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Thread: U.S.: Putin's Peace Proposal for Ukraine is Nothing But 'Occupation Plan' [W:479]

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    Re: U.S.: Putin's Peace Proposal for Ukraine is Nothing But 'Occupation Plan'

    Quote Originally Posted by JP Cusick View Post
    Do you really view other people as so cowardly that they too would only attack the messenger while hiding away from the message?
    No I simply view you as a myopic anti US xenophobe who will clutch at any fantastical interpretation of events out there that you think will bolster your innate prejudices.

    I certainly hope that the other people are much bigger than that
    You certainly aren't in any position to judge given you've already freely admitted in the past to not knowing the difference between fact and opinion

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    Re: U.S.: Putin's Peace Proposal for Ukraine is Nothing But 'Occupation Plan'

    Quote Originally Posted by Simpleχity View Post
    Sorry pal. Even your beloved Sputnik says Russian representatives were there...


    The Voice of Russia
    Still no sign of those pesky Americans though

  3. #873
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    Re: U.S.: Putin's Peace Proposal for Ukraine is Nothing But 'Occupation Plan'

    Quote Originally Posted by Simpleχity View Post
    Sorry pal. Even your beloved Sputnik says Russian representatives were there...

    The Voice of Russia
    Well your first link claim did not include any Russian as you claimed.

    Now your second link here does not function.

    But aside from that - just because there was some Russian person in the room does NOT mean that there was any representative of the Russian government included.

    And our own President Obama admitted that the US “Brokered a Deal” in Support of “Regime Change” in the Ukraine in the first place.

    So I guess there was some Russian person in that room too - duh.
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    Re: U.S.: Putin's Peace Proposal for Ukraine is Nothing But 'Occupation Plan'

    Quote Originally Posted by JP Cusick View Post
    Well your first link claim did not include any Russian as you claimed.

    Now your second link here does not function.

    But aside from that - just because there was some Russian person in the room does NOT mean that there was any representative of the Russian government included.

    And our own President Obama admitted that the US “Brokered a Deal” in Support of “Regime Change” in the Ukraine in the first place.

    So I guess there was some Russian person in that room too - duh.
    The Russian person in the room was in fact Putins special envoy Vladimir Lukin the Russian commissioner for human rights. So not just any old Russian

    There was no US representative at these talks so how did the US feature in the 'brokering' ? Obama said 'we brokered a deal' (he did not specify the US) in reference to the collective efforts of the international community . I already posted a full list of the real international 'brokers' on post # 863 please note the absence of any American representative, not that that will make the slightest difference to you of course

    You will need to reboot your cherished US conspiracy theory using something else I'm afraid
    Last edited by flogger; 02-27-15 at 04:31 PM.

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    Re: U.S.: Putin's Peace Proposal for Ukraine is Nothing But 'Occupation Plan'

    Quote Originally Posted by flogger View Post
    The Russian person in the room was in fact Putins special envoy Vladimir Lukin the Russian commissioner for human rights. So not just any old Russian

    There was no US representative at these talks so how did the US feature in the 'brokering' ? Obama said 'we brokered a deal' (he did not specify the US) in reference to the collective efforts of the international community . I already posted a full list of the real international 'brokers' on post # 863 please note the absence of any American representative, not that that will make the slightest difference to you of course

    You will need to reboot your cherished US conspiracy theory using something else I'm afraid
    According to Wiki then the so-called Russian in the room of Vladimir Lukin - his term of office expired in March 2014.

    So MAYBE he was there even though there has been nothing that shows him to be there, but his position had expired which means that he was NOT representing the government of Russia.

    When no representative of the Russian government is present then it is a charade to claim that some Russian citizen was present.

    As always it is just more deception and untruths.

    And the statement by President Obama had NOTHING to do with your imaginary room as he said that the USA brokered the Ukrainian Presidential coup.

    Oh yes - that is the part that you keep trying to snake away from.
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    Re: U.S.: Putin's Peace Proposal for Ukraine is Nothing But 'Occupation Plan'

    then the so-called Russian in the room of Vladimir Lukin - his term of office expired in March 2014.So MAYBE he was there even though there has been nothing that shows him to be there, but his position had expired which means that he was NOT representing the government of Russia.When no representative of the Russian government is present then it is a charade to claim that some Russian citizen was present.
    As always it is just more deception and untruths.
    He wasn't a so called Russian nor was he retired (and isn't even now) when he was Putins special envoy at these negotiations when they took place on 21st Feb 2014. Here is the agreement please note the witnesses and signatories on page 3

    http://www.auswaertiges-amt.de/cae/s...Erklaerung.pdf

    And the statement by President Obama had NOTHING to do with your imaginary room as he said that the USA brokered the Ukrainian Presidential coup.
    Obama was referring to these very negotiations ! In your alternate Sputnik universe what other negotiations do you think he meant ?

    That imaginery room was very real and the agreement was made very public too. Here it is complete with negotiators none of whom were American

    http://www.npr.org/blogs/thetwo-way/...es-concessions

    _73141970_5983896c-b15c-47fd-8cc2-315a27a512a0.jpg

    Just how desperate are you !?
    Last edited by flogger; 02-27-15 at 05:40 PM.

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    Re: U.S.: Putin's Peace Proposal for Ukraine is Nothing But 'Occupation Plan'

    Quote Originally Posted by JP Cusick View Post
    I hope that you notice that I do not play it as their game is being played.

    As such I happily accept my "E for Effort" as it was hard earned.


    ==========================================



    Not Russia.

    And excluding Russia made the deal as offensive.


    ===========================================



    No, what I said was accurate and it is still true.

    Washington Was Behind Ukraine Coup: Obama admits that US “Brokered a Deal” in Support of “Regime Change” | Global Research

    As such all the hostility in the Ukraine which followed that was the after effects of the USA creation.
    Of course not. It was a compliment for putting up with the nonsense that you're refuting quite well.
    Killing one person is murder, killing 100,000 is foreign policy

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    Re: U.S.: Putin's Peace Proposal for Ukraine is Nothing But 'Occupation Plan'

    Quote Originally Posted by flogger View Post
    He wasn't a so called Russian nor was he retired (and isn't even now) when he was Putins special envoy at these negotiations when they took place on 21st Feb 2014. Here is the agreement please note the witnesses and signatories on page 3

    http://www.auswaertiges-amt.de/cae/s...Erklaerung.pdf
    So this means that you are the one who verifies the credentials of Russian officials - and it is another of your opinions pretending to be a fact when it is not a fact.

    Since we do know that the Russian Federation does not give credence to that document then that means the Russian actions (the reality) speaks much louder and clearer then your claims.

    The Russian government did not and still does not agree with your assessment - and rightfully NOT.

    Quote Originally Posted by flogger View Post
    Obama was referring to these very negotiations ! In your alternate Sputnik universe what other negotiations do you think he meant ?

    That imaginery room was very real and the agreement was made very public too. Here it is complete with negotiators none of whom were American

    Breakthrough? Ukrainian President, Opposition Leaders Reach Deal : The Two-Way : NPR

    Just how desperate are you !?
    This is all AFTER (after) the fact of the elected President of the Ukraine being deposed by the USA backed coup.

    You and American propaganda changes or ignores the true timeline as if the end justifies the beginning which it does not.
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  9. #879
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    Re: U.S.: Putin's Peace Proposal for Ukraine is Nothing But 'Occupation Plan'

    Quote Originally Posted by JP Cusick View Post
    So this means that you are the one who verifies the credentials of Russian officials - and it is another of your opinions pretending to be a fact when it is not a fact.
    Since we do know that the Russian Federation does not give credence to that document then that means the Russian actions (the reality) speaks much louder and clearer then your claims.
    But their envoy witnessed the signing of it along with those of France , Germany and Poland and is named in the actual agreement as having done so so how do you account for that ?

    The Russian government did not and still does not agree with your assessment - and rightfully NOT.
    I have no assessment I've merely presented you with the facts. Why are you having such difficulty accepting them ?

    This is all AFTER (after) the fact of the elected President of the Ukraine being deposed by the USA backed coup.
    No this agreement was signed before any coup. I know it must be difficult but try invoking common sense for a moment. How could Yanukovych be there in Kiev to sign it if it was afterwards ? That is him in the photographs

    You and American propaganda changes or ignores the true timeline as if the end justifies the beginning which it does not.
    Wow ! And what is the timeline in your alternate universe then ?
    Last edited by flogger; 02-27-15 at 08:55 PM.

  10. #880
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    Re: U.S.: Putin's Peace Proposal for Ukraine is Nothing But 'Occupation Plan'

    Quote Originally Posted by Montecresto View Post
    Of course not. It was a compliment for putting up with the nonsense that you're refuting quite well.
    Really ?

    I'd love to know just how much more ridiculous he would have to get in order in order for you to decide he wasn't then !!

    I'd have thought even you would have had the sense to distance yourself from this by now
    Last edited by flogger; 02-27-15 at 09:01 PM.

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