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Thread: Cuba leaves talks on US ties insisting it won't make major changes to its system

  1. #61
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    Re: Cuba leaves talks on US ties insisting it won't make major changes to its system

    Quote Originally Posted by clownboy View Post
    We weren't embargoing China.
    You sure about this?

    American Experience . Nixon's China Game . Timeline | PBS

    Look at December 8th, 1950. Tell me what happened in 1971 and then 1972. When you're done with that, you're welcome to continue spewing nonsense devoid of any historical accuracy.

    Quote Originally Posted by clownboy View Post
    Let the embargo continue until Cuba changes it's government.
    Did we ask China to change its government before we lifted the US trade embargo?
    I refuse to accept the view that mankind is so tragically bound to the starless midnight of racism and war that the bright daybreak of peace and brotherhood can never become a reality. - MLK

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    Re: Cuba leaves talks on US ties insisting it won't make major changes to its system

    Quote Originally Posted by Lursa View Post
    For one thng, it's hypocritical and useless to do so.

    And second, we look weak because we've been trying to 'use' our might thru isolation for decades and failed.
    How is it at all hypocritical? All the examples you've given to support that reflection have been debunked. And secondly, no. The only failure in that would be ending the embargo now and with absolutely no reason to do so.

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    Re: Cuba leaves talks on US ties insisting it won't make major changes to its system

    Quote Originally Posted by Hatuey View Post
    You sure about this?

    American Experience . Nixon's China Game . Timeline | PBS

    Look at December 8th, 1950. Tell me what happened in 1971 and then 1972. When you're done with that, you're welcome to continue spewing nonsense devoid of any historical accuracy.



    Did we ask China to change its government before we lifted the US trade embargo?
    China is not sitting off our shores, nor does Cuba have a sizeable market we were trying to break in to.

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    Re: Cuba leaves talks on US ties insisting it won't make major changes to its system

    Quote Originally Posted by Lursa View Post
    So it's not about right or wrong, just what's convenient? And screw them if they dont have anything to offer us? Fine...then lift the artificial, useless restrictions that make us look even more weak (since they didnt work) and hypocritical.
    Our Sanctions have worked just fine, the Cuban leadership simply doesn't care.

    This is like saying if you have a kid who's using drugs, and then asks you for money, which they promptly use for drugs, you shouldn't cut them off.

    because if you cut them off and for ten years they keep using drugs then your sanction is silly and useless. The Cubans could've ended the embargo at any time. they chose not to. their loss.

    Now what are we going to do? we now have a reputation of a country that's a pushover. Obama is literally the worst foreign policy negotiator known to man. this is on top of the Successful withdrawal from Iraq, the Red line in the sand, protests over a youtube video that hadn't even been released at that time (but what difference does that make?) the JV team, and the fact that the Baghdad government is providing the arms to the kurds we've asked them to right?

    this whole administration has been a foreign policy disaster. the next president will have to take drastic action to restore our international standing.

    Remember when TR sent the THE GREAT WHITE FLEET well neither does anyone else, that's the problem.....

    It's not at all hypocritical to set conditions that a western country right off our shore adopt a constitutional republic. Saudi is a country of Arabic heritage, if you've studied the history of that people you wouldn't be surprised at how they are today

    and they are the spiritual head of a faith of 1.5 billion people, Cuba is not. for it to be hypocrisy we would have to be comparing apples to apples. Saudi v cuba is a mustard seed to pumpkin comparison...
    Quote Originally Posted by Dr. Chuckles View Post
    No one cares about your stupid hippy logic
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    Re: Cuba leaves talks on US ties insisting it won't make major changes to its system

    Quote Originally Posted by Fletch View Post
    Because we didn't do it with those countries is not a reason to repeat the mistake. I don't have a problem with opening relations with Cuba. But I think we could have and should have made it contingent upon some concessions on rights and democracy in that country.
    It is not our business to tell other countries what their govt should be. We tend to fail miserably and it's very hypocritical since we only do what is in our best interests...like CHina. And look at the change there with normalizing foreign relations?
    Quote Originally Posted by Bucky View Post
    I have felt pain when I was in the womb. So when you say they are incapable of feeling pain, that is based on junk science.
    Quote Originally Posted by applejuicefool View Post
    A murderer putting a bullet through someone's brain is a medical procedure too.

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    Re: Cuba leaves talks on US ties insisting it won't make major changes to its system

    Quote Originally Posted by clownboy View Post
    China is not sitting off our shores, nor does Cuba have a sizeable market we were trying to break in to.
    Look, you just got caught making history up. Quite literally. You claimed we weren't embargoing China. We most definitely were. All you needed to do was pick up a history book to know that. However, you didn't and now you're looking REALLY bad trying to segway into another ridiculous argument. I've done my job, can you do yours and admit you REALLY didn't know what you were talking about?
    I refuse to accept the view that mankind is so tragically bound to the starless midnight of racism and war that the bright daybreak of peace and brotherhood can never become a reality. - MLK

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    Re: Cuba leaves talks on US ties insisting it won't make major changes to its system

    Quote Originally Posted by clownboy View Post
    How is it at all hypocritical? All the examples you've given to support that reflection have been debunked. And secondly, no. The only failure in that would be ending the embargo now and with absolutely no reason to do so.
    Didnt see a single, 'debunk.' LOL

    People can write stuff, doesnt mean it's true.

    And having a more open, prosperous country off our borders is certainly a greater advantage than the current situation.

    We have failed for 50 yrs, now we can look magnanimous and make some moves that enable Cuba to open up economically and in terms of human rights. We arent forcing regime change, but making efforts that will enable it.
    Quote Originally Posted by Bucky View Post
    I have felt pain when I was in the womb. So when you say they are incapable of feeling pain, that is based on junk science.
    Quote Originally Posted by applejuicefool View Post
    A murderer putting a bullet through someone's brain is a medical procedure too.

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    Re: Cuba leaves talks on US ties insisting it won't make major changes to its system

    Quote Originally Posted by EMNofSeattle View Post
    Our Sanctions have worked just fine,
    Exactly what have the sanctions accomplished?
    What bounty has the USofA reaped? Besides looking like idiots.

    Flip side of that is, open trade and travel with Cuba and jobs get created, money flows, and capitalism works. Isn't that what so many of you want?

    People in the USofA can start importing and exporting stuff to Cuba. More business.

    Win-win.
    Wastin' time, like it was free - Godsmack

    Quote Originally Posted by Bucky View Post
    I have felt pain when I was in the womb. So when you say they are incapable of feeling pain, that is based on junk science.

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    Re: Cuba leaves talks on US ties insisting it won't make major changes to its system

    Quote Originally Posted by Hatuey View Post
    Look, you just got caught making history up. Quite literally. You claimed we weren't embargoing China. We most definitely were. All you needed to do was pick up a history book to know that. However, you didn't and now you're looking REALLY bad trying to segway into another ridiculous argument. I've done my job, can you do yours and admit you REALLY didn't know what you were talking about?
    Oh good grief, stalk someone else. Okay, I was wrong, we were embargoing China. So? China has billions of customers and we really wanted into that market. We're talking about Cuba here and you still utterly fail in showing any sort of compelling reason to end their embargo.

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    Re: Cuba leaves talks on US ties insisting it won't make major changes to its system

    Quote Originally Posted by Lursa View Post
    Didnt see a single, 'debunk.' LOL

    People can write stuff, doesnt mean it's true.

    And having a more open, prosperous country off our borders is certainly a greater advantage than the current situation.

    We have failed for 50 yrs, now we can look magnanimous and make some moves that enable Cuba to open up economically and in terms of human rights. We arent forcing regime change, but making efforts that will enable it.
    Well then, we can open up relations when they become open and prosperous. We haven't failed for 50 years, Cuba has. There is no advantage for us to change the policy.

    And of course you haven't seen a single debunk, you're married to the argument that the US is the world's big brother and if their economies are failing we need to step in.
    Last edited by clownboy; 01-26-15 at 02:59 PM.

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