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Thread: House GOP drops controversial abortion bill ahead of Roe v. Wade anniversary

  1. #221
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    Re: House GOP drops controversial abortion bill ahead of Roe v. Wade anniversary

    Quote Originally Posted by Lursa View Post
    So my question is, how is treating women as less than the unborn "better for society?" That is devaluing women. It absolutely is. It is telling them that their lives and futures are LESS important than the unborn. How does that not devalue them? That they are not equal to the various developmental stages of humans before birth?
    Since restricting / banning abortion decidedly does not treat women as less than the unborn, but instead treats the unborn as equal to any other human being such that you cannot kill them in aggression, your entire post is a massive non sequitur.

    J-mac on here has continually posted that if women want to have sex, even married or using bc, they deserve to be punished with a kid
    You are lying. He said no such thing even once, let alone "continually."

    Only you pro-aborts view a kid as punishment.

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    Re: House GOP drops controversial abortion bill ahead of Roe v. Wade anniversary

    Quote Originally Posted by j-mac View Post
    That's not true at all Minnie...As a father of two, one girl, and one boy, whom are now grown, and going through school, I told both of them the same thing...And that is the same thing my father and mother drilled into me and my sister...That the act of sex will result in creating a child, and that their dreams, and their goals in life stop at that moment. That when they make the decision to have sex, they at that moment they are making a decision to alter their life's path...

    It is beyond belief that you think that all women and their boyfriends/husbands should be condemned like that just because this what you believe should happen to someone...when it is preventable today by a safe medical procedure.

    Sex is a great thing, a wonderful thing to share. Some people are irresponsible, some get pregnant even on bc, but to deny married couples the right to freely have sex, even with bc, before they're ready for kids? What planet do you live on?

    Your idea hasnt worked for millenia. People arent going to have LESS sex now when there are more bc methods, much safer abortion, better protection from STDs? It's not going to happen.

    And just because I dont condemn those who have sex irresponsibly in these threads doesnt mean I dont have an extremely poor opinion of them. I have very strong personal feelings about that. However I dont let my personal judgements of individuals overshadow rationality when it comes to what's best for women and society overall. So my personal feelings have no impact on the discussion and neither should yours. But your entire argument is based on YOUR personal judgements and beliefs.
    Quote Originally Posted by Bucky View Post
    I have felt pain when I was in the womb. So when you say they are incapable of feeling pain, that is based on junk science.
    Quote Originally Posted by applejuicefool View Post
    A murderer putting a bullet through someone's brain is a medical procedure too.

  3. #223
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    Re: House GOP drops controversial abortion bill ahead of Roe v. Wade anniversary

    Quote Originally Posted by Lursa View Post
    It is beyond belief that you think that all women and their boyfriends/husbands should be condemned like that just because this what you believe should happen to someone
    No, it is not beyond belief to expect adults to take responsibility for their actions. Responsibility is not condemnation.

    I suppose it could be beyond your belief, provided you do not believe in personal responsibility.

  4. #224
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    Re: House GOP drops controversial abortion bill ahead of Roe v. Wade anniversary

    Quote Originally Posted by JayDubya View Post
    No, it is not beyond belief to expect adults to take responsibility for their actions. Responsibility is not condemnation.

    I suppose it could be beyond your belief, provided you do not believe in personal responsibility.
    You've been told many times that abortion is a responsible option.

    And that sounds like personal responsibility since the woman makes that choice.

    Perhaps this is another area where you need a dictionary for clarification? Lordy, the list is LONG.
    Quote Originally Posted by Bucky View Post
    I have felt pain when I was in the womb. So when you say they are incapable of feeling pain, that is based on junk science.
    Quote Originally Posted by applejuicefool View Post
    A murderer putting a bullet through someone's brain is a medical procedure too.

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    Re: House GOP drops controversial abortion bill ahead of Roe v. Wade anniversary

    Quote Originally Posted by JayDubya View Post
    Since restricting / banning abortion decidedly does not treat women as less than the unborn, but instead treats the unborn as equal to any other human being such that you cannot kill them in aggression, your entire post is a massive non sequitur.



    You are lying. He said no such thing even once, let alone "continually."

    Only you pro-aborts view a kid as punishment.
    No, they cannot be treated equally. That is a lie and no one has put forth a way that the the unborn can be treated equally with the born. The right to life does not supersede all others. That is a personal choice for people. They choose to give it up for freedom, **for their children**...yup, all the time, for their causes, for many reasons.

    It's pretty clear that he does consider a kid punishment since he "continually" claims to want the govt to force something on women they dont want. That is is punishment. Calling kids 'consequences' dehumanizes them. Saying you MUST have a kid you dont want and give up your goals in life? Punishment. Using it as a cudgel for women you consider sluts (he uses the classic 'she should have kept her legs closed.')....punishment for her 'bad' behavior.



    Quote Originally Posted by j-mac View Post
    Then she should have kept her legs closed.
    Quote Originally Posted by j-mac View Post
    It's probably too much to ask you why you think it is perfectly fine to snuff out a defenseless life because you ordered too many tequila shots one night, and decided that you'd have sex anyway before you were done putting your own life together...Why are you more entitled to life than that of a child?
    Quote Originally Posted by j-mac View Post
    That the act of sex will result in creating a child, and that their dreams, and their goals in life stop at that moment.
    Quote Originally Posted by Bucky View Post
    I have felt pain when I was in the womb. So when you say they are incapable of feeling pain, that is based on junk science.
    Quote Originally Posted by applejuicefool View Post
    A murderer putting a bullet through someone's brain is a medical procedure too.

  6. #226
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    Re: House GOP drops controversial abortion bill ahead of Roe v. Wade anniversary

    Quote Originally Posted by JayDubya View Post
    Idiotic straw man.
    That's what I thought. What you fail to understand is that you're not really anti-abortion, Jay. You're pro-control of womens' and girls' bodies. Because comprehensive sex ed and affordable, easily-accessible birth control are proven measures to reduce the number of abortions. Even j-mac sees that. But you do not. So you have nothing further to say on this matter that those of us who support a woman's right to choose will interpret as anything less than maintaining a system of power over women. That is what this issue is really all about.

    And as I said before--and I will not let this go until you get it--for a male to be vehemently arguing against a woman's right to choose is pure hypocrisy.
    "A man you can bait with a tweet is not a man we can trust with nuclear weapons." --Hillary Rodham Clinton
    "Innocent until proven guilty is for criminal convictions, not elections." --Mitt Romney

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    Re: House GOP drops controversial abortion bill ahead of Roe v. Wade anniversary

    Quote Originally Posted by Lursa View Post
    You've been told many times that abortion is a responsible option.

    And that sounds like personal responsibility since the woman makes that choice.

    Perhaps this is another area where you need a dictionary for clarification? Lordy, the list is LONG.
    The very same males who play the "responsibility" card when it comes to women and abortion tend to be rape apologists. "She was asking for it." "She was putting herself on display; he just couldn't resist." "If she hadn't been wearing such revealing clothing, none of this would have happened."

    By his logic, it's women who are the ones capable of responsibility, not men, cause men are just animals or something.
    "A man you can bait with a tweet is not a man we can trust with nuclear weapons." --Hillary Rodham Clinton
    "Innocent until proven guilty is for criminal convictions, not elections." --Mitt Romney

  8. #228
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    Re: House GOP drops controversial abortion bill ahead of Roe v. Wade anniversary

    Quote Originally Posted by Lursa View Post
    You've been told many times that abortion is a responsible option.
    And you've been told why that statement is completely wrong just as many times. Killing your own offspring in order to avoid your most basic parental obligations to them is the opposite of responsibility.

    Quote Originally Posted by Lursa View Post
    No, they cannot be treated equally. That is a lie
    As ever, the lie is yours. In this case, your fallacious assertion that humans cannot be treated equally.

    no one has put forth a way that the the unborn can be treated equally with the born
    Yes I have. Ban abortion.

    It's pretty clear that he does consider a kid punishment
    No, because he's not a pro-abort like you or Obama.

    since he "continually" claims to want the govt to force something on women they dont want.
    He wants the government to force people to have sex? Man, he sure hasn't said that in this thread, not once let alone continuously.

    That is is punishment.
    Parenthood is a punishment? Achem - "perhaps this is yet another area where you need to consult a dictionary - LORDY, that list is getting long."
    Last edited by JayDubya; 01-25-15 at 03:44 PM.

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    Re: House GOP drops controversial abortion bill ahead of Roe v. Wade anniversary

    Quote Originally Posted by JayDubya View Post

    As ever, the lie is yours. In this case, your fallacious assertion that humans cannot be treated equally.
    That is your opinion. Has nothing to do with the reality that they cannot be treated equally. Squawking that they can is not the same as explaining how legally without infringing on the rights of the mother.

    Quote Originally Posted by Lursa
    No, they cannot be treated equally. That is a lie and no one has put forth a way that the the unborn can be treated equally with the born. The right to life does not supersede all others. That is a personal choice for people. They choose to give it up for freedom, **for their children**...yup, all the time, for their causes, for many reasons.
    Get back to us when you have some actual legal basis for your 'opinion.' But at least stop lying.
    Quote Originally Posted by Bucky View Post
    I have felt pain when I was in the womb. So when you say they are incapable of feeling pain, that is based on junk science.
    Quote Originally Posted by applejuicefool View Post
    A murderer putting a bullet through someone's brain is a medical procedure too.

  10. #230
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    Re: House GOP drops controversial abortion bill ahead of Roe v. Wade anniversary

    Quote Originally Posted by Phys251 View Post
    That's what I thought. What you fail to understand is that you're not really anti-abortion, Jay.
    Yeah, I'm anti-abortion, because I'm against aggression and needless violence.

    You're pro-control of womens' and girls' bodies.
    Not in the least. Your batting average needs some work. Your kid's body is not your body. The ones who want some humans to have control over the bodies of others are pro-aborts like you.

    Because comprehensive sex ed and affordable, easily-accessible birth control are proven measures to reduce the number of abortions.
    So what? Doesn't justify stealing anyone's property to buy goods or services for others.

    And as I said before--and I will not let this go until you get it--for a male to be vehemently arguing against a woman's right to choose is pure hypocrisy.
    Your statement is blatantly sexist, but it's not surprising to see a pro-abort take a sexist stance like that.

    Quote Originally Posted by Phys251 View Post
    The very same males who play the "responsibility" card when it comes to women and abortion tend to be rape apologists.
    I like to play the "responsibility" card when it comes to all issues, but the responsibility for aggression and violence always falls on the ones involved in doing the aggression.

    In other words, there's an appropriate place for you to cram such ignorant generalizations.

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