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Thread: Greece’s new prime minister wants Germany to pay for Nazi war crimes

  1. #41
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    Re: Greece’s new prime minister wants Germany to pay for Nazi war crimes

    Quote Originally Posted by Fenton View Post
    . . . . . Everyone can see through this childish and chicken **** attempt to demonize a Nation who just happens to be their biggest creditor.

    Greece should just tell Germany and their banks that they're not getting their money back and be done with it.
    And that is the whole story in a nutshell.

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    Re: Greece’s new prime minister wants Germany to pay for Nazi war crimes

    Quote Originally Posted by cpwill View Post
    the modern German state didn't occupy Greece anymore than the modern Italian state occupied Germany.



    Greece is angrily grasping at straws, throwing a tantrum to refuse to acknowledge that the gravy train can end. I look forward to seeing how it goes for them.
    Yes, this is a political ploy by the new govt there. But they do have a point...

    i guess postwar germany shouldn't have paid poland that $640 billion either huh. Just encouraged a gravy train of laziness, after destroying 60% of poland's industry and murdering 16% of its citizens, amiright. Why should poland be reimbursed but not greece ever?

    The fact postwar germany from the start neglected to at least attempt to compensate for 6 million deaths in the camps isn't a defense for not having to do so now either. If anything, it makes them more guilty.

    There's still people alive today who endured the nazi occupation, quite unlike ancient rome. If some of the debt owed by Greece extends into 1940s, why should Greece be any more responsible to pay that debt than germany is to pay for the destruction its armies wrought in an unprovoked attack?

    Crazy analogies is not the best strategy to deflate the point that indeed, a nation with boundaries, ancestry, language, and government offices identical to that of mere decades ago should have to atone and pay reparations for the crimes against humanity committed mere decades ago. I mean does rome still have a ceasar? Does the population speak latin? Was anything destroyed in germania 2000 years ago even worth anything and would it still be around?

    Frankly germany should kiss ass that the Morgenthau Plan didn't go into effect, which would have sent it back to middle ages.

    The real question to me is whether greece still suffers in some way economically due to the invasion in 1940. If not, the only liability would be reparations to individuals still living who suffered, or their children who lost parents etc, basically a normal lawsuit where the responsible party pays damages.

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    Re: Greece’s new prime minister wants Germany to pay for Nazi war crimes

    Quote Originally Posted by Red_Dave View Post
    Why is Greece responsible for debt accured 20 years ago and Germany not responsible for a war that happened 70 years ago? When is the cut off date? (indeed Haiti was still repaying France for the slaves it lost during the revolution untill 1948) Syriza has never insisted on complete non payment , just on renegotiation. Which should be accepted by a nation that had its own debt written off by Spain (ironically) and benefitted substantially from the Marshall plan after the war it started, whereas Greece got nothing despite suffering some of the heaviest losses from a conflict in which it was a victim.


    there's no room for logic and actual historical context, when rhetoric, vitriol, and general ignorance can be bandied about


    /proud to have predicted the day after election he would do this
    // was laughed on

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    Re: Greece’s new prime minister wants Germany to pay for Nazi war crimes

    Quote Originally Posted by chromium View Post

    The real question to me is whether greece still suffers in some way economically due to the invasion in 1940. If not, the only liability would be reparations to individuals still living who suffered, or their children who lost parents etc, basically a normal lawsuit where the responsible party pays damages.


    Considering the war created (some say it was fomenting prior) the real impetus of a power vaccuum that allowed return of the Monarchy and then the later WvE proxy state idealism ColdWar via the Greek Civil War, which in turn created a political, and economic destabilization of the country until the end of the junta and fall of the Monarchy... nearly 30 years later (almost 2 lost generations).

    Uh yes.

  5. #45
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    Re: Greece’s new prime minister wants Germany to pay for Nazi war crimes

    Quote Originally Posted by cpwill View Post
    that's what they want to do. But the children of holocaust victims are now lining up, and I understand German reticence to extend the benefit ad nauseum.
    wow how christian of you, attacking the children of holocaust victims....oh wait, carry on

    usual tactic of the guilty who don't regret their actions: Let's avoid paying our victims until they die off, then we can claim too much time has passed! Let's not pay reparations to slaves, and when the jim crow era blacks die, we can mock their children as leeches whining for handouts too!

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    Re: Greece’s new prime minister wants Germany to pay for Nazi war crimes

    Quote Originally Posted by chromium View Post
    Yes, this is a political ploy by the new govt there. But they do have a point...
    I call BS. If this was an actual issue for the Greeks, they've had decades to bring it up.

    i guess postwar germany shouldn't have paid poland that $640 billion either huh. Just encouraged a gravy train of laziness, after destroying 60% of poland's industry and murdering 16% of its citizens, amiright. Why should poland be reimbursed but not greece ever?

    The fact postwar germany from the start neglected to at least attempt to compensate for 6 million deaths in the camps isn't a defense for not having to do so now either. If anything, it makes them more guilty.

    There's still people alive today who endured the nazi occupation, quite unlike ancient rome. If some of the debt owed by Greece extends into 1940s, why should Greece be any more responsible to pay that debt than germany is to pay for the destruction its armies wrought in an unprovoked attack?

    Crazy analogies is not the best strategy to deflate the point that indeed, a nation with boundaries, ancestry, language, and government offices identical to that of mere decades ago should have to atone and pay reparations for the crimes against humanity committed mere decades ago. I mean does rome still have a ceasar? Does the population speak latin? Was anything destroyed in germania 2000 years ago even worth anything and would it still be around?

    Frankly germany should kiss ass that the Morgenthau Plan didn't go into effect, which would have sent it back to middle ages.
    No. We tried that in 1918, remember? It would have sent them straight into WWIII.

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    Re: Greece’s new prime minister wants Germany to pay for Nazi war crimes

    Quote Originally Posted by chromium View Post
    wow how christian of you, attacking the children of holocaust victims....oh wait, carry on

    usual tactic of the guilty who don't regret their actions: Let's avoid paying our victims until they die off, then we can claim too much time has passed! Let's not pay reparations to slaves, and when the jim crow era blacks die, we can mock their children as leeches whining for handouts too!
    .....not sure if self-parodying, or actually just truly that intellectually disconnected.....

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    Re: Greece’s new prime minister wants Germany to pay for Nazi war crimes

    Quote Originally Posted by cpwill View Post
    I call BS. If this was an actual issue for the Greeks, they've had decades to bring it up.
    they probably did but weren't so on the verge of bankruptcy that they were willing to make international scene about it.

    Quote Originally Posted by cpwill View Post
    No. We tried that in 1918, remember? It would have sent them straight into WWIII.
    versailles? Well the whole point of Morgenthau was to absolutely cripple the german industry so they can never wage war again. Some of the advisers were eagerly anticipating turning germany into agrarian country. However, when this leaked it sort of backfired because Goebbels used it to inspire germans to fight to the end.

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    Re: Greece’s new prime minister wants Germany to pay for Nazi war crimes

    Quote Originally Posted by cpwill View Post
    .....not sure if self-parodying, or actually just truly that intellectually disconnected.....
    right, you're not at all playing into hands of the holocaust deniers and enablers by saying "too much time has passed, no one has to ever pay for this atrocity"

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    Re: Greece’s new prime minister wants Germany to pay for Nazi war crimes

    Quote Originally Posted by chromium View Post
    right, you're not at all playing into hands of the holocaust deniers and enablers by saying "too much time has passed, no one has to ever pay for this atrocity"
    Yup. It was definitely the second.

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