your decision to take a risk also puts a great many more at risk who didn't get to weigh in on your decision. Let's assume your own child will survive the disease because of good health, diet, and access to medical care. The problem is he or she can go to McD, infect a child, who infects a father, who visits his wife in the ICU getting chemo and whose immunity is severely compromised.

    Those risks are tiny today, but only because the vast majority of people over decades have been responsible, and contribute to the public health in the big picture, by getting vaccinated. And the anti-vaxers rely on those individual who were responsible and got vaccinated to protect themselves and THEIR loved ones from these totally preventable and nearly eradicated diseases. It's really very selfish.

    Just as a personal example, I take a drug that is intended to and does suppress my immune system. The side effects are I am more susceptible for diseases of all kinds, including those I've been vaccinated against. I had to get tested for some of these before the first dose because my current immune system bolstered by vaccinations protected me. The drug upsets that balance. Anyway, some kid with measles poses a risk to me, and more significantly THROUGH ME to my elderly mother in law who simply would not survive a serious illness at this point in her life.

    Most vaccinations are a disease they are injecting into the person. No tests are done on the person before this. No information of where or how it is was made. Just 50 needles with diseases, some with many blended together, for which those of the collective hive mentality declare the big pharma has successfully assured the government it's safe - and thus only a lunatic would dare question it.
    Interesting you call those who rely on all the scientific evidence as having a "collective hive mentality." What the science tells us in crystal clear terms is the risk of the diseases overwhelms the real but miniscule risk of vaccination. We don't have to guess what vaccination has accomplished - nearly eradicated diseases that used to seriously sicken and kill

    And all the experts swore Iraq had WMDs too. To everyone. To the whole world. And MOST people believed them. It's not like government and corporations ever lie to anyone.
    That's a fair point, but how long did it take for the truth about WMDs to come out? And the truth did quickly emerge even given the (we'll assume) large incentives for government to keep those truths hidden. What you're suggesting is essentially a conspiracy theory participated in by nearly all the world's health professionals and all the world's most influential healthcare organizations. The reason they all support vaccinations is on a risk/reward basis there probably isn't an easier no brainer in all of science - vaccinate a population and public health will DRAMATICALLY improve, nearly overnight. The living examples are every population that has been vaccinated and measures of public health before and after.

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    re: Vaccine Critics Turn Defensive Over Measles [W:1210]

    http://www.nytimes.com/2015/02/02/us...T.nav=top-news

    But it is back. In 2014, there were 644 cases in 27 states, according to the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention. Should the pace set in January continue, the numbers could go still higher in 2015. While no one is known to have died in the new outbreaks, the lethal possibilities cannot be shrugged off. If the past is a guide, one or two of every 1,000 infected people will not survive.

    To explore how matters reached this pass, Retro Report, a series of video documentaries studying major news stories of the past and their consequences, offers this special episode. It turns on a seminal moment in anti-vaccination resistance. This was an announcement in 1998 by a British doctor who said he had found a relationship between the M.M.R. vaccine — measles, mumps, rubella — and the onset of autism.
    Quote Originally Posted by Fenton View Post
    Hillary is the only defense I or anyone else needs.
    Quote Originally Posted by apdst View Post
    Not once have I showed my dick to a woman and she thought it was creepy. In fact, in 100% of the cases, they were pretty excited about it. I don't know who you're showing your **** too.

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    re: Vaccine Critics Turn Defensive Over Measles [W:1210]

    Quote Originally Posted by Lakryte View Post
    Coming from the guy who calls people butthurt instead of addressing the actual argument

    Move along.
    You should definitely try putting some ice on where it hurts.

    I didnt offer the '95%' figure but as the CDC itself admitted that its current vaccine is inefficient.
    The current vaccine is known to be ineffective for aprox 52% of the current strain of flu virus.
    Flu shot may not be enough protection this season - CBS News
    HAN Archive - 00374|Health Alert Network (HAN)
    The absolute risk reduction between the vaccines for senior citizens was 0.46% (1.89%-1.43%) even after increasing the dosage by four times the initial amount. Its sold as being 24% more effective than the ORIGINAL vaccine...which was determined to be ineffective.
    http://www.medscape.com/viewarticle/818438
    Navy study indicates 96% of flu sufferers received flu shots.
    Navy Proves Flu Shot Doesn't Work

    None of this is to suggest vaccines are bad or ineffective, just that they are not always the panacea some might think they are.

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    re: Vaccine Critics Turn Defensive Over Measles [W:1210]

    Quote Originally Posted by JANFU View Post
    It has been explained on a number of posts- elderly - those with immune disorders - those receiving cancer treatments - those that are to young for vaccinations - vaccination degrade over time - vaccinations are not 100 % effective.
    Is that who has been contracting the measles during this latest outbreak?

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    re: Vaccine Critics Turn Defensive Over Measles [W:1210]

    Quote Originally Posted by paddymcdougall View Post
    Given your lack of compassion, I am glad you are not the one deciding vaccination policy for the nation. .
    Wait... I am the one worried about innocent children being subjected to vaccine adverse reactions and I am the one lacking compassion? What a crock of ****.

    Nope... the ones that don't seem to give a **** that my daughter almost died or that she should be an accepted loss are the ****ing pieces of **** that lack compassion, my young uneducated friend.
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    re: Vaccine Critics Turn Defensive Over Measles [W:1210]

    Quote Originally Posted by Sherman123 View Post
    Unless she had an allergic reaction no she didn't. There is no connection between vaccines and ADHD or SIDS.
    Well, she did. Sorry to break it to you bud. And she did not have SIDS and does not have ADHD either...
    Quote Originally Posted by Bucky View Post
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    Quote Originally Posted by Absentglare View Post
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    re: Vaccine Critics Turn Defensive Over Measles [W:1210]

    Quote Originally Posted by Bodhisattva View Post
    What is weird is that it is the Liberals blindly defending vaccines here... In the area where we had our kids it was very liberal and those were the ones staunchly against vaccines...
    I don't see it as a liberal/conservative issue at all.

    It's an idiot versus normal issue.
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    ...I'm not interested in debating someone who is trolling for an argument....
    Quote Originally Posted by Papa bull View Post
    I see a big problem with the idea that whatever the majority wants is OK.

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