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Thread: U.S.: Putin's Peace Proposal for Ukraine is Nothing But 'Occupation Plan' [W:479]

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    Re: U.S.: Putin's Peace Proposal for Ukraine is Nothing But 'Occupation Plan'

    Quote Originally Posted by flogger View Post
    I've been all over the Ukraine my friend (even the east) and the great bulk of people there regarded their national sovereignty and right to self determination as rather more than just some 'facade'.
    So why can't they support DNR and LNR's right to bugger off from the **** hole called Ukraine?
    Every normal man must be tempted at times to spit on his hands, hoist the black flag, and begin to slit throats. It is inaccurate to say that I hate everything. I am strongly in favor of common sense, common honesty, and common decency. This makes me forever ineligible for public office. H.L Mencken

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    Re: U.S.: Putin's Peace Proposal for Ukraine is Nothing But 'Occupation Plan'

    Quote Originally Posted by flogger View Post
    As you were shown earlier I seriously doubt that any US administration has ever been quite as sinister or corrupt as the one currently occupying the Kremlin
    Then you haven't read up on LBJ or FDR who both PURPOSELY started wars for their own gains and against public support. FDR decided to piss off the Japanese knowing damn well that would = Pearl Harbor or Wake Island. LBJ lied about Gulf of Tonkin.
    Every normal man must be tempted at times to spit on his hands, hoist the black flag, and begin to slit throats. It is inaccurate to say that I hate everything. I am strongly in favor of common sense, common honesty, and common decency. This makes me forever ineligible for public office. H.L Mencken

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    Re: U.S.: Putin's Peace Proposal for Ukraine is Nothing But 'Occupation Plan'

    Since Obama has killed 50,000 Ukranians, right?
    Since yer ranting all over DEM Presidents heading back to FDR, don't you think you missed a few GOP criminals along the way.
    Ever hear of Iran-Contra?
    Or Iraq last decade?

    Quote Originally Posted by austrianecon View Post
    Obama is a war criminal too if Putin is one. So is half of Nato.
    Physics is Phun

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    Re: U.S.: Putin's Peace Proposal for Ukraine is Nothing But 'Occupation Plan'

    Those tens of thousands of merchant seaman who were sunk by Hitler would beg to differ with you.
    You know, the Nazis allied with Japan.
    How long would you have allowed the Japanese to expand without cutting off their oil?

    Good thing FDR was able to overcome the traitors in the GOP who were aligned with the Nazis in the 1930s.
    Such as Sen. Prescott Bush--GWB's grandfather .

    Quote Originally Posted by austrianecon View Post
    Then you haven't read up on LBJ or FDR who both PURPOSELY started wars for their own gains and against public support. FDR decided to piss off the Japanese knowing damn well that would = Pearl Harbor or Wake Island. LBJ lied about Gulf of Tonkin.
    Physics is Phun

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    Re: U.S.: Putin's Peace Proposal for Ukraine is Nothing But 'Occupation Plan'

    Quote Originally Posted by Montecresto View Post
    Self determination doesn't always deliver what you like.
    You mean Ukrainian self determination doesn't deliver what YOU like

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    Re: U.S.: Putin's Peace Proposal for Ukraine is Nothing But 'Occupation Plan'

    Quote Originally Posted by austrianecon View Post
    Ukraine wasn't united. There has always been (in this case 23 years) of differences between Western and Eastern Ukraine.
    There are differences between England Wales Scotland and Northern Ireland but we are still called the United Kingdom nonetheless

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    Re: U.S.: Putin's Peace Proposal for Ukraine is Nothing But 'Occupation Plan'

    Quote Originally Posted by austrianecon View Post
    Did you look at the 2010 Election map of Ukraine. You can view it here.

    Luhansk, Donetsk, Zaporizhia, Kherson, Crimea, Odessa,Kharkiv and MyKolaiv all voted 50% or greater for the "pro-Russian" vs the "Pro-West" candidate. These are also areas in which 30% plus of the population states Russian as their native language. Crimea, Donetsk and Luhansk it's well over 70%. Then on top of that here is a map of support for Russian being a recognized official "federal" language.

    So your theory is bunk just on these facts alone. These areas were already heavily Russian in terms of language, culture and identity.
    Its what happened after that election that brought his downfall.

    1. Locking up opposition leaders
    2. Sequestering an estimated $100 billion in state funds
    3. Doing a complete U turn on EU membership which was the platform on which he secured that election victory then cuddling up to Russia
    4. Clinging on to power once even his own cabinet members had abandoned him

    I'm surprised he lasted as long as he did frankly

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    Re: U.S.: Putin's Peace Proposal for Ukraine is Nothing But 'Occupation Plan'

    Quote Originally Posted by austrianecon View Post
    So why can't they support DNR and LNR's right to bugger off from the **** hole called Ukraine?
    They can bugger off any time they like. The border isn't that far away and theres just over 1.5 million of them. Russia has the space after all. I have no interest in seeing a minority prevail over the majority (which the ethnic Russians certainly represent in Donetsk and Luhansk). Why do you ?

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    Re: U.S.: Putin's Peace Proposal for Ukraine is Nothing But 'Occupation Plan'

    Quote Originally Posted by austrianecon View Post
    Then you haven't read up on LBJ or FDR who both PURPOSELY started wars for their own gains and against public support. FDR decided to piss off the Japanese knowing damn well that would = Pearl Harbor or Wake Island. LBJ lied about Gulf of Tonkin.
    They also introduced the New Deal ,the Great Society and the Civil rights bill. Something not exactly mirrored in Putins Russia !

    Blaming FDRs sanctions for Japans misdemeanours is quite laughable revisionism frankly
    Last edited by flogger; 02-11-15 at 06:03 AM.

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    Re: U.S.: Putin's Peace Proposal for Ukraine is Nothing But 'Occupation Plan'

    Quote Originally Posted by austrianecon View Post
    Then you haven't read up on LBJ or FDR who both PURPOSELY started wars for their own gains and against public support. FDR decided to piss off the Japanese knowing damn well that would = Pearl Harbor or Wake Island. LBJ lied about Gulf of Tonkin.
    More off topic fiction about FDR starting wars.

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