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Thread: U.S.: Putin's Peace Proposal for Ukraine is Nothing But 'Occupation Plan' [W:479]

  1. #411
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    Re: U.S.: Putin's Peace Proposal for Ukraine is Nothing But 'Occupation Plan'

    Quote Originally Posted by NIMBY View Post
    Since Obama has killed 50,000 Ukranians, right?
    Since yer ranting all over DEM Presidents heading back to FDR, don't you think you missed a few GOP criminals along the way.
    Ever hear of Iran-Contra?
    Or Iraq last decade?
    Both sides have ENCOURAGED such behavior that has lead to the deaths of whatever number you want to quote of Ukrainians, Russians, Polish, Croats, an American and another dozen or so nationalities who joined each side. IMF encouraged it when IMF said you control all of Ukraine or no soup for you. Reason for that is because the natural resources the IMF exploits (though a different debate) sits in Rebel controlled areas.

    Yes, Republicans are just as guilty as Democrats because they both become very anti-democratic and become the bane of peoples rights whenever it suits them. Rat bastards will support one tyrant towing their line, but toss another to the wolves and we end up with wolves who don't forget history and end up poking us (think Libya).
    Every normal man must be tempted at times to spit on his hands, hoist the black flag, and begin to slit throats. It is inaccurate to say that I hate everything. I am strongly in favor of common sense, common honesty, and common decency. This makes me forever ineligible for public office. H.L Mencken

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    Re: U.S.: Putin's Peace Proposal for Ukraine is Nothing But 'Occupation Plan'

    Quote Originally Posted by austrianecon View Post
    Both sides have ENCOURAGED such behavior that has lead to the deaths of whatever number you want to quote of Ukrainians, Russians, Polish, Croats, an American and another dozen or so nationalities who joined each side. IMF encouraged it when IMF said you control all of Ukraine or no soup for you. Reason for that is because the natural resources the IMF exploits (though a different debate) sits in Rebel controlled areas.

    Yes, Republicans are just as guilty as Democrats because they both become very anti-democratic and become the bane of peoples rights whenever it suits them. Rat bastards will support one tyrant towing their line, but toss another to the wolves and we end up with wolves who don't forget history and end up poking us (think Libya).
    The only guilty party in this scenario is the internationally recognized war criminal Putin, joining an economic association is not Casus Belli to illegally invade, occupy, annex, and ethnically cleanse the territory of your neighbors.

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    Re: U.S.: Putin's Peace Proposal for Ukraine is Nothing But 'Occupation Plan'

    Quote Originally Posted by austrianecon View Post
    Then you haven't read up on LBJ or FDR who both PURPOSELY started wars for their own gains and against public support. FDR decided to piss off the Japanese knowing damn well that would = Pearl Harbor or Wake Island.
    A trade embargo in response to Japanese invasions, annexations, and atrocities in Manchuria, China, and Indo-China was not Casus Belli for the Pearl Harbor attacks.

    LBJ lied about Gulf of Tonkin.
    There was one attack on U.S. ships in the Gulf of Tonkin, the second attack was in actuality ghost radar signals.

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    Re: U.S.: Putin's Peace Proposal for Ukraine is Nothing But 'Occupation Plan'

    Quote Originally Posted by austrianecon View Post
    Ukraine wasn't united. There has always been (in this case 23 years) of differences between Western and Eastern Ukraine.
    There are differences between the Southern and Northern states of America that doesn't mean we aren't a United country, the Ukraine was an internationally recognized sovereign state and that includes the Crimea, the overwhelming majority of Ukrainians are ethnically Ukrainian not Russian, 38 million vs. 8.5 million.

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    Re: U.S.: Putin's Peace Proposal for Ukraine is Nothing But 'Occupation Plan'

    Quote Originally Posted by NIMBY View Post
    Those tens of thousands of merchant seaman who were sunk by Hitler would beg to differ with you.
    You know, the Nazis allied with Japan.
    How long would you have allowed the Japanese to expand without cutting off their oil?
    You mean the merchant marines who were considered by laws of the sea as targets because the US Government used them to ship weapons and supplies to the UK before 1941? Never mind the fact the US proclaimed neutrality but ended up give lend lease and cash carry deals to Soviet Union, China, UK and France.

    US didn't just cut off the "oil". A memo was drafted called the McCollum Memo, it is 8 points on how the US could provoke Japan into attacking the US.
    Every normal man must be tempted at times to spit on his hands, hoist the black flag, and begin to slit throats. It is inaccurate to say that I hate everything. I am strongly in favor of common sense, common honesty, and common decency. This makes me forever ineligible for public office. H.L Mencken

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    Re: U.S.: Putin's Peace Proposal for Ukraine is Nothing But 'Occupation Plan'

    Quote Originally Posted by austrianecon View Post
    So why can't they support DNR and LNR's right to bugger off from the **** hole called Ukraine?
    `Russia can annex Eastern Ukraine in overt violation of the UN Charter, the Geneva Conventions, and decades of international case law as soon as China can annex Eastern Russia.

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    Re: U.S.: Putin's Peace Proposal for Ukraine is Nothing But 'Occupation Plan'

    Quote Originally Posted by austrianecon View Post
    You mean the merchant marines who were considered by laws of the sea as targets because the US Government used them to ship weapons and supplies to the UK before 1941? Never mind the fact the US proclaimed neutrality but ended up give lend lease and cash carry deals to Soviet Union, China, UK and France.
    Engaging in free trade is not a violation of neutrality, unrestricted submarine warfare in the North Atlantic on the other hand was an overt violation of the laws of the seas.

    US didn't just cut off the "oil". A memo was drafted called the McCollum Memo, it is 8 points on how the US could provoke Japan into attacking the US.
    The McCollum memo contained an eight-part plan to counter rising Japanese power over East Asia:

    A. Make an arrangement with Britain for the use of British bases in the Pacific, particularly Singapore
    B. Make an arrangement with Holland for the use of base facilities and acquisition of supplies in the Dutch East Indies
    C. Give all possible aid to the Chinese government of Chiang-Kai-Shek
    D. Send a division of long range heavy cruisers to the Orient, Philippines, or Singapore
    E. Send two divisions of submarines to the Orient
    F. Keep the main strength of the U.S. fleet now in the Pacific[,] in the vicinity of the Hawaiian Islands
    G. Insist that the Dutch refuse to grant Japanese demands for undue economic concessions, particularly oil
    H. Completely embargo all U.S. trade with Japan, in collaboration with a similar embargo imposed by the British Empire


    McCollum memo - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

    None of which was Casus Belli for the attack on Pearl Harbor.

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    Re: U.S.: Putin's Peace Proposal for Ukraine is Nothing But 'Occupation Plan'

    Quote Originally Posted by flogger View Post
    There are differences between England Wales Scotland and Northern Ireland but we are still called the United Kingdom nonetheless
    Seriously? There was just a vote in Scotland last November about Scottish Independence. 45% (1.6 million) of the Scottish population voted to leave the UK. Then let's not forget about the never ending issues in Northern Ireland in which has even a longer history which includes ideas such as Home Rule, demands for separate Kingdoms by guys like Daniel O' Connell who called for the end of the Acts of the Union (1800) during the Catholic emancipation movement in the UK.

    Yes, you are called the United Kingdom but you aren't that "united". Devolution has taken place in Scotland, Northern Ireland, Wales and even England with the Greater London Authority. Even Winston Churchill supported the idea of giving England it's own Parliament or dividing into regional parliaments and Royal Commissions have been set up over the issues as well. Hell even Cornwall is getting into the game and Labour has made some big promises to them.

    You know what the leaves the UK as? An economic union with a federal system and autonomy.
    Every normal man must be tempted at times to spit on his hands, hoist the black flag, and begin to slit throats. It is inaccurate to say that I hate everything. I am strongly in favor of common sense, common honesty, and common decency. This makes me forever ineligible for public office. H.L Mencken

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    Re: U.S.: Putin's Peace Proposal for Ukraine is Nothing But 'Occupation Plan'

    Quote Originally Posted by Simpleχity View Post
    Did you look at the 2014 Election map of Ukraine? You can view it below...

    LOL.. yeah... turn out was what in Eastern Ukraine?
    Every normal man must be tempted at times to spit on his hands, hoist the black flag, and begin to slit throats. It is inaccurate to say that I hate everything. I am strongly in favor of common sense, common honesty, and common decency. This makes me forever ineligible for public office. H.L Mencken

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    Re: U.S.: Putin's Peace Proposal for Ukraine is Nothing But 'Occupation Plan'

    Quote Originally Posted by Roadvirus View Post
    Obama and NATO hasn't done what Putin has done in Ukraine.
    No, they just do it to Muslim countries.
    Every normal man must be tempted at times to spit on his hands, hoist the black flag, and begin to slit throats. It is inaccurate to say that I hate everything. I am strongly in favor of common sense, common honesty, and common decency. This makes me forever ineligible for public office. H.L Mencken

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