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Thread: Kochs Plan to Spend $900 Million on 2016 Campaign

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    Re: Kochs Plan to Spend $900 Million on 2016 Campaign

    Quote Originally Posted by ReverendHellh0und View Post
    That's not what a strawman is, you could try to claim it's a red herring, but it's not one of those either.
    I assumed the point was us libs don't like Koch spending, but approve of Soros spending ====>>> hypocrites!! The premise is false and any conclusions drawn on that false premise equally false, hence, straw man.

    But the question has been asked and every time the left on this thread have said we're against big money in elections, period. Soros AND Koch brothers, Buffett AND Dimon, and while we're at it, unions AND NRA subject to same rules. Etc.

    IF you care about him, can you show me one thread by the left attacking him like they did these koke people.
    Look back in this one.

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    Re: Kochs Plan to Spend $900 Million on 2016 Campaign

    Quote Originally Posted by JasperL View Post
    I assumed the point was us libs don't like Koch spending, but approve of Soros spending ====>>> hypocrites!! The premise is false and any conclusions drawn on that false premise equally false, hence, straw man.

    But the question has been asked and every time the left on this thread have said we're against big money in elections, period. Soros AND Koch brothers, Buffett AND Dimon, and while we're at it, unions AND NRA subject to same rules. Etc.



    Look back in this one.


    Then why start a thread on only the other guys?
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    Re: Kochs Plan to Spend $900 Million on 2016 Campaign

    Quote Originally Posted by CanadaJohn View Post
    I take it, from your comments, that you strongly oppose the corporate ownership of virtually all US media, print and over the air, creating their "nationwide effort to manipulate policy" in the manner they prefer. Correct?
    That is definitely correct. There used to be laws to prevent these sorts of things. It's not about bigger government - it's about areas in which the removal of government oversight has led to insanity.
    A working class hero is something to be

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    Re: Kochs Plan to Spend $900 Million on 2016 Campaign

    Quote Originally Posted by Conservative View Post
    CEO's have major job responsibilities and are the job creators, what do Union bosses create? You think union members have any idea what their leadership makes?
    First of all, since no CEO sets out to "create jobs" and hires as few workers as possible, and not all companies "create jobs", "job creator" is just a Luntzism.

    And I would expect my union's president to make several times more than me as long as he's doing his job.
    Anyone wondering what I'm talking about start here:
    The Psychology of Persuasion

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    Re: Kochs Plan to Spend $900 Million on 2016 Campaign

    Quote Originally Posted by What if...? View Post
    Do you have a city for the hundreds of millions in dues to Seiu from a single program? That doesn't sound right as dues generally run a few percent.
    Yes I do.

    There are currently over 350,000 caregivers being paid by the state to provide in home support services to the elderly and others who need it. The California state legislature passed a law many years ago that classified these caregivers as state employees and immediately the SEIU/UDW was the Union assigned to represent these new "state" workers.

    The state of California withholds dues from the compensation given to these caregivers and sends it directly to the SEIU/UDW.

    Here is an article that appeared in the LA Times in 2009 that brought this issue to light for me. I have met with my state representative to discuss this program. Her name was Bonnie Lowenthal, and she is a nothing but a union bought shill.

    Fraud infects state in-home care program - Los Angeles Times

    Here is a more recent article on the union money generation project.

    When Home Caregivers Kill the Elderly With Neglect - The Atlantic

    California’s $7.3 billion IHSS program is the largest publicly funded caregiver program in the nation. The caseload has more than doubled since 2001 and now serves about 490,000 low-income clients throughout the state.


    At present, the current SEIU dues are based on hours worked. Here is a link to a dues structure as a point of reference.

    Resources

    So, $20/mo X 350,000 X 12 months = $84,000,000/yr. These dues collections have been going on since before 2009. So call it $50 million for 5 years. That's $250 million in dues paid for by taxpayers in California. This is a real number as it wasn't rejected by Ms. Lowenthal.

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    Re: Kochs Plan to Spend $900 Million on 2016 Campaign

    Quote Originally Posted by Conservative View Post
    And that warrants 6 digit salaries and benefits paid for out of union dues? Where does the CEO wages and benefits come from? Negotiating must be extremely hard work and I always thought the courts upheld contracts?
    Again, there seems to be selective outage over union leaders earning six figure salaries for organizing workers, while maintaining an apologist stance for CEOs earning seven or eight figures for organizing workers.
    "The side that stays within its fortifications is beaten." ~Napoleon

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    Re: Kochs Plan to Spend $900 Million on 2016 Campaign

    Quote Originally Posted by What if...? View Post
    First of all, since no CEO sets out to "create jobs" and hires as few workers as possible, and not all companies "create jobs", "job creator" is just a Luntzism.

    And I would expect my union's president to make several times more than me as long as he's doing his job.


    I mean come on. You post is ridiculous. No CEO sets out to "create jobs"? A bit of a union tainted slice of hyperbole don't you think?

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    Re: Kochs Plan to Spend $900 Million on 2016 Campaign

    Quote Originally Posted by JasperL View Post
    I'll just say lots of informed, intelligent, reasonable people have major disagreements about what is right for the country, and have had similar disagreements for generations at least. Beyond that I'm not sure how to respond. It's like we're having two different conversations.
    I apologize for wandering off topic.

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    Re: Kochs Plan to Spend $900 Million on 2016 Campaign

    Quote Originally Posted by Unrepresented View Post
    Again, there seems to be selective outage over union leaders earning six figure salaries for organizing workers, while maintaining an apologist stance for CEOs earning seven or eight figures for organizing workers.
    CEOs don't organize workers. They manage payroll, marketing, sales, R&D, finance, technology, vendors, customer relations, development, etc. etc. etc.

    And unions workers have jobs because someone hires them. Very often, businesses with CEOs.
    Horse sense is the thing a horse has which keeps it from betting on people. ~W.C. Fields

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    Re: Kochs Plan to Spend $900 Million on 2016 Campaign

    Quote Originally Posted by tres borrachos View Post
    CEOs don't organize workers. They manage payroll, marketing, sales, R&D, finance, technology, vendors, customer relations, development, etc. etc. etc.

    And unions workers have jobs because someone hires them. Very often, businesses with CEOs.
    They're both organizing disorganization, they're just doing it for different reasons. They're more common than you're willing to admit.
    "The side that stays within its fortifications is beaten." ~Napoleon

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