U.S.: Putin's Peace Proposal for Ukraine is Nothing But 'Occupation Plan' [W:479]

Montecresto · Feb 13, 2015

Re: U.S.: Putin's Peace Proposal for Ukraine is Nothing But 'Occupation Plan'

Quag said:
BS stop lying.
Putin bribed coerced Yanukovych to refuse Euromaidan and insted try to seek closer ties to Russia. His own party ousted him and he fled to Russia.
When Putin had failed to get Ukraine this way he invaided using tropps who had removed their insignia, denying it for weeks until he had full control.
It had nothing to do with the US and everything to do with Putin.

I dismissed your lies sometime ago, forgotten that??????

JP Cusick · Feb 13, 2015

Re: U.S.: Putin's Peace Proposal for Ukraine is Nothing But 'Occupation Plan'

flogger said:
JP Cusick said:

So yes evidence and proof has been given for all here to see.

Click to expand...

Funny how nobody but you has seen it then ?

Well it is NOT "funny" that you keep failing to see it since it is posted many places in this thread.

Your refusal to acknowledge it does not change the reality that it has been given.

:failpail:

flogger · Feb 13, 2015

Re: U.S.: Putin's Peace Proposal for Ukraine is Nothing But 'Occupation Plan'

JP Cusick said:
Well it is NOT "funny" that you keep failing to see it since it is posted many places in this thread.

Your refusal to acknowledge it does not change the reality that it has been given.

:failpail:

So you outright refuse to post this proof of US culpability for the Ukrainian conflict despite multiple requests ? Unlike you I can back up the claims I make, Its what you are supposed do when challenged to on a debating forum

You should try it some time

JP Cusick · Feb 13, 2015

Re: U.S.: Putin's Peace Proposal for Ukraine is Nothing But 'Occupation Plan'

flogger said:
So you outright refuse to post this proof of US culpability for the Ukrainian conflict despite multiple requests ? Unlike you I can back up the claims I make, Its what you are supposed do when challenged to on a debating forum

You should try it some time

One of many #369 =

No one has ever refused you [proof as you have been given evidence and proof repeatedly in this thread.

flogger · Feb 13, 2015

Re: U.S.: Putin's Peace Proposal for Ukraine is Nothing But 'Occupation Plan'

JP Cusick said:
One of many #369 =

No one has ever refused you [proof as you have been given evidence and proof repeatedly in this thread.

Ho hum .... and # 376 again :roll:

The Ukraine crisis according to John J. Mearsheimer: Impeccable Logic, Wrong Facts

RealTime Economic Issues Watch | Is the West to Blame for Russia’s Aggression in Ukraine? Of Course Not!

Why John J. Mearsheimer is Wrong on Ukraine | Duck of Minerva

Department of "Huh?!" John J. Mearsheimer Thinks the West Caused the Ukraine Crisis?: The Honest Broker for the Week of September 19, 2014 - Washington Center for Equitable Growth

Your deeply flawed subjective opinion piece is proof of nothing but the opinion of the individual who wrote it and was comprehensively rebutted above no less than four times by four seperate other individuals.

You must have more than this straw left to repeatedly clutch at surely ?

Quag · Feb 13, 2015

Re: U.S.: Putin's Peace Proposal for Ukraine is Nothing But 'Occupation Plan'

Montecresto said:
I dismissed your lies sometime ago, forgotten that??????

Lol the guy making stuff up as he goes along calls the truth lies.

JP Cusick · Feb 13, 2015

Re: U.S.: Putin's Peace Proposal for Ukraine is Nothing But 'Occupation Plan'

flogger said:
You must have more than this straw left to repeatedly clutch at surely ?

The point is that you have been told, and so you have no business claiming that no one has told you.

In fact there are 51 pages of people telling you, and it is in your face and eyes.

Here you are being given a true and considerate opportunity to become enlightened, you have the option to become smarter and better informed, and it is offered to you free and clear as like on a silver platter (or silver screen).

It is just keeping your self blind which is just so unnecessary.

flogger · Feb 13, 2015

Re: U.S.: Putin's Peace Proposal for Ukraine is Nothing But 'Occupation Plan'

JP Cusick said:
The point is that you have been told, and so you have no business claiming that no one has told you.

Since when did opinion represent evidence ?

n fact there are 51 pages of people telling you, and it is in your face and eyes.

Yet this oft debunked opinion piece is still all you can find amongst them

Here you are being given a true and considerate opportunity to become enlightened, you have the option to become smarter and better informed, and it is offered to you free and clear as like on a silver platter (or silver screen).

On the contrary I've linked more hard fact supporting my position than almost anyone else has here

It is just keeping your self blind which is just so unnecessary.

I make no apologies for not being a bigot

JP Cusick · Feb 13, 2015

Re: U.S.: Putin's Peace Proposal for Ukraine is Nothing But 'Occupation Plan'

flogger said:
Since when did opinion represent evidence ?

I have seen this said before and I really do not get the point.

Everything is an opinion, as we are all humans and our opinions do count.

President Obama gives his opinion and President Putin gives his opinion and they count.

Unless you see your own opinions as facts while every other opinion is just an opinion, as if being an opinion degrades the truth which it does not.

In a Court trial people give their testimony based on their belief and understanding and opinions and it is "evidence" and opinions have always been evidence and always will be.

I figure that you are just trying to cop-out as if your own opinions are FACTS and then you can deny the truth given to you by others.

If you do not respect the opinions of others then the defect is in your self and not in our evidence.

Montecresto · Feb 13, 2015

Re: U.S.: Putin's Peace Proposal for Ukraine is Nothing But 'Occupation Plan'

JP Cusick said:
I have seen this said before and I really do not get the point.

Everything is an opinion, as we are all humans and our opinions do count.

President Obama gives his opinion and President Putin gives his opinion and they count.

Unless you see your own opinions as facts while every other opinion is just an opinion, as if being an opinion degrades the truth which it does not.

In a Court trial people give their testimony based on their belief and understanding and opinions and it is "evidence" and opinions have always been evidence and always will be.

I figure that you are just trying to cop-out as if your own opinions are FACTS and then you can deny the truth given to you by others.

If you do not respect the opinions of others then the defect is in your self and not in our evidence.

Yes, floggers opinions are fact.

flogger · Feb 13, 2015

Re: U.S.: Putin's Peace Proposal for Ukraine is Nothing But 'Occupation Plan'

JP Cusick said:
I have seen this said before and I really do not get the point.

Perhaps I should clarify that for you then. An opinion is a subjective interpretation a fact is not

Everything is an opinion, as we are all humans and our opinions do count.

Facts are not opinions

Unless you see your own opinions as facts while every other opinion is just an opinion, as if being an opinion degrades the truth which it does not.

The difference being I use facts to qualify my opinion rather than using the subjective interpretation of somebody else's opinions to buttress petty bigotries

In a Court trial people give their testimony based on their belief and understanding and opinions and it is "evidence" and opinions have always been evidence and always will be.

No evidence is evidence and can be incontravertibly recognised as such. Opinion is subjective and therefore open to multiple interpretation

I figure that you are just trying to cop-out as if your own opinions are FACTS and then you can deny the truth given to you by others.

I have at all times qualified my position using fact rather than opinion on this issue

If you do not respect the opinions of others then the defect is in your self and not in our evidence.

I respect verifiable fact over belief and opinion every time. It serves me well. You for example clearly believe the US is responsible for what has happened in Ukraine irrespective of the complete lack of facts or evidence that would support such a contention and based on any opinion that feeds your anti US xenophobia. I do not

face your · Feb 13, 2015

Re: U.S.: Putin's Peace Proposal for Ukraine is Nothing But 'Occupation Plan'

Montecresto said:
Western propaganda!

I provided the statistics at least 5 times by now, I suggest you take your Muscovite propaganda to the RT echo chamber, this is a website in a free nation and your lies get no play here.

face your · Feb 13, 2015

Re: U.S.: Putin's Peace Proposal for Ukraine is Nothing But 'Occupation Plan'

Montecresto said:
Everybody knows the difference between NATO and the European Union.

Apparently you do not sir.

Your false characterisation of Russia's negotiations with Ukraine diminish your argument. Ukraine applied and subsequently withdrew their application to join NATO.

You can blather on all you bloody want, the current situation started with Russia waging economic warfare on the Ukraine because they attempted to join into the EU association agreement, not NATO and no amount of your bull**** will change that undeniable fact. End of.

They negotiated with the EU and Russia on economic alliance and chose Russia in the end, that is where the West and face, your got their knickers in a knot. Deal with it because Russia drew their line.

No they did not join the laughable Customs Union consisting of Kazakhstan, Belarus and Russia, they chose the EU association agreement, and that is when Russia waged economic warfare against them but even then the majority of Ukrainians supported entrance into the EU and came out in mass to protest during Euromaidan. Once again the majority of Ukrainians supported both Euromaidan and entrance into the EU and you have once again already been provided with the numerous polls proving these undeniable facts.

Montecresto · Feb 14, 2015

Re: U.S.: Putin's Peace Proposal for Ukraine is Nothing But 'Occupation Plan'

face said:
I provided the statistics at least 5 times by now, I suggest you take your Muscovite propaganda to the RT echo chamber, this is a website in a free nation and your lies get no play here.

Sorry but you're a sneeze at DP, and haven't been around the echo chamber long enough to know whether or not the moon is blue, green or composed of cheese. Perhaps you might go to the hollow where your brethren dwell and take a nap.

Secretary of State Hillary Clinton said on Wednesday that Al Jazeera is gaining more prominence in the U.S. because it offers "real news" -- something she said American media were falling far short of doing.

face your · Feb 14, 2015

Re: U.S.: Putin's Peace Proposal for Ukraine is Nothing But 'Occupation Plan'

JP Cusick said:
Everything is an opinion,

No a fact is not an opinion it is a fact.
opinion
o·pin·ion
əˈpinyən/
noun
noun: opinion; plural noun: opinions

a view or judgment formed about something, not necessarily based on fact or knowledge.

https://www.google.com/?gws_rd=ssl#q=opinion+define

fact
fakt/
noun
noun: fact; plural noun: facts

a thing that is indisputably the case.

https://www.google.com/?gws_rd=ssl#q=fact+define

In a Court trial people give their testimony based on their belief and understanding and opinions and it is "evidence" and opinions have always been evidence and always will be.

Only expert opinions are admissible as evidence in a court of law and only when those opinions are based in scientific fact; such as, DNA evidence and fingerprint analysis, the assertion that opinion itself is the same as evidence is laughable in the extreme.

face your · Feb 14, 2015

Re: U.S.: Putin's Peace Proposal for Ukraine is Nothing But 'Occupation Plan'

Montecresto said:
Sorry but you're a sneeze at DP, and haven't been around the echo chamber long enough to know whether or not the moon is blue, green or composed of cheese. Perhaps you might go to the hollow where your brethren dwell and take a nap.

Secretary of State Hillary Clinton said on Wednesday that Al Jazeera is gaining more prominence in the U.S. because it offers "real news" -- something she said American media were falling far short of doing.

Well she's dumber than a box of rocks because Al Jazeera is a Qatari state owned propaganda mill directly funded and operated by the Wahhabist al-Thani royal family, if you disagree provide a single solitary article from Al Jazeera critical of the Qatari regime, and while you're at it sport provide a single solitary Russia Today article critical of Putin. I'll be waiting with baited breath. Furthermore; I'll reiiterate my point that EVERY SINGLE SOLITARY press freedom index on the planet lists the US press as free and fair and EVERY SINGLE SOLITARY press freedom index on the planet lists the Russian Federation's press as not free.

Rogue Valley · Feb 14, 2015

Re: U.S.: Putin's Peace Proposal for Ukraine is Nothing But 'Occupation Plan'

Montecresto said:
Secretary of State Hillary Clinton said on Wednesday that Al Jazeera is gaining more prominence in the U.S. because it offers "real news" -- something she said American media were falling far short of doing.

You still mangle facts.

Hillary Clinton is not the Secretary of State. That would be Kerry.

Montecresto · Feb 14, 2015

Re: U.S.: Putin's Peace Proposal for Ukraine is Nothing But 'Occupation Plan'

face said:
I provided the statistics at least 5 times by now, I suggest you take your Muscovite propaganda to the RT echo chamber, this is a website in a free nation and your lies get no play here.

No johhny come lately, websites are everywhere and anywhere. And do you believe your opinion is all that gets play anywhere, lol. A mighty high opinion you have of yourself.

Montecresto · Feb 14, 2015

Re: U.S.: Putin's Peace Proposal for Ukraine is Nothing But 'Occupation Plan'

Simpleχity;1064312026 said:
You still mangle facts.

Hillary Clinton is not the Secretary of State. That would be Kerry.

A bit dated article, you'd have noticed if you read, but then you don't care. Actually, you should watch, yes its available, the video of her testimony before congress on this subject. You might (should) be embarrassed about the American press.

Montecresto · Feb 14, 2015

Re: U.S.: Putin's Peace Proposal for Ukraine is Nothing But 'Occupation Plan'

face said:
Well she's dumber than a box of rocks because Al Jazeera is a Qatari state owned propaganda mill directly funded and operated by the Wahhabist al-Thani royal family, if you disagree provide a single solitary article from Al Jazeera critical of the Qatari regime, and while you're at it sport provide a single solitary Russia Today article critical of Putin. I'll be waiting with baited breath. Furthermore; I'll reiiterate my point that EVERY SINGLE SOLITARY press freedom index on the planet lists the US press as free and fair and EVERY SINGLE SOLITARY press freedom index on the planet lists the Russian Federation's press as not free.

Speaking of dumber than rocks.

Sietske22 · Feb 14, 2015

Re: U.S.: Putin's Peace Proposal for Ukraine is Nothing But 'Occupation Plan'

Montecresto said:
Sorry but you're a sneeze at DP, and haven't been around the echo chamber long enough to know whether or not the moon is blue, green or composed of cheese. Perhaps you might go to the hollow where your brethren dwell and take a nap.

Secretary of State Hillary Clinton said on Wednesday that Al Jazeera is gaining more prominence in the U.S. because it offers "real news" -- something she said American media were falling far short of doing.

Hillary hasn't been Secretary of State for years. You may need to update your cable subscription.

Montecresto · Feb 14, 2015

Re: U.S.: Putin's Peace Proposal for Ukraine is Nothing But 'Occupation Plan'

Sietske22 said:
Hillary hasn't been Secretary of State for years. You may need to update your cable subscription.

Ok, I think I spoke to that earlier, but sense you want to make a funny, I'll play along. As our once upon a time SoS, she testified before congress that American media is wanting, while international news is "informative" and that they are "winning the infowar". Might you actually speak to that, hmm?

Sietske22 · Feb 14, 2015

Re: U.S.: Putin's Peace Proposal for Ukraine is Nothing But 'Occupation Plan'

Montecresto said:
Ok, I think I spoke to that earlier, but sense you want to make a funny, I'll play along. As our once upon a time SoS, she testified before congress that American media is wanting, while international news is "informative" and that they are "winning the infowar". Might you actually speak to that, hmm?

Let me know when Hillary claims there are no Russia military personnel or artillery in Donbas.

Montecresto · Feb 14, 2015

Re: U.S.: Putin's Peace Proposal for Ukraine is Nothing But 'Occupation Plan'

Sietske22 said:
Let me know when Hillary claims there are no Russia military personnel or artillery in Donbas.

I doubt she would ever make such a claim. In fact, other then perhaps the Russians, I doubt anybody would be making such a claim. Now then, to the point of the post that you actually quoted...............?????????

Sietske22 · Feb 14, 2015

Re: U.S.: Putin's Peace Proposal for Ukraine is Nothing But 'Occupation Plan'

Montecresto said:
I doubt she would ever make such a claim. In fact, other then perhaps the Russians, I doubt anybody would be making such a claim. Now then, to the point of the post that you actually quoted...............?????????

She was probably refering to Fox News.

U.S.: Putin's Peace Proposal for Ukraine is Nothing But 'Occupation Plan' [W:479]

Montecresto

JP Cusick

The Expert

flogger

JP Cusick

The Expert

flogger

Quag

JP Cusick

The Expert

flogger

JP Cusick

The Expert

Montecresto

flogger

face your

face your

Montecresto

face your

face your

Rogue Valley

Lead or get out of the way

Montecresto

Montecresto

Montecresto

Sietske22

Montecresto

Sietske22

Montecresto

Sietske22