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Thread: Vaccine Critics Turn Defensive Over Measles [W:1210]

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    re: Vaccine Critics Turn Defensive Over Measles [W:1210]

    Quote Originally Posted by ReverendHellh0und View Post
    Overall I agree with you, if your non actions puts others at harm, it needs to be addressed. I still see it for what it is though. hype, but good will come out of this hype. maybe even prevent that which I don't think is so, but could be.

    if that makes sense.
    I gotcha Rev. I'm not one to buy into hysteria over "the latest news", but this concerns me, for the reasons I already noted.

    I hope good will come of this one.
    I don't attack my constituents. Bob is my constituent now.
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    re: Vaccine Critics Turn Defensive Over Measles [W:1210]

    Don't work out, work in.

    Never eat anything that's served in a bucket.

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    re: Vaccine Critics Turn Defensive Over Measles [W:1210]

    Quote Originally Posted by Ockham View Post
    Thanks!
    But here is yet another case not caused by illegal immigrants
    Anti-vaccine megachurch hit with measles epidemic, now offering free*vaccinations

    Eagle Mountain International Church, about 50 miles northwest of Dallas, released a statement Tuesday that said a visitor attended a service who had been overseas and was exposed to measles.
    “Therefore the congregation, staff at Kenneth Copeland Ministries and the daycare center on the property were exposed through that contact,” the statement said.
    And now this previously anti-vaccine church is - offering vaccines. Too bad they didn't do it before people got sick.

    Another article about this outbreak
    http://thescoopblog.dallasnews.com/2...ain-lake.html/

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    re: Vaccine Critics Turn Defensive Over Measles [W:1210]

    Re ebola vs. measles -

    The reaction to ebola was way overblown.

    But the reaction to people not vaccinating their kids for measles, mumps, polio and chicken pox is NOT overblown. These diseases are much more likely to get you sick - and possibly kill you - than ebola in our country.

    And yes, flu is also a problem and we should all get our flu shots (although I admit I'm hit and miss for that one).

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    re: Vaccine Critics Turn Defensive Over Measles [W:1210]

    Quote Originally Posted by paddymcdougall View Post
    But here is yet another case not caused by illegal immigrants
    I'm sure there are many. Logic dictates if non-immigrants can cause an outbreak then immigrants could also start an outbreak.
    I think if Thomas Jefferson were looking down, the author of the Bill of Rights, on whats being proposed here, hed agree with it. He would agree that the First Amendment cannot be absolute. - Chuck Schumer (D). Yet, Madison and Mason wrote the Bill of Rights, according to Sheila Jackson Lee, 400 years ago. Yup, it's a fact.


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    re: Vaccine Critics Turn Defensive Over Measles [W:1210]

    Quote Originally Posted by HenryChinaski View Post
    WHO and the CDC disagree with your statement. And the numbers are what they are because of vaccination.
    But their numbers don't.

    Statistically, measles is not even close to a huge danger to humanity.
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    re: Vaccine Critics Turn Defensive Over Measles [W:1210]

    Quote Originally Posted by Ockham View Post
    That's a nice strawman - I'm not claiming they caused the recent outbreaks, however I'm saying it's possible.
    That's quite a limb you've crawled out on - it's possible! You know what else is possible - Bilderberg Group. They're manufacturing the crisis to get us all to take vaccinations that will kill us and reduce the world population to just enough to service their needs.

    Of course I have. I showed you the last 4 years of vaccinations according to Henry's link showing the % of vaccinations for the 3 countries. You ignored it.
    I didn't ignore it - I addressed it directly and explained why knowing that number tells us nothing. You can address my comment if you want!

    I'm not trying to prove it's them - I'm seeking the facts. Since you're into being outrageous, how much is the government paying you to post misinformation on forums? See that's what I'm talking about, you're opinion is based on partial information and you've made your mind up and nothing will change it not even science and facts.
    Obviously I went in search of evidence and posted what I found. You can do the same - it's how this works.

    You just ridiculed the possibility... let me quote you:
    What I ridiculed was the idea that saying something is possible is a meaningful statement in this context. The list of possible culprits is almost literally endless - millions of individuals traveling from abroad into this country, who came into contact with millions more overseas.

    Incorrect - by excluding the missing facts that WOULD prove your obviously false and misleading statement, your being dishonest. I've asked for evidence that these illegals were vaccinated - you haven't provided it. Therefore the possibility exists they HAVE spread the disease. No there's no direct evidence but the lack thereof requires an answer and you only are providing opinions because you mind is made up.
    This is the weirdest debate. I read that and actually have no idea what we're debating. It's surely not that "these illegals" were vaccinated - which is of course impossible to prove. And because I can't meet this impossible burden, you think you've made a meaningful point that it's POSSIBLE an illegal caused some unknown outbreak of some unknown disease, which is obviously true. But of course it would be possible even if the vaccination rate was 100%, which I've pointed out.

    You have a very nice opinion, based on nothing... but don't let that stop you from making statements out of ignorance. You don't have the facts and therefore your opinion is just that... an opinion based on nada.
    Well, nothing and CDC data, which indicate the ground zero patients were NOT from the countries you claim are the origin of most illegals, so there is that!


    The only thing you settled is your opinion .... until the rest of the facts can be gathered, anyone who makes a statement that these illegals who were dispersed across America could have brought with them disease, could be right. I know for a fact they are not wrong - because you have done nothing to prove them wrong. The evidence you provided actually strengthens their case so I'd suggest you post more unfounded opinions and less links.
    Good point, and anyone who makes a claim that Chinese spies dispersed across America could have brought with them disease, could be right.
    Last edited by JasperL; 02-06-15 at 04:29 PM.

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    re: Vaccine Critics Turn Defensive Over Measles [W:1210]

    Quote Originally Posted by Gina View Post
    There is a reason the measles vaccine was developed. Receiving "a natural immunity" is not without risks.

    Measles are highly contagious:


    Complications:


    Measles | Transmission | CDC

    Also, babies don't receive their first measles vaccination until 12 months. They can at 6 months if they are going out of the country. So your child, not be vaccinated poses a risk to most infants under a year or those people with compromised immune systems. Like children undergoing chemo, or those on immunosuppressant drugs for other reasons. And that why some of us are more than a little concerned.
    Nice post.

    I would just like to add that when a child who has the measles gets pneumonia ( your stats said one out of every 20 ) dies, the cause of death is often recorded as pneumonia , not the measles which was directly the cause of pneumonia.
    When it comes to matters of reproduce health, Politicians and the religious dogma of another faith should never interfere with religious liberty of an individual or her faith.

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    re: Vaccine Critics Turn Defensive Over Measles [W:1210]

    Quote Originally Posted by Tettsuo View Post
    But their numbers don't.

    Statistically, measles is not even close to a huge danger to humanity.
    The reason being is the current rate of immunization. The death toll is still extremely high for a disease that immunization can control. The less people who get vaccinated, the more who die from it.
    Give a man a fish and he can eat for a day. Teach a man to fish and he can sit in a boat, drinking beer all day while you fool around with his Woman.

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    re: Vaccine Critics Turn Defensive Over Measles [W:1210]

    Quote Originally Posted by JasperL View Post
    That's quite a limb you've crawled out on - it's possible!
    You know it's also possible but that's been my point the entire time - you don't have the facts, these illegals didn't bring copies of their vaccination history. Easy.

    Quote Originally Posted by JasperL View Post
    I didn't ignore it - I addressed it directly and explained why knowing that number tells us nothing. You can address my comment if you want!
    It tells us as much as your CDC links tell us, I guess according to you also nothing.

    Quote Originally Posted by JasperL View Post
    Obviously I went in search of evidence and posted what I found. You can do the same - it's how this works.
    At least be accurate; you made an accusation and built up data that fits your opinion. That's not the same as found facts and forming an opinion.

    Quote Originally Posted by JasperL View Post
    What I ridiculed was the idea that saying something is possible is a meaningful statement in this context.
    Given the amount of basic information you don't have and that you don't WANT to have because it may contradict your opinion, I can see why. Ridicule that which you do not understand.

    Quote Originally Posted by JasperL View Post
    It's surely not that "these illegals" were vaccinated - which is of course impossible to prove. And because I can't meet this impossible burden, you think you've made a meaningful point that it's POSSIBLE an illegal caused some unknown outbreak of some unknown disease, which is obviously true. But of course it would be possible even if the vaccination rate was 100%, which I've pointed out.
    It's about logic and facts - you right saying the burden of facts we don't know is almost impossible in the public domain. What we maybe can agree on is there are no absolutes in this debate - could illegals have brought disease into the US? Sure. Could US citizens have done the same by refusing vaccinations? Sure.

    Quote Originally Posted by JasperL View Post
    Well, nothing and CDC data, which indicate the ground zero patients were NOT from the countries you claim are the origin of most illegals, so there is that!
    Touche!

    Quote Originally Posted by JasperL View Post
    Good point, and anyone who makes a claim that Chinese spies dispersed across America could have brought with them disease, could be right.
    I'm reminded of the Chinese Exclusion Act... de ja vu.
    I think if Thomas Jefferson were looking down, the author of the Bill of Rights, on whats being proposed here, hed agree with it. He would agree that the First Amendment cannot be absolute. - Chuck Schumer (D). Yet, Madison and Mason wrote the Bill of Rights, according to Sheila Jackson Lee, 400 years ago. Yup, it's a fact.


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